The original Kearsney Easter Festival fixture list had Selborne and Glenwood matched up to play on Day-3, Monday, 06 April 2015. Selborne subsequently held a meeting Friday, 12 September 2014 and a decision was made on Monday, 15 September not to honour the Glenwood fixture.
Selborne is not known for making decisions of this nature but it seems like the East London school who have suffered as a result of their players being targeted recruits and who have taken a lead in the campaign to bring recruitment activities under control, has had enough and so put their foot down.
@Black and white: Please Trevor – do not lower us to Glenwood’s level – how can we complain when we do the same things ?
@McCulleys Workshop: spot on agree with you. That is why I’ll do my best to send my daughter to a private school, but nothing like R200k a year private…
@Grasshopper: Thanks Hopper, so the truth is everyone has a story, unique, some from less fortunate financial backgrounds, some from financially privileged backgrounds, but none more or less deserving, just recipients of parents generosity, most trying to do the best they could. Some lazy laggards at all schools, some making the best they could with the hand they were dealt, regardless of school or wealth. No point in attacking those more privileged than ourselves, or criticizing those less fortunate than ourselves, because none of it was our doing, but the circumstances that our parents were in.
@Green Hopper: agree with you. I live in the estate next to Trinityhouse, what a lovely little school. Great facilities and awesome teachers. What it lacks is kids! They have about 10 per year max. The plans are big though, full 500 kid plus co-Ed school. I like that for primary school but prefer single sex at high school. My daughter is only 2, so we have time to see how things go….hopefully a girls high school pops up somewhere or it might have to be Northlands Girls for us…
@Gungets Tuft: thanks the lecture, you haven’t a clue what sort of grind I had as a kid growing up on the Bluff with a mentally ill mother who took her own life when I was 10, my personal health issues etc….so best before you advise me of how to feel or think to find out the facts. Oh yes, was also born dextra cardia, had a huge op aged 7 that took me out of school for 6 months, but I still made KZN schools swimming & D&D cricket in std5. Was Dux & Head prefect of my primary school. I had it tough boet, no dad around for 5 years whilst he worked looking after a younger sister…..chose the wrong druggie surfer mates at High school…..the list goes on. Apologies if I don’t like guys who get it given all on a silver platter…..
@Rugger fan: ok, i agree, but the Curro , i was referring to was the new one in Salt Rock, right across the road , form my house, it opened last year, and offers , imho, a better balanced school life that the Crawford North Coast or Ashton College. Bothe these schools have been around for more than 10 years now, but still fail to bring or compete at the levels of GW , DHS College etc,
why you might ask, well its the tradition and this, this new approach to how schools are run, the capital cost of setting up and establishing these schools is expensive, they all and I mean all say its about the education, and they infer and imply and tell parents that the education is at a far higher level . but when you look at the track record of the schools the quality of teachers , it might surprise one, especially at Ashton , remember it’s a business , its about bums in seats , pupil numbers, so here is the example , and I did this calculation about three years back when I was considering taking my daughter , who was an ashton college student , to Marius Stella in Durban , it was costing r6000.00 per month just to go to school, then all the sport activities etc where additional, as they didn’t offer the activities as they did in Marias stella , buy the time I had done the full and detailed calculation , it was cheaper to send her there than Ashton in addition you had the school completing at a higher level , as well as kids had proper class rooms rather that the temp wooden huts they had at ashton. It was a no brainer on where she was going
like you have said , in 2o years these schools, might be there, things are changing dramatically in SA and ultimately so will the schooling system, however our kids need the education now, they need the experience of school, sport participation now, in 20 years’ time, these decisions will be theirs and not ours
@GreenBlooded: i think that it’s the boys natural instinct to go and play as hard as they can if they are dropped, they are confused as to why it happened and the reasoning behind it , but it build animosity and isn’t healthy , resentment builds, but I would task you to speak to any grade 11 and 12 boys and I can assure you that “happiness” factors isn’t as prominent as you might hope for , very tarnished and blunted , by the actions of the staff and coaches. It isn’t a fair playing ground “flied” as it might have been in your day ,
Then it was if you didn’t play well , you got dropped, it wasn’t a case of played my guts out consistently and I played well, and next week, I get dropped because the coach and school, I have been playing for decided to buy a player in, ultimately and subconsciously tell me they diont have faith in me or my commitment to the school.
Remember these are growing boys who cant mentally complete and reason at the level these “teacher” are , they aren’t into the personal social skills the teachers are at not the politics, the reason simply and think simply , they wont articulate the subversive angles that the coaches are playing at.
What results from this is a very distorted approach to life and its being taught to them by the teachers , that forget loyalty and commitment , just buy something to fix a problem, and this tarnished the boys more that you think, ask and speak to the boys that have left GW over the last 5 years and the majority of them aren’t as “proud” of the school as the likes of you guys when things were fair or fairer
@Grasshopper: Boet – I suggest you just chill about life in general, but most especially about privilege, the lack of it, and success either with or without it. You should listen to a chap by the name of Tim Minchin, I have posted the link before, but seriously – go and listen.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NyBvbot3emM
But in the likely event that you won’t bother, or that you will cherry pick something from it that suits the way you prefer to view the world, here’s a transcript of the part I think might apply …
“3. Remember, It’s All Luck.
You are lucky to be here. You were incalculably lucky to be born, and incredibly lucky to be brought up by a nice family that helped you get educated and encouraged you to go to Uni. Or if you were born into a horrible family, that’s unlucky and you have my sympathy… but you were still lucky: lucky that you happened to be made of the sort of DNA that made the sort of brain which – when placed in a horrible childhood environment – would make decisions that meant you ended up, eventually, graduating Uni. Well done you, for dragging yourself up by the shoelaces, but you were lucky. You didn’t create the bit of you that dragged you up. They’re not even your shoelaces.
I suppose I worked hard to achieve whatever dubious achievements I’ve achieved … but I didn’t make the bit of me that works hard, any more than I made the bit of me that ate too many burgers instead of going to lectures while I was here at UWA.
Understanding that you can’t truly take credit for your successes, nor truly blame others for their failures will humble you and make you more compassionate.
Empathy is intuitive, but is also something you can work on, intellectually.”
By that I mean … it is quite likely that the way you view education at House, Hilton or Kearsney vs Glenwood (Northwood, College, or Westville where you ironically also have a go about money), is viewed identically by the kid that graduated from Mzuvele Secondary School. Your life has hardly been a grind, or a fight against the odds, so why begrudge the House and Hilton boys a little comfortable country life – somewhere, someone worked for that money …
There – my soapbox session of 2014. I feel exhausted.
@Grasshopper: Don’t blame us because your parents couldn’t afford it, just enjoy the fact that you went to Glenwood.
@Gungets Tuft: No chips at all, in fact my shoulders are very clear. I am successful without the fancy pants education, just believe in hard work gets what you want not where you went to school……
@Grasshopper: Be careful not to drop either of those chips, it will put you right off balance …
@Far Meadows: OK so MHS is R192k plus a 24k non refundable acceptance fee, this excludes sports tours, uniform, cultural tours, overseas tours etc, so it will add up to over R250k a year, but it’s semantics. My wife went to Durban Girls College so not against private education, I just don’t see it providing 6 times better education or sporting. I good gov High School like Westville Girls, Glenwood, Westville, College etc at R30k per annum is really good value for money in my opinion. What do people with say 3 boys do, pay R750k per annum. I mean that is super wealthy league and to be honest that is not the real world. If daddy is going to give them a job at the family business then fine but if they have to make it themselves I would prefer they actually mix with the average people out there, learn things don’t come on a silver platter and that life is hard. It build character. Just checked, Hilton fees are R209k! In terms of academics, what the privates do is have an entry exam to filter out the average academics, so a high level is a minimum expected. In fact 3 A’s per pupil seems a little average considering this…..
@CRC: College has a form that very Boarder parent signs, not sure about dayboys, agreeing to testing and sanction. But as Greenblooded points out, if a legal challenge comes, and it’s amazing that they do, then that agreement is worthless. However, neither the law not the constitution compels a school to put an offender back into a team, much less a top team. In fact doing so is tacit approval, so it’s just as easy for a school to be “relieved” about a successful challenge and undermine the lip service they pay to the laws. Oh, the tangled webs we weave ….
@GreenBlooded: Now is the time to test.
This testing at Craven week ( and then the same kids gets tested over and over ) is a total waste of time.
The boys are not even afraid to talk about it in schools these days.
I believe we will be surprised at the hit rate if only the current top ten schools are tested.
Some schools are taking drug testing seriously. I am sure it is not only Hilton, but Hilton embarked on a serious information sharing/consultative exercise and then produced a “policy on illegal drugs” (including steroids) and then had each parent sign a consent to testing which said that the parent had discussed the drugs policy with their son/s and “acknowledged, understood and support(ed) the school’s position on illegal drugs”. In those circumstances it would be quite difficult for a boy or his parents to then object to testing, the results of any tests or any sanction that might follow any result.
@GreenBlooded: The kids don’t always win – remember that StCharles College stuck to their guns last year on the cricket field.
So it cuts both ways – but it is not an easy and clear cut solution. It will open many cans of worms I’m sure.
@Grasshopper:
You have the wrong figure for the fees by almost 50k a year , but any way , when you are paying just over 190k a year in fees you obviously do expect a certain level of teaching , coaching etc. but one thing is certain MHS don’t market themselves as a ‘sports academy’ let alone a ‘rugby school’. With all the sports coaching being done by the academic staff and interns.
No-one denies that good sport results can be used as a marketing tool , saying that, last year’s rugby results weren’t stellar by any means yet demand for places at MHS is still as high as ever.
Academics are probably the top priority of any fee paying parents, and rightly so ( 2013 IEB matric results – 107 canditates wrote the exams and achieved 302 distinctions between them ).
Regarding this last week’s results , there were no u16 fixtures as the whole C Block ( grade 10 ) were on their annual ‘outdoor journey’ ( cycling, hiking and canoeing in the ‘Berg ) which lasts about two weeks.
@Gungets Tuft: I recall the nose-ring incident at Durban Girls High School a few years back where a parent signed the school code of conduct and dress code and then set about being defiant once inside the fence – hauling the school to the highest court in the land where the ‘rights of the child’ trumped common sense and common decency. I foresee a similar situation unfolding on this one. As noted already – very often the only test required is a set of eyeballs and some common sense. A kid who packs on 10kg of meat over a few months in the off season is not normal. Another reason that the function should be taken out of the parents and schools hands, besides to circumvent precisely the conflict of interests alluded to by @Pedantic: , is so that a uniform set of sanctions get applied across the board/
@Gungets Tuft: Refusal to allow tests at any of the national weeks results in the player being excluded – no legal challenges there.
Schools should do the same, but keep in mind, they risk losing their talented commodities for a season so there is no way they will push for it unless they are committed to the cause and see the other schools doing the same.
I agree with your earlier post … this issue should be taken out of the hands of schools and parents and dealt with directly by SAIDS … and please please please give us a SAIDS hotline … it’s pretty easy to identify boys you’ve watched for years who all of a sudden look very different – obviously we will get some false positives, but I reckon we would get at least a 50% hitrate.
@GreenBlooded: I think that refusal to allow tests is perfect grounds to exclude the boy, I don’t think there will be a possible legal challenge there. A responsible school will exclude a pupil from the school unless they give permission to random tests for illegal substances, be these PEDs, steroids, recreational drugs (who can up with that name??? .. makes it sound like chemical scrabble
). It’s the law, it just needs to be done properly. Parents need to realise it’s in the best interests of the boy and not run to the lawyers to overturn a result. But, money talks, or in the case of schools, the lack of it buys silence …
@Redblack White:
Similar to what I always say – anything further up the N3 than Ladysmith can be refered to as Joburg.
@Gungets Tuft: The problem is this: what happens if the parents do not give permission for the testing (why wouldn’t they if they are not complicit)? Is it okay to then preclude that lighty from playing? Somehow I don’t think that will wash with our liberal constitution. Or if the parent does give permission and then withdraws it after noticing that Johnny is getting a little bit larger than he should be on the peanut butter sarmies? I think the kids rights will always trump everything which means we don’t have an easy solution here.
Once again – a far bigger issue and I believe far more widespread than the ‘recuitment / poaching’ debate but maybe I’m just deflecting…….
@Roger: If you are looking for a quality school on the North Coast, you have to at least look for a Grogper Cup participant.
North is anywhere above South on a map, and with the melting polar caps, the coastline of the future is more inland.
Hence – look no further than PMB and welcome to Maritzburg College
@GreenBlooded: They need to relook the whole process, from the parents giving the authority to test, the process for testing, the custody of the tests samples and the publishing of the test results. My information is that the last lot of testing failed because the process was challenged and would apparently not stand up in court, which was the threat. Well heeled parents will then throw money at the case and most schools will simply buckle because they don’t have the money (or the intestinal fortitude) to pursue.
Maybe that too needs to be taken out of the hands of the school – that it is financed by SAIDS or WADA, with the national sports bodies contributing financially to make it happen.
@Green Hopper: Agree totally. The PED issue at schools is a FAR greater problem than recruitment and far more widely spread but what does all the debate focus on? And why? Hearing stories already of okes that have packed on 10kg since the end of rugby season – how does that happen?? There needs to be an independent authority which looks at this – tests kids all year round and parents and schools must buy in to the whole process. Don’t want to get kakked out again – but schools and parents have proven to be the biggest hurdle with stemming the flow so it needs to be taken out of their hands.
@Gungets Tuft:
@Bateleur:
Menlo has been awarding bursaries since very very long ago. However, more recently they turned towards negative marketing, namely belittling other schools (Waterkloof, Affies and Garsies). And if it does not work, they offer cellphones, tablets etc. to the moms and dads.
They had a full Craven week team at u.14 level this year, but still managed to lose twice against Garsies with no Craven week player (which shows the quality of Craven week players and level of coaching) and only just won against Waterkloof.
Their u.15 and u.16’s also consist of full Craven week squads, whilst their first team was beefed up with players from Monnas.
And yes, they were successful in landing the bulk of the Blue Bulls u.13 Craven week team for 2015. Not that it counts much, as the Bulls selectors managed to choose a very week team that lost almost every game.
@Green Hopper: Regarding your comments about the new schools – I can give some insights on the new CURRO school up in Hillcrest. They have concentrated where they need to as a school – ACADEMICS – and have built a brilliant core of teachers there bringing awesome results from the kids. Still only 2 grades (8 & 9) with Grade 10 in 2015 -growing with their current “seniors” to grade 12 in 2017.
Sports wise – they have tried to play across the board with all sports being offered – cricket, hockey, water polo, rugby (7s and Xvs), soccer, swimming and athletics. Have also been very big on cultural side.
Regarding rugby (sport) – their biggest challenge has been picking up fixtures against schools (any schools) as the lists are pretty full well in advance.
Their 7s rugby at junior level has been awesome – so much so that in their first year – they only lost to a full Westville U14a by a single unconverted try in a 7s match. Curro also has a very good regional and national 7s structure internally offering the boys some good exposure and competition in April and July tournaments. On XVs – they blow hot and cold – managing to thrash Grovsenor – but then getting a whipping from Weston while holding Hillcrest High to a close contest. The numbers are not there – so a lot of U14 boys playing in the U15s (only one team fielded at XVs). They have also brought in a very capable external coach (Jacques van Heerden) who is a solid citizen. Wayne Fyvie and Albert vd Bergh are parents who also give limited inputs into the team.
So agree – they are a long way from being a 1st (or even 2nd) tier school in KZN – but they have the potential to be a top 7s school at U18 level as the boys would have had 5 years of excellent experience by Gr12. A school to watch – but unfortunately likely to be another Kloof/Hillcrest that will just feed their stars to the more established schools. But in 20 years time ??????
@beet: i don’t know the particular issue you speak about , but if it is the issue about “drugs” and not steroids at GW , well it is the case that boys were found with recreational drugs at the GW BE, some suspended and now at Crawford North Coast and others up in JHB,
by i caution here, as this is rampant in all school, from Hilton down to Ashton College, its a case of 16 years being allowed into night clubs and allowed to be drinking like adults , what do you expect , too much too soon, no boundaries etc .
as for the steroids, come guys, its happening , its more prevalent than we talk about here, the coaches know its going on , even at Kearsney , recent players that left there, last year , where into it , College players, who left two years ago , were on it . GW players have been on it ,
its how the attention is attracted, when everyone is watching you like College , GW and Westville, one trip and it’s a massive collapse, I just think Westville, because of its separated facilities and more home environment , just don’t seem to be focussed on as much ,
I wouldn’t be rushing out to the Ballito Salt Rock area, any time soon , hoping for a good rugby or sporting school, in fact even at an educational level, things are not what the might appear , all polished up etc, good marketing ,
The Curro school, has the most going for it presently, but it still has a good 10 years before one can make any real meaningful assessment. Also these school, simply don’t compete against the Durban schools,
I remember watching in 2012 Crawford north coast bringing the 1st team and they played the u16c side, there were two boys I thing that had done grade 8 at GW , in the Crawford team, and the game got stopped early on the “cabbage patch” early . So in real terms , they won’t be competitive for a very very long time. Ashton College, were only playing 10 man rugby till a year or so ago, and still battle to get 25 boys to training , next year is the first that they have 4 senior classes, and remember its coed, the headmaster is an absolute wimp and all talk,
Trinity college , is still only up to grade 10 , I think , so , don’t look as this being the place for the next 10 od years ,
As for a government school, it won’t happen, simply the area is considered as “self-sufficient” and that a need for a school, in this area isn’t required, government wont spend money here,
@Grasshopper: you are always banging on about the cost of attending Hilton, Michaelhouse etc. Perhaps you should look at it from the flip side – what it costs to run those schools. I shudder to think of the maintenance cost of those campuses plus the salary bill – that alone probably comes to R220k per pupil – very little fat in there I can tell you.
@Far Meadows: where are the Under16 cricket results? http://www.glenwoodhighschool.co.za/sites/default/files/Results%20vs%20MHS%20Sept%202014.pdf
@Far Meadows: Michaelhouse is a high performance academy, look at the fees! R240k per annum, if you don’t get decent coaches and physio’s etc then I would ask for your money back. Yes, Michaelhouse did very well indeed. Basketball is getting closer each year, well done Glenwood. Your 1st cricket side must be pretty good as the Glenwood side is decent, although missing our SA Schools/SA under 19/Dolphins player. We certainly won’t be withdrawing from fixtures because we lost ;-)
@Djou @ Gungets Tuft: Interesting what you’re saying as I also heard via the grapevine that basically the whole u13 Blue Bulls Craven week team is going to Menlo? Not sure if it is true though.
@GreenBlooded: Maybe not so out of character but probably better to just ignore me today. I might have misinterpreted your intention and need to relax a bit.
But I am very irritated that after all this time, your version is all we have to go on around here.
I learned with a few years back that I can never do any of the drug stories proper justice because they are so sensitive however with this one element of one story that I would really like to post. That is the part about how it’s possible to conduct tests, arrive at a positives results and then have them disregarded because parents challenge the decisions. I don’t know that that’s exactly how it happened but my feeling is that many people can learn something from a blog like that (if it true and the facts can be presented).
@Rugger fan: absolutely – you have the Houghton Ridge and the Wilds across the road from KES and St Johns where homes start at R10 million and then at the rear of the respective schools is Yeoville!
UK is the same – million pound homes next door to council estates!
I know this a rugby blog, but some great wins at Glenwood this weekend by the Michaelhouse cricket , basketball and water-polo teams and to think that ‘House doesn’t even have a ‘High Performance Academy’ .
@Roger: My offices are across the road from DHS in Musgrave – not such a flash area – down towards Clifton (Morningside) it’s still ok – but a very strange set up with great houses and properties with upmarket business – right next to some pretty run down parks and homes…… I suppose a fairly “normal” situation in Urban SA today (just think of the area around KES/St Johns too
@beet: Boet – that was bizzare!! Never seen you get personal with someone like that before – I have to wonder how this (@GreenBlooded: ) provoked such an out of character reaction. Power trip? Intimidating? Threatening? Boet – you are going to have to explain that to me really slowly.
@kosie: 100%. Hard not to link their sudden surge in import activity with his arrival, which is why I asked the question earlier, given that Glenwood (where he was before Menlo) had a similar issue. All purely coincidental of course, sometimes stuff like this just follows you ..
@GreenBlooded: No I’m not saying you targeted me specifically but I believe that your selective info approach is designed to provoke rather than just convey a concern. And there seem to be enough hints in there that you know about something that others want to cover up. You’ve cast yourself into a position of power maybe?
@Roger: Hillcrest is Greenblooded’s domain, nice area and good schools, cooler weather. Plenty of schools up this end now, Curro, Trinityhouse, Ashton College, Umhlanga College and more to come. All are building the years up slowly until they have a full school. I would love a big Gov high school up this way, satellite Glenwood or DHS of types…..
Eina – College U15 just got a 14-2 hiding from Clifton in the opening match of the Wynberg Tourney……..
@beet: There is nothing in that rant that makes one iota of sense to me. Why would you think I’m trying to have an effect on you? Threatening you??? Intimidating you??? You’ve got to be kidding. When did I do that?
@Grasshopper: north coast is great – just nowhere to send your kids to school – or am I wrong? I know there is a Crawford in La Lucia and some school (Seaforth I think) in Balito – but what else? I’ve always like Kloof, Assegay and Hillcrest – good schools up that way too.
@Grasshopper: Not quite as dodgy as you think, you can’t name me a town or area that hasn’t had a shooting incident in the last couple of years. The area around Maris Stella and DGC is still a great place to live. Gordon Road, Venice area still really solid. Some fancy houses there, in the R10 million range, close to town, still somewhat leafy as well ..
Below Stamford Hill to Umgeni – not a place I would invest.
North of the N3 – it’s not great any more, the “cleanup” in the Point Area (to enhance Mikie Sucklips’ investment) has driven a lot of the immigrants to the lower Umbilo area, Queesburgh Mall etc, so not sure you want to buy property there either.
@Roger: Ballito is where it’s at, half of Jozi is here too now. Hillcrest isn’t too bad, just a little throttled with Fields Hill etc. Cotswold Downs in Hillcrest is very nice. Up my way there are about 10 large estates that are booming…
@GreenBlooded: Ja you probably have scratched a nerve
But I don’t think you’re quite having the desired effect on me. Maybe on others tho. I don’t feel threatened or intimidated by anything you have to say, just irritated that we can’t get to the full truth.
I just know that if I had the facts I’d do my best to let everyone know whats going on.
Seems like your modus operandi is to tailor make info passed on to you so that you can use it as ammo around here. JMHO.
This is why I’d prefer to have the proper qualified journalists to deliver the full story. It would take away whatever power trip you’re on
and allow everyone to participate in whatever debate follows.
But hell at least you overall intentions are still good and perhaps by keeping what could potentially amount to a very big deal alive, hope floats that we might one day establish what really happened.
@Roger: Michaelhouse & Northwood are not there too. Michaelhouse have a pretty decent side this year……Northwood used to be great when Matt Bowman was there mid 90’s……so too was Kloof and Pinetown…
@Grasshopper: nope – didn’t hear of it? So is the North Coast the place to be? Or further inland – Westville, Kloof, Hillcrest?
@Roger: Dodge deluxe, a guy driving past DHS recently got shot at by two masked guys getting out of a car…..it’s where a good mate of mine from Westville was killed a few years back, Marc Joubert. You might have heard about it, about 600 of us Saffa’s in the UK marched to SA House in protest…
@Gungets Tuft: Mr Straeuli is a Menlo old boy so one can understand his son going to Menlo
@Roger: No idea. Maybe they also don’t like us…..
@Gungets Tuft:@Grasshopper: how is the Berea these days – bit dodg or still for the Durban elite?
@GreenBlooded: no worries
any ideas why Glenwood not at the Clifton tourney?
@Gungets Tuft: DHS Won the High Schools Basketball Tourney at the varsity yesterday too.
@Roger: Sorry boet. Not concentrating.
@Roger: Morningside, right next to DPHS.
DHS looking strong, beat Reddam who have traditionally been very strong.
@GreenBlooded: heh
– that’s a Wynberg U15 tourney website?
@Roger: EEssshhh My Bad. I’m waxing on about the U15 tourney at Wynberg…….College U15 busy taking on Clifton.
@Grasshopper: seems all the KZN schools are there barring Glenwood – hmmmmm – conspiracy theorists unite
@Roger: I believe the list to get into that tourney is a mile long. Glenwood are on the list but College leapfrogged everyone thanks to someone on the inside track
– first time they have been there I think. There is a great website to follow the tourney here:
http://www.wbhs.org.za/explore/sport/waterpolo/
@Roger: Clifton is in Morningside on the Berea near to DHS…
@GreenBlooded: what is interesting is that two or more Glenwood teachers are ex cops….
@Roger: not sure, we do SACS….Clifton don’t go to SACS I believe…the Clifton Head is an ex Glenwood teacher, 1st team rugby coach and College Old Boy, Gerry Goedeke….Udo’s boet….
@beet: @beet: “But please don’t come and try sell us some view point that because one school used a sniffer dog in a hostel that’s them cleared or being proactive or because some coach at another school told you that, it has to be fact.”
Don’t often see you go on the attack like that. Sheeshhhh. Either you are having a very bad day or I’ve scratched a very raw nerve…..
@Gungets Tuft: where in Durban is Clifton – North Coast?
KES won 10-4, play Kearsney next – who also beat College 7-4 so should be a close game.
@Roger: Nope – I am towing my hitch off at the moment. Someone has to contribute to the financial health of the country … and then there’s me .. I just keep the roads with free flowing traffic.
@Roger: More specifically, I believe his boy is at Menlo now …
@Gungets Tuft: I see KES and College are currently locking horns at the Clifton Polo tourney – are you there?
@Grasshopper: why are Glenwood not invited?
@Grasshopper: :D
@beet: just tell them their balls will shrivel into nothing and they will grow moobs, that should be scary enough to deter them..
@Roger: yep, but his son or sins went to Glenwood and I’m sure he was involved in some recruitment. Just don’t like okes with dodgy history…
@beet: Can’t agree more – need to place a firm message at the youth level so that they are fully aware from their entire careers.
@star: Ja, Mediclinic dealt with my boy when he has klapped on the head a couple of years ago – I was very happy with them.
Hope your boy recovers well.
@Grasshopper: Straeuli is at the Lions now –
@GreenBlooded: I’ll join you in welcoming that investigation in the hopes of getting to the bottom of these drug related matters.
At least then terms like “dealing with matter head on” and “cover ups” won’t have to subject to your opinion, we’ll all have a chance to decide what’s acceptable practice or not.
If you do have all the facts at your disposal, maybe it will be a weight off your shoulders to just share them but the emphasis has to be on having facts. But please don’t come and try sell us some view point that because one school used a sniffer dog in a hostel that’s them cleared or being proactive or because some coach at another school told you that, it has to be fact.
Anyway I think there are a lot of schools who sidestep. Even those that don’t sidestep want the matter kept under wraps. My personal view is that schools should provide education on side effects and harms of taking steroids and then distance themselves from offenders. Obviously this has to be done within the bountaries of the SA Schools Act which requires them to exercise confidentiality in certain instances to protect the interests of minors
@Gungets Tuft: No Butch was pretty much the nationwide.
@Grasshopper: Butch is on his way out. Word is that he realised he was not cut out for the recruitment line of work. It seems like Jacques Botes will be the new guy. Unfortunately Botes also a bit light on experience.
@ Gungets- thanks. Torn knee ligament which is a huge disappointment as he will miss the U19 T20 tourno in Pretoria. Let me just say I now know ever inch of your Medi-Clinic( very impressed with the service ) and where the Duzi Pharmacy is located. I could not believe it when the 2nd Westville boy was rolled in with concussion. 2 down before a ball was bowled in anger. Not an ideal start for a Goldstones challenge.
@Gungets Tuft: OK then Rudolph Straeuli, that Kamp Stalraad idiot!
@Grasshopper: I think he was but not sure if that was his job description. I thought he was more responsible for talent identification at KZN Schools with a view to KZN Schools and GK. Beet might be able to shed some light there, but I seriously doubt that he had any brief to identify or recruit from outside the province.
@Gungets Tuft: Isn’t Butch the youth/development guy looking at talent for the Sharks Academy, I might be wrong….
@Westers: Ok, fair enough. Let me rephrase. If what I have been told is any truth, Westville may just be the worst.
I will hopefully have the facts soon.
@star: How’s your boy’s injury coming on. I heard he hurt himself on the weekend. Hope it’s not too serious..
Boys movements – I think the new year is going to bring a whole new lot of stuff to talk about … but the same old background …
@star: Star, well put, the fact is that only once Schools, Unions, Scouts/Coaches and Academy’s put their cards on the table, will the speculation disappear. But I hazard a guess that there will be no response forth coming from these public bodies (the scouts, coaches and Academies excluded from the phrase public bodies).
@GreenBlooded: Hold the phone, you are becoming like Hopper, I’m ADD, just one topic at at time please. No drugs or overages players in this episode, the Bold and the Beautiful is reserved for a future episode.
@ McCulleys- the concern for me has always been the fall out when boundaries are pushed and the arms race commences. Westville were certainly not going to take themselves off the table as Hilton did. I would be fascinated in the Sharks involvement in the placement of players as Marnegate to me was not just about the rules of an agreement being broken. An equal amount of concern was directed at the ” potential” involvement of the Union with a prominent official now at the Lions suspected. I wonder how many KZN players will end up at the Lions in the years to come. So what is the relative context regarding Westville and the EC hotbed. Maybe Playa can inform the blog how many KWT boys are at Westville as opposed to DHS and GW. The 2 HP boys I think were the first EC boys in my son’s grade (11). Subject to correction, I don’t think there are any EC boys in the U16A, U15A or U14A teams. Does this make any so called ” under handed” deals acceptable? Of course not. Any school must understand the long term implications when getting into bed with a perceived “attractive” opportunity. I think we all have been there
I must say that I was impressed when the DHS boy approached Westville and was told to go back and get the necessary clearance. Maybe such civility should extend to other provinces. Sometimes silence is golden ( as opposed to deafening) until we have all the facts in front of us.
@Grasshopper: Why Butch?
@GreenBlooded: Agree with you there – the PED problem is a serious one and I guarantee you no school is 100% clear.
For me the biggest issue is the SAIDS procedure – it would take schools seriously committed to the cause to request testing of their scholarship players and risk losing them for a season.
There needs to be a public channel for reporting abuse and getting tests done – especially in the off season!
@Gungets Tuft: The reason I’d go with CB is for the coverage! No greater audience.
In fact – while we are on the topic of cover-ups, maybe they need to have look at the steroids issue as well – which I believe is a far bigger problem than recruiting. Look at the schools that are conducting raids and dealing with the problem head on as well as those that are doing the cover ups. Might make some of the schools with the squeaky clear exterior a little uncomfortable – but it will be for the greater good.
@GreenBlooded: http://www.glenwoodhighschool.co.za/old-boys-association-dinner-2012
Derek is probably one of TK’s mates…I would prefer Devi Govender giving TK & TH a grilling…
@Gungets Tuft: Damon Beard and Sias du Plessis are well known GOB DJ’s, maybe get them to do a piece on it or use their connections to get it out there….Mr Butch James should be grilled on it too….
@GreenBlooded: I still like the idea of a blind labrador
… perhaps the dog can be best mates with an orphaned baby vervet .. 
… must be lots daarso in the leafy suburbs .. 
You might be getting the idea that I find some CB stories a little vacuous, and not quite the squeeky truth either. On CB you get three sides to the story as well, the third side that ends up on the floor in the editing …
@Gungets Tuft: I don’t know – ou Derek loves his sting operations and exposing cover ups / lies / deceit. My best ever was when he caught that dodgy sparky bypassing meters in Jozi. The “I want to play tennis all night story”. Being a sporty oke I think this would be right up his ally. Ou McCulleys and ou Playa are giving it horns here. Good luck to them. As far as Glenwood is concerned I think we know what we will get – Yes we do it and we don’t care. They are a known commodity – don’t really try and cover things up. As for the others – I’m going to love watching them squirm and all the lies and cover ups getting exposed. The sooner the better too.
@GreenBlooded: Only one way to get Carte Blanche to do a story – log it here —-> http://carteblanche.dstv.com/
Doubt they will do it though, unless you put a quota spin on it – CB specialise in the “public outrage and conspiracy theory” stories – I doubt that schoolboy rugby is going to get too many peoples knickers in a knot …
If you can find that vervet monkeys were hurt in the relocation of the boys, or that one of the boys has a blind labrador that is pining to death lying at the front gate because his best friend has moved to Menlo Park – then you have a winner …
Might help that ou Derek is a Durban boy, and started out as a sports reporter …
@McCulleys Workshop: Derek Watts!! Right man for the job. Maybe drop him a line too.
@GreenBlooded:
I would like to pose the following questions to you about the Sharks involvement in the relocation of schoolboy rugby players to any schools in KZN, or elsewhere. By Sharks I include any affiliates, such as the Sharks Academy, as well as any agent, coach or scout affiliated to the Sharks or the KZNRU in general.
1. Do the Sharks identify schoolboy rugby talent at any level and recommend a change in school. If not, have they done this in the past.
2. If so which schools have been used as recipient schools for these players and why these schools in particular.
3. Do the Sharks offer financial incentives to Agents, Scouts or Coaches to identify schoolboy rugby players and align them to the Sharks or KZN schools.
4. Do the Sharks pay for the relocation of schoolboy rugby players to KZN during the players school career.
5. Do the Sharks pay transport costs for the relocated schoolboy or his family, to travel between his home and his new school.
6. Do the Sharks pay for any academic or boarding fees for any schoolboy rugby player to attend any school. Do the Sharks, in the absence of paying these fees themselves, secure sponsorship from other parties to pay for any schoolboy rugby players to attend certain schools.
7. Are any schoolboys that are relocated to or within KZN, with your involvement, offered any form of academy enrollment OR craven week position as part of the incentive to move schools.
8. Do you provide any financial support to any Model C schools in KZN, and if so which schools.
@McCulleys Workshop: Good! A decent journo will get to the bottom of this.
@GreenBlooded: Howzit, you have made your point clearly, but it gets confusing when you consistently point north, instead of dealing with your own alma maters blatant activities. I have sent a mail to The Sharks, and have yet to have a response. I will draft a letter, and send it to all heads as well as the Mercury sports journalists.
@Westers: Hi Westers, my post was not to point fingers at you, and you have made your stance clear historically. I thought you may have the inside track.
@Playa: Please revert with the facts. I have made my views clear in a previous post. If Westville continue on the poaching path they may become the worst. But to say they are THE WORST cannot at this stage be backed up with facts. Unless you have them?
@McCulleys Workshop: I am not in the loop to any great extent and with my boy finishing this year he is no longer interested in the politics of school rugby.
I have made my views clear on the 2 HP boys who arrived last year from day one. It was wrong. The way they walked into the 1st team was wrong. The fact that they displaced boys who had been at the school since G8 was wrong. The fact that they were probably the least fit of all boys in the greater 1st and 2nd team squads at the start of the season and still went straight into the 1st team would indicate to me that guarantees may have been given. This is my take on the situation.
I can also say that I asked questions at the highest level and the answers I received were less than satisfactory.
I can say with certainty that there are quite a few rugby playing boys who will be finishing school this year who will not be lending much further financial support as old boys in the years ahead. If the school continues with this policy in the next few years they will do untold damage to their image – perhaps not to the public eye but most certainly to one of their best potential sources of revenue, their old boys.
@McCulleys Workshop: Don’t defend their actions – I’ve said from the outset that their should be national laws to prevent the recruitment / poaching and any form of financial incentive to school sportsmen to attend certain schools. Said that along time ago – maybe you weren’t paying attention. My constant and unrelenting position on this thing has been to shine the spotlight back at the many finger pointers with dirty closets (who seem to go to the mattresses when the difficult questions get asked).
Why don’t you send some emails out to the HM’s and the union people and tell us what they say? Very interested in the outcome. Could make a great Sunday Tribune front page story or Carte Blanche episode. Good luck getting a straight answer from TK though. As for TH – well he couldn’t answer a question put to him at the HM’s conference so good luck with him too…….
@Djou: When did Menlo start the buying story. Seems to me it is a fairly recent thing?
My instinct is that the escalation at schools started around the same time as professionalism his rugby in general – 1995, but I could just as easily be wrong.
@GreenBlooded: if it weren’t coming from an impassioned Glenwood OB who defends most of their actions, your view would have a little more credibility, at this stage it looks a little like deflection in itself. I think if there is union involvement in the relocation of players, Northwood, Glenwood and Westville may need to opt for transparency. Let’s see. Silence is often telling.
Let’s just out with it, which union, or unions agents, or unions slush fund, engage in the relocation of schoolboy players, negotiate with schools to receive players, offer CW positions, pay relocation costs, pay transport costs, pay parents, pay schools for bursaries or academic fees or pay vultures/agents to do any of the above on their behalf. John Smit we would like to know from you for starters. This will make a good newspaper story, if true. Mr Hall of Westville and Mr Kershaw of Glenwood, do you have anything you would like to say?
@McCulleys Workshop: Always had a theory: if you want to know who the biggest skebhengus are – look at the ones doing the most finger pointing. It deflects attention away from them. Not the only Highway school this applies to either. JMHO.
@Greenwood: Star and Westers are a little quiet, as is any view on union intervention – as usual. Think I’ll write an open letter to the Bulls the bears and the Sharks
@Grasshopper: You have it wrong mate. Stating Glenwood is the worst, followed by Garsies. You are under this wrong impression because of the blatant lies spread by some ignorant bloggers.
For everybody’s information – Garsies has a system whereby boys and girls can apply for bursaries – for sport, academics and cultural activities.
It is open to anyone regardless the race or religion – conditions are that the person must be Afrikaans and have a good academic record.
The worst in Pretoria is Menlopark – by far. No one gets near them in terms of number of bursaries as well as the manner by which they lure boys to them – exactly as Playa said
Mculleys
I’m here – enjoying the ride !!!
Just thinking – are Westville taking the heat off Glenwood ?? Birds of a feather !!
@Playa: All schools recruit. Not all schools are buying, giving out bursaries and generally corrupting school boy rugga as we used to know it. The majority of schools in SA is not buying, giving out bursaries etc. These schools are focussing on their primary tasks. IMO.
@QC86: Heard Grant has been elected prefect. You must be a very proud dad. Hope his leg is ok we want Selborne (East London’s) flagship team to be at full strength next year.
@Playa: You just became my new best friend!!
@Grasshopper: Once again…recruitment is not the problem. It is the HOW that makes it a problem. All schools recruit.FACT. How it is done, the terms and conditions determine the devils from the ‘angels’.
@McCulleys Workshop: Sorry, drink o’clock came early this week.
I appreciate College on a lot of fronts. They were open with Dale on Folokwe and Winaar last year. Westville on the other hand were not.College were also open on Guma. Westville on the other hand are made of the same paint brush as GW. There is a lot I could tell you but I am still establishing it as fact. I will revert.
What I will tell you though (and I hope Black and White is still typing a response from TH’s answers to him) is that yes, Glenwood is bad…but the school from the leafy suburbs is THE WORST!!!
Black and White, your silence is deafening.
@Gungets Tuft: Eeisch, typing on a phone .. typos everywhere, but you get my drift I hope.
@Grasshopper: On the professional coaching side, that’s a lot tougher. Male teachers have not been that think of the ground so running 24 rugby teams and 17 hockey with only teachers can get a bit hard to staff. College have started offering tertiary study bursaries to Old Boys for teaching qualifications, the first one is back on staff.
Even the schools that claim to not offer bursaries and the like employ coaches, PBHS have quite a few College Old Boys coaching and studying at Tuks. But it’s not a BMH package, the best paid coach at College is a fraction of that.
@Grasshopper: But to answer your second question, I am sure College recruits, at grade 7 level. How formal it is I am not sure, nor whether they target specific boys. I can tell you that most talented boys in KZN apply at all the schools and then evaluate offers. At College you can apply for bursaries on application but it is common knowledge that you don’t bother unless you have played at least regional representative sport. After 150 years word of mouth still works quite well and there are applications from far and wide, then at the last moment when all the scholarships are announced a lot are lost to “better offers”.
Do they recruit at grades after 8, not that I can see, check out the home grown stats. Do we turn down applications later than 8, of course not, but we also follow the guidelines of the HMA and TSA when outs apply or get referred to the school.
@Grasshopper: But to answer your second question, I am sure College recruits, at grade 7 level. How formal it is I am not sure, nor whether they target specific boys. I can tell you that m
@Gungets Tuft: nope, actually decided to quit booze until I lose 10kg, why? It’s a genuine question, all these schools who claim to be whiter than white, do they have their own house 100% legit? If so, good on them. Who’s checking though…
@Grasshopper: Have you been drinking?
@Grasshopper: No Grey, high or college?
@McCulleys Workshop: ok, so far we have Glenwood as the worst, followed by Garsies and ? We need a top 10 bad list and name and shame ALL schools doing this……..and I mean ALL even if it’s ‘just’ 1 kid….there is no grey here….so Hilton, DHS & Northwood too….
@Grasshopper: Hopper, let’s stick to hiring firing renting leasing and invoice discounting of schoolboy rugby players post grade 8, the professional coaching and exchange students we can address in years to come, phew, stay the course here.
@Gungets Tuft: for the 198th time, I don’t support what Glenwood & Westville are doing. My question is are you 100% sure College is not recruiting too? I mean 100%….if so I have respect….although a professional coach is still off on what I thought College was about, teachers doing the coaching…
@Gungets Tuft: Hahaha – Still silence on the union front, whats up Playa, Star…Greenwood/Blood/Masjien?
@Grasshopper: Not sure if that’s a question or a statement, but I know this – there is no right way to do the wrong thing and the end does not justify the means. College will work with what they have, it’s not as if we are sending a SOS bus to KWT …. and I will live with that consequence. Good luck with yours.
@Gungets Tuft: College is looking pretty white at the moment, maybe they are then good stuff. Not sure how they going to compete in future if their 2 major rivals are actively recruiting. I mean the 90 odd loss by the under 14’s must be a concern. I know College guys say their is a 2nd form curse, even with that making up 90 points over 4 years will be tough…
@McCulleys Workshop: With one glaring difference – the boy placed at College is internally funded – and I can prove it – and there is no financial assistance from, nor obligation to, the Bulls. Remember that the boy in question arrived shortly after another Grade 9 scholarship boy had just left, so there was a slot into which he fitted. As for “directing him back”, that ground has been covered, no obligation there either. Anyone that thinks they can direct a boy’s choices nowdays is dreaming, especially with the lad involved who knows his mind very well indeed, and it is illegal to contract him as well. The difference between College and the others who seem to have a conveyer belt running to the Eastern Cape is that everyone knows about the College boy and the terms (whether they believe it or not), the rest appears to be a closed book. Quite different as well seems to be the negotiation between headmasters on the move. I think we will find out that the activity right now is not quite taking place in the headmasters office ….
@Playa: it’s the nagging question that I have been asking for 18 months. What role do academy/union scouts play in identifying players and then seeing to their relocation to a HP rugby school (because Dale, Queens and Selborne aren’t really top rugby schools with proper pedigree and history and they are in the backwater and you wouldn’t want them to end up with the Kings because there is nothing going on there). What role do the Unions play in paying school fees, or using an armscor type slush funds to pay fees, or get a sponsor to pay fees, and what deal is offered regarding CW pink tickets? And the answer – SILENCE. F all… So the resounding silence sounds to me like…there is something going on, with Stacey’s mom! It is too quiet…TK, TH tell us what’s going on. We know MC accepted a boy the bulls identified, placed him in MC on the basis that he gets redirected back to the bulls by the famous RBW. Let’s just have the facts. Whose going to blink first?
@Black and white: Woke up in a really sarcastic mood this morning, hey?
Here’s your homework. Go and find out exactly who foots the bill for Els and Qoma. Because what you are doing is asking a question and making assumptions at the same time. You might just be surprised.
Before you think I am playing hide and seek, I think you would rather hear the gory details from ou TH. One thing I can tell you for free is that they are NOT funded by old boys or school money. Go figure.
@Playa: so you are saying Unions are recruiting prospective talent at u16 level across borders at the expense of local homegrown boys . Then using Old boys and schools money to pay for bursaries , boarding , flights with no future commitment or financial contribution to these imports expenses ??
@Black and white: Careful…rather ask Trevor H if he has the Bulls Rugby Union on speed dial, and what relationship he has with them…you’ll get what you’re looking for that way.
@Black and white: Do or say nothing? Did you follow the Els and Qoma saga? Hudson refused to play Westville at Grey PE fest
@Grasshopper: The only thing not regular about Grey this season is them beating Grey Bloem. As for consistently being 1 of the sides every year that is very much a regular occurrence.
i would like to know what the relationship is between Hudson PArk and WBHS . It just seems to weird that for some reason we keep landing up with their kids . Are the headmasters or sportsmasters involved in open recruitment between the two schools . How can HP headmaster willingly each year loose top U16 rugby players and do or say nothing about it . Does Trevor H wake up one morning and find a few extra EC boys in his school . i think not !!!!
@Grasshopper: Do you know why Hudson never features in the top 30?Because their players disappear after under 16. HP has produced some serious junior sides, i”ll put my head on the deck and say some top 20-30 sides in under 13 to under 16, but have failed to retain them for one or other reason. Not just from poaching admittedly, but the jump from junior to senior rugby in high school is not for everyone. Also a lot of the boys end up down the road at Selborne, or further inland at Dale for the culture. They have been robbed of some great 1st XVs in the last decade because of that.
Now to answer your question on why the EC:
1. Black players. You will not find such participation of black players anywhere else in the country. And they are that good.
2. Boland – go look at the make-up of some of the Noord Vaal schools.
3. Mpumalanga/N Cape – you wont find much there. The place of hidden treasure is the Free State…now there’s an untapped area.
On Grey PE – I challenge you to browse through their results from 2000 to date. A great season has been a regular for them. Top 10 more often than not. This has probably been their greatest period in the history of the school.
If I was an agent I would be looking in the Boland, Mpumalanga, Northern Cape etc, hard places where kids want the opportunity to leave….
This is not a dig at EC schools, but why such a focus there? Is it because economically it’s a mess or because the players are just so good. EC hasn’t blown away all and sundry recently, they have 3 or 4 sides in the top 30. Hudson Park never features in the top 30. Unless all the recruitment are PD players or something. Before the EC & Border bloggers cut me down, Grey PE had a great year but this isn’t a regular sort of year, not that Glenwood are any better…
Always worth remembering that the agreement in KZN pertains to the participation of u19 players.
An u18 player or below can literally join a school on the day of a rugby match and play as long as he is registered on time by his new school.
@fairplay: Hudson Park are not the only EL (Border) school who will start 2015 with Grade 10/11 boys missing from the class register.
And the bursaries being taken away story is just smoke and mirrors…
Watch this space
@Grasshopper: Not considering an exchange student for the Maths High Performance class then ….
@GREENMASJIEN: Hahahaha come on. I’m sure you are better than this. Selborne have valid reasons for refusing to play Glenwood
@McCulleys Workshop: Nope, still on my Deparoc, I promise. Glenwood has an exchange system with a UK school, forget the name, but it means two or 3 UK kids come across for a couple of terms. I know many schools do this too. Are these kids allowed to play sport and if so at A team level? It’s a tricky one, as the whole point of an exchange is to enjoy all fields of school life in the host country/school….you might suddenly see a huge pommie kid playing A team…
I don’t think any u19 exchange student was ever seen as potential loophole until Northwood was able to take advantage of it last year. Anyway that door has now been shut. The HMA was extended last year to disallow u19 exchange students from playing in KZN interschools games
@Gungets Tuft: I agree, their 2nds had a very tall lock this year who is in grade 11. But point is, are Northwood targeting rugby playing exchange students as a method of improving their sides, or is Hopper losing his focus after two days on the straight and narrow and has now started dragging us down rabbit holes again? Northwood, as with all schools, should be building a facility that boys want to attend, starting with local boys. From what I recollect they have had players migrate there due to a Sharks scout recommendation, but that could be my rusty memory. It would be great to see them building depth through the U14 sides, and allowing for the home grown talent to come to the fore.
@McCulleys Workshop: But I am willing to bet that the fallout will be the Grade 8 intake of the next year or two. It’s a pity , Northwood had some wonderful players, Muil for one, but others that were kept out of the firsts. I know some of them, would have run through walls, in fact did for the seconds, but it was an injustice to the boys who had grafted for 4 years. It’s a short term game …
@GreenBlooded: ya he played last year, what’s the debate, over age, didn’t arrive pre grade 10 or as an exchange student he shouldn’t have played sport at the school (because he was keeping a home grown player out of a side)? All rather tricky, but not an abuse, as he wasn’t bought. If they made a practice of it, bringing in Argintinian front rows from Mar – June, it could be a problem.
@Grasshopper: Didn’t Northwood exploit that loophole last year with the Lithuanian? Might have it wrong…..
@fairplay:
sjoe!! How realiable is the your source? This is certainly sad news for Hudson Park…do you know what happened though?
I hope these boys remain in East London or at least EC
There’s a lot of boys that might be leaving Hudson Park to various schools in the EC and other provinces. Something about bursaries that was taken away.not sure how true that is. So hopefully the KWT boys would return to KWT.
@Pedantic: Sad news indeed for Hudson Park…they had an above average u16A side this year. It makes wonder if we(Cambridge) will still have all our u16A players back next year.
Here is another question, what about exchange students? Can they play?
@Grasshopper: Hopper, where’s that petition?
@Roger: haha! I would love to, he is only about 5foot5 so bounces galore! I would need to warm up the old back in the nets though. I opened the bowling for Under 13, 14 and 15a at Glenwood until a back injury stopped me. Was the quickest under 13 opener in KZN in 1992….haha!
@Gungets Tuft: Westville do have a BE, very small one maybe 20 guys max. They have bought a few houses up the road. Plans are to build a proper BE in Hubertha rd below the pool. I know as one if the key guys in the WOB set-up told me. Eish it’s going to get ugly!
@Black and white: YOU HAVE GOT TO BE KIDDING ME!
@Black and white: If you have just been told by your school, in a manner of speaking, that you are not good enough for their top sides, then I guess the faith is broken and they would rather take their chances across the road. One wonders if they would be making such as hasty move to Westville if they knew that the Hudson Park bus was arriving again (if it is, snot the first rumour that has been difficult to verify), might as well stay in the frying pan … gnome sane?
Just remember – if they are going to Westville then it is as day boys, no BE there to take the Rugbytrekkers
@Black and white: This is not great news, one wonders how the Hudson Park headmaster feels about losing GK players two years in a row?
Have to agree, these boys must be promised 1st team involvement – we saw it this year where a HP import got the 1st XV jersey ahead of a KZN GK prop who was shortlisted for the “green squad” in 2013.
There were also at least two Westville boys denied KZN Duikers colours this year by their coach threatening to leave them out of the 1st XV training squad if they played club rugby – at least that was the story from the boys – will be a bummer if they’re left out due to imports anyways.
havnt a clue on the Sharks involvement but the Hudson Park boys are apparently boys that played GK week . This info was graciously pasted on to a n open rugby training squad by a school master. Who in his wisdom thought it might motivate the players to train harder . The desired effect fell somewhat short .
@Black and white: I would like to know, if any, what is the sharks involvement?
@McCulleys Workshop: haha i agree that you cannot stop boys who are unhappy moving schools locally . My main concern is what the boys who are moving provinces are promised in order to make the move . Potentially if they are not 1st team quality going into opens or matric in their own school ( where they have done their 3 or 4 years ) , they are offered a sporting bursary to attend a TOP school and promised what ?? …… that they will definitely play 1st team ?? why would they uproot themselves, live in a boarding establishment , make new friends , be away from their families ?? Unless it was hugely financially beneficial or they were guaranteed to run on for the first team ?? The school then plays the boys maybe one or two games in the opening of the season in the 2nd side then staight into A team . there to stay . Sorry for you local boys !!
@Black and white: I’ve heard about the GW U16 players moving to Westville, if they are from the area, it’s quite hard to stop that move, but I agree, it is no good for home grown talent who have done the hard yards for the last 3 years. I reckon those being ousted from the Westville side will end up at Port Natal, and those being ousted from the Port Natal side will get scholarships to GW. Hahaha
@Ploegskaar: Two thumbs up to DP for taking a stand.
@Pedantic: So the grapevine has rumoured that a few glenwood U16 player are arriving at WBHS and so too are a few MORE Hudson Park U16 boys . with the current two HP boys that makes up aprox 10 players who did not start at WBHS in grade 8 or even grade 10 . This is not a good place for Schoolboy rugby and for the youngsters who have grown up locally and who have earned their stripes for 4 years at the school .
although I would pay good money to see Hopper bowling to TK (or visa versa) in an oldboy v staff/boys cricket match
hopefully TK ignores Hopper and Glenwood continue on their merry way because we will have bugger all to talk about if they suddenly see the light and become a convent.
It’s like when Shane Warne, Mathew Hayden, Ricky Ponting and Glenn McGrath et al retired – cricket became boring and I had to find some other team to dislike
@Grasshopper: We bought one in U16 from Paul Roos, he was unhappy there, and was a cricketer, polo player, little rugby, golf and judo, so we’ve worked out when you are on a toight budget import players who are multiskilled and ambidextrous so they can help improve your results and image in many areas.
@McCulleys Workshop: TK reads this, hi Trev :-). He knows who I am, him and Rudi D gave me the beady eyeball at Westville when I watched there at the beginning of the season. It must have gone like this, ‘that is the nuisance rabble rouser Old Boy exposing us, keep an eye on him’. Even the OB Chairman gave me a call and gave me a tongue lashing. Not sure why, just because I ask genuine questions and have genuine concerns. It’s a mafia scene there…..I hold no sway at all……unfortunately. OB’s need to vote with their sons and not send them there until this mess is sorted…
@McCulleys Workshop: hahaha! Nice win by your first team cricket on Dixons, must be a strong side as the Glenwood one isn’t shabby, missing Andile P though playing for the Dolphins in India….also good win in the pool for house…..
@Grasshopper: Ok Hopper, round up all the Greens, (including Anti Green and some of the local neighborhood green), bloods, machines of all varieties, woods et al, and set the place alight with your new found freedom and social media skill, I reckon you can get this around the staff, parents and OB’s club in a matter of days – let’s see how many you can convert. Go you good thing Go. There should be a new new pavilion next to the old new Clark pavilion in your name : Here lies Hopper… The Great… Savior of the Greens… You remind me of William Wallace
@Gungets Tuft: Nope, TK is not a fan of me. He probably sees me as a pest, but I don’t care. Until things are above board and legit, I’ll keep at it like a rash. I sure as hell would rather lose every game than be called ‘cheats’ or have ‘bought’ success, that is the ultimate low. Glenwood prior to 2000 may not have been Top 10 material but they certainly were Top 50 annually, were respected and occasionally had a very strong year where they could have made Top 10. They say bad publicity is better than none, I don’t agree. Quietly providing a good all round education and doing well in all fields with support of boys there from grade 8 will win many more friends than having a Top 10 1st team rugby. Come on Glenwood Old Boys help me stand up against this, sign a petition. Maybe even other schools OB’s can sign the petition too…
@QC86: Someone said something about a possible mail “firewall rule” … ?? … I karrent understand what walls, fires and mail have to do with anything but it sounded bad …
@Gungets Tuft: as long as he is throwing stones over the fence,who knows, he might hit someone with some pull and puts a stop to this madness.
I think what Mr Gunn from Selborne is trying to do should be commended we need a champion for the cause.
@QC86: Assume that was the reason why the fixture was cancelled. Also a classic example of kak recruitment, Libbok played EP Grant Khomo, was part of the SA U16 Elite Squad, therefore a high profile player at an established school, who had already received recognition in his province and at national level. What was there to gain by moving to SWD?
@QC86: Don’t get your hopes up yet, I am not sure ou Hopper is on the Christmas card list in the Empire of Kershaw …
@Grasshopper: There is hope,strike me down with a feather,you go you good thing.With 1200 kids it will not be difficult to be competitive .The talent at GW is clear for all to see.
@McCulleys Workshop: I am very focused now to ruffle feathers etc there, it’s complete kak that Glenwood need to recruit. Both Morne Joubert & Jaco Coetzee were at Glenwood from grade 8, same with Warren Whiteley, Fred Zeilanga etc. it started with Marne Coetzee 2 years ago so can be stopped now without too much fuss…
@Grasshopper: Ok Hopper, you are doing well, stay the course. Don’t worry about the leafy suburbs, stay focused.
@QC86: agreed, that is why I prefer a teacher to coach. Of course he should be IRB qualified but at least he has a job to fall back on if unsuccessful. Also, he knows what is best for the kids, rather than what is best for him. Toppy at Glenwood was a great example for 30 odd years…
@Ploegskaar: @Ploegskaar: thanks ploeg,was it a buy?? had not heard that, glad DP made a stand.
@Grasshopper: sorry grass just to add.A pro coach is often the core problem [driving force ]behind recruiting.He needs to win to keep his job after his contract expires, [renewal ]he does not have the luxury of time to develop players,so he pushes the school to buy instant success.Many schools dont target high profile players from tier 1 schools and that is also why they don’t take as much flak as GW.
@Playa: well Kingswood have such a small pool of sportsman I reckon a couple of post matrics doesn’t do any harm, it’s when I school like Noord Kaap had about 8 under19’s playing it was a little unfair…men vs boys…
@QC86: good to hear that. I’ve officially asked the Glenwood management about this expressing my concern, I doubt I’ll get an answer though. Seems it’s head in the sand from them and the OB’s management. The reason is they say a school in the leafy suburbs of Durban are being even more aggressive…..hmmm
@Grasshopper: Once again, there are no problems with post matrics in the EC. The change from Craven Week being under 19 to being under 18 took care of excessive post matric intakes that took place in the 90s. All schools are welcome to have PMs, it is individual school policy determines whether they do or not.
On Grey PE: You will remember the Mgugudo (Dale 1st XV 2012) debacle last year when he landed at Grey under cloudy circumstances? There was an issue of course, and when Somila Jho almost ended up there under similar circumstances this year, Grey declined to place him. Lesson learned.
@Roger: Dale stem saam met Selborne. Not gonna happen.
@Grasshopper: In just about all cases the action taken against another school by an aggrieved school has to do with a specific problem that has arisen between the two schools concerned. It is never an action against the system as a whole. Take for example Glenwood initially not wanting to play rugby against Westville in 2013, yet they had no qualms about fixtures against Michaelhouse and Hilton. All three schools had acted adversely towards Glenwood but Glenwood felt that just Westville had been unreasonable in their approach.
@QC86: Manie Libbok joined Outeniqua from HTS Daniel Pienaar at the beginning of this year, hence their cancelled 16th of August fixture…
@Grasshopper: Selborne don’t play KW and Grey PE recruit heavily at u12 level and mostly PDI’S ,but have stopped recruiting at high school as have Kwaggas and many other schools,all cleaned up their acts.
will TK be fronting the press again – first Hilton, now Selborne – I imagine it will become more and more difficult to spin the party line. Sounds like Dale is next (are they scheduled to meet this year?)
So will Selborne play Grey PE? I hear they too are aggressive recruiters? What about Kingswood with post matrics? Seems we might have double standards again…
@beet: I saw the attempt as damage control,once the call was made to pull the plug on the GW fixture there was a flood of phone calls from Durban to all and sundry.RD even phoned one of our younger coaches that were mates 12 years ago and have not had contact in all that time.He never returned his call.
Not yet established as fact but I was told that Glenwood are/were trying to arrange an interschools with Selborne. As a short term objective, that will be a bit tricky now.
Mr Sammy Gunn i salute you.A line has been drawn in the sand,practice ,train and be as good as you can be,but field a team that is proudly your own,win or lose
@GREENMASJIEN: I can see that in the not to distant future GW will be the one at home watching schools playing at the festivals on TV,cause i don’t know of to many Barbarian festivals in SA.
@GREENMASJIEN: Thank goodness Kearsney have a better outlook than you and value long standing relationships and good neigborliness. And all of a sudden there was 1.
@GREENMASJIEN: Not everyone gets a chubby because their Barbarian Team has the opportunity to rub shoulders with the real Powerhouses in SA. Ook maar niksgewoond nie.
Who do Selborne think they are – they have been invited to play ,
decline the invite , stay at home and watch the games on TV.
There are many sides in SA that will fill the fixtures and be grateful for the invite.
@Playa: Well, my Drink o’Clock only starts in about 2 1/2 hours, off to College to collect my boy now. Will sink a Milk Stout tonight to see if I can also turn into Wollie. Later ..
@noordwes: School is definitely about character building and hopefully preparing kids for life which comes with highs and lows. At the same time I can’t help but ask if what you are saying borders on encouraging a corporate culture at school level and all the evils associated with it. Kids are not earning money to attend school, neither are they adults. Good schools teach kids about loyalty and brotherly love. The recruitment system is not so much about healthy competition amongst schoolmates to be the best with the winner being selected and the next best having to accept that if he wants to be the best he has to try harder, its about adults who run schools deciding that certain boys are not good enough and need to be replaced by better kids that come from some other schools that helped to make them better.
If that’s the way it goes then why not extend the culture to the stands and give the schoolboys the discretion to stay and watch games when they feel its worth their while or to shout for the team when they feel the team deserves their backing, just like we adults often do. In that way the players on the field can also start learning some adult life lessons.
@Gungets Tuft:
alright, I God(t)o(i)t!
I am an old school believer that all good (and bad) things come to an end. How they end…well…they can end well or badly. And some argue that that cannot be an end in itself. Ok, let me stop, it’s Friday and almost Drink o’clock, I might start confusing old Woltrui and myself here.
Point is, you’re right it may be an endless wait, but what we should be concerned about is how will it end, the detrimental effects of it and if it will be fixable. One looks at the direction high school football and basketball in the US has taken over the last 3 decades.It is the equivalent of Super rugby, in terms of competition, viewership, money etc. One thing they got right, however, is that kids stay in their schools until they graduate, and they don’t have the problem of player movements. Not to our extent at least.
I accept that SBR has evolved and will continue to evolve, but there are fundamentals that do not require evolution.
@QC86: They’ll have to fly in their 3rd team for Day 3 against Affies
@Playa: It is the reason I hate the school rankings. Besides the fact that they are flawed unless all the schools play in a league (which is why the KZN tier 1 schools award is ok (ish)), it encourages the thought that teams (and therefore kids) are products that can be used to raise a ranking and thereby market a school. I don’t know the answer (and perhaps don’t even understand the question) but I know that wholesale movements of kids is not it. Don’t want to rehash it, I realise my argument has many weaknesses that have been pointed out before, and we all know the drill by now anyway. The answer, I fear, might be called Godot … {and watches from under his bridge as they all rush off to Google …}
And it’s not nearly over, there is a lot of rumour flying on the breeze at the moment about player moves, we will have plenty to fight about this and next year.
@Gungets Tuft: Man of my heart. Very well put.
@Gungets Tuft: You could not have said it better. Well explained!
@Kosie: Sjoe, you still don’t get the point.
@Gungets Tuft: I think we are actually saying the same thing. To use your analogy regaring employers, Employers will train and then redeploy with no possibility of advancement if the cut for the employer is not met.
Schools are much the same. You are of value as long as you can add value. If your value deminishes for whatever reason, your contribution to the greater organisation is also deemed of lesser importance.
I however believe that schools and employers must see the differences and schools should encourage, develop, help etc a kid of lesser talent to show that somebody with drive has an advantage. As long as the aspirations are realistic, the school would have succeeded in their primary function.
@kosie: Don’t agree. In fact, if you have an employer like that later in life, run as fast as your legs can carry you. A responsible employer acknowedges their responsibility to train and skill you for the job. If all those efforts have failed then the have a responsibility to redeploy. Same at school, if thats the analogy you want to use. I don’t think that an employer/employee relationship is the right analogy at all.
What we should be teaching our boys is that effort equals reward, that dedication and loyalty earns the same in return. The lesson that there might be someone more talented out there is learned very early in kids, as adults and parents our job is to teach that a kids best effort is all that we expect and all is not lost if someone more talented somes along. Then we also teach that talent without effort and focus is a tricycle with one wheel, and that the kid with average talent, but extraordinary drive is better off than the top talent sitting on his backside.
Buying in top talent from the 4 corners does nothing except reinforce the concept that everyone is disposable, and that the school victory is more important than the development of the individual. I know the argument – perhaps the kids being replaced HAVE been provided opportunity to develop and can’t make the step up to where a star player from the EC starts from. My counter is that the school is then placing victory for the school above the interests of the individual. That will fail – it will always fail, because in a short space of time the only kids that arrive will be those that believe that they are the best in the country. The rest, they will go looking for an environment that values the individual more than the ranking. People can disagree with me if they like, but I can think of no argument that will sway me.
@GreenBlooded: Not that there is something I would have rather he said. Just that he pretty much closed any room for a compromise between GW and Hilton. This was just to illustrate your earlier point that nothing will change, because clearly TK sees nothing wrong with the strategy they’ve embarked on, and he is applying the fit in or butt out principle.
In the examples I made two days ago, compromises were reached in order to restore relations. In this case, it is clear that Hilton will have to fit in to play GW again.If this is how he sees GW’s oldest rival, I can only imagine how minute a Selborne/Dale protest is to him
@Ploegskaar: You’re on Ploegie!
The wonderful thing about umqombothi is that there is no hangover. We can hit it hard with some Mabovula nyama and still get up for the early games the next day. This of course only applies if you avoid mixing it with Zamalek aka Carling Black Label
@kosie: life is tough enough kids need to be protected for as long as possible. If a boy worked hard for four years and then are replaced by an import it is harsh. Life is not fair but if possible kids need to be protected from unfairness. They will learn enough lessons through life.
@Gungets Tuft: EXACTLY!!!!
@noordwes: Life is not fair and probably never will be.
The lesson is that people are commodities, as long as you add value to your school/ team, you will be acknowledged, the moment your star fades through injury or whatever, you will be tolerated but never feel part of the inner workings.
I still feel sorry for the kid that was good enough from U/14 but suddenly loses out in the open ages due to a new acquisition. There is a lesson for both kids to learn here.
Something that bothered me for a long time.The boys poached by Glenwood are they 1. Not happy at Glenwood. 2.Worse off at acedemics. 3.Becoming better rugby players.
It is sad but sometimes it is better to learn early in life that life is not fair.The boy losing out on a place in the first team when a import arrive ccan decide to blame the sistem or learn the lesson wha twill happen to him in life.
@Grasshopper: It would be interesting to see if late recruitment happens in the other sports at Glenwood, where the school is also doing well. I can’t see them recruiting top academics for the Maths Academy, but it still does well ….
@Grasshopper: Ok Hopper, stay with us now, none of this bipolar shit and jumping around the place. This is good, you can do it.
@Gungets Tuft: agree with you, I prefer the loyal nurturing approach. It’s not like Glenwood are sweeping all and sundry aside with massive wins. They just beat College away. I reckon without the recruits the results would have been similar. I liked it when Michaelhouse win the KZN award with a great team rather than great individuals…..loyalty!
@Playa: I have been wondering why I don’t like his statement, I think it’s the “I cannot comment for Hilton [but] for Glenwood, we are trying hard to compete at a National level and ensure that we feed good players into the KZN Teams in all fields of endeavour. That is our strategy.” part. It sounds all “we are servants of KZN rugby” but ignores the imperative given by the oke paying for it, which is to be #1 within 5 years. It’s about Glenwood, not the province or rugby in general. TK is not dof, lets give him that at least, so does he believe this, or is it just populist rhetoric that look good to the average (in more ways than one) reader of the newspapers.
If he has said “We hope that provincial and national representation is a by product of our success” I would have bought it. Bottom line is that the recruitment at Grade 10 is within the rules as defined by the HMA and TSA, so it’s really competitive morality. If Glenwood can sustain it, financially first, then in terms of internal morale (lets see how many boys do leave in the wake of the last wave of imports). If not they might end up like Northwood, with a competitive 1st side, then a big gulf to the next side, because the next layer of players have no faith in the school to reciprocate loyalty. Or will that second tier of players be happy to bask in the reflected glory of a all conquering 1st Fifteen, and aspire to making up the numbers lower down. Only time will tell.
@Playa: Ludz has confirmed that the 2 of you will be buying me plenty of umqomboti at Cape Schools next year, Rudi will sort us with the inyama yinkomo, I will make sure that you two don’t puza and patla patla too much and actually watch rugby! Reg so?
@Woltrui:
Why don’t you take a cruise to WK next year, then you can buy me beers and watch Waterkloof, maybe against Boland?
@GreenBlooded: That’s exactly what we expect him to say. What else could he say? Kiss me Amadeus ?
@Playa: “But if you read the Hilton article, the conclusion is basically “We’ll carry on with what we’re doing and Hilton can let us know when they want to play us again” ”
Yes – that’s exactly what he said and why not? Hilton decided to can the fixture – so surely up to them to say when they are happy to play it again? Why don’t you tell us what you expected TK to say in the wake of the Hilton announcement?
@Ploegskaar:
. Next time put the 
in so the boitjies up north can stay with you.
@GreenBlooded: Just remembered that I read the Hilton response simultaneously with another one from about two months before where he said:
“If there is a HIGH school boy that we think would benefit long term from coming to Glenwood, we will talk to him and see what we can do to make it happen. Sometimes it works, sometimes it does not.”
In the Hilton response, the pick for me is:
“I cannot comment for Hilton [but] for Glenwood, we are trying hard to compete at a National level and ensure that we feed good players into the KZN Teams in all fields of endeavour. That is our strategy.”
I am not a journalist, and this is probably very shoddy wok by me, but I can’t help but think that the two lines are not mutually exclusive. If I am wrong, I apologise.
But if you read the Hilton article, the conclusion is basically “We’ll carry on with what we’re doing and Hilton can let us know when they want to play us again”
@Roger: not going to jump up and down, I hope they do it! But it must be applied to all schools doing recruiting etc. might mean no schools will play…..
@Playa: What was wrong with how he responded to the Hilton thing? As I recall he simply said “Disappointed to lose our oldest opponents. Hope to see them back soon”. What was wrong with that?
@Roger:Yes i think we are, The INTEGRITY of SBR is under huge threat.
@Roger: Nelson Mandela once said “It always seems impossible until it is done”. No one saw the SMU thing coming, though there was a build up leading to the blow out.
Are we there yet with schoolboy rugby? – I think so.
@Playa: this sums it up – “The revelations came at a time of great concern over the integrity of college sports”
Are we there yet with schoolboy rugby?
@Playa: interesting read – can you imagine SARFU or the Sharks cancelling Glenwood’s entire season? Would never happen obviously as they do not have the authority. Where they do have authority is at official SARU rugby events – i.e Craven week, Grant Khomo etc. Imagine SARFU handing down an edict to the Sharks not to select any Glenwood representatives for two seasons due to, hmmmm – lets say – knowingly playing over age players, or known steroid abuse, or payments to players etc……
all theoretical of course (before Grasshopper jumps up and down) but it could happen
now that would be a sanction that would hurt
@Grasshopper: @GreenBlooded: If his response on the Hilton thing is anything to go by, he doesn’t strike me as one who could be bothered. This one will play itself out.At least for as long as the whoever signs the cheque books is still willing.Maybe he’ll wake up when festival organisers (KERF, Wildeklawer etc) have a logistical nightmare in trying to do their match ups because schools refuse to play GW.
When you have time gentlemen, read up on Southern Methodist University (SMU Mustangs) Football scandal. The scandal blew up 10 years on in 1986…and badly!
@Gungets Tuft: Yeah, he is a very good College and Glenwood man, if only his boet Derek coached too. Do you know how the Graham Hill experiment is working? He seems to be away with Chad Le Clos half the year. I am seeing quite a but of swimming talent coming through Glenwood now and finally polo is on the up too….
@Grasshopper: It’s not about SLM – no issue with him leaving, whatever the reason. Well, actually, I do have an issue with him leaving .. cosYcos I think we lost a good man, but that’s hardly the point.
Pay vs happiness .. you know what they say, money doesn’t buy happiness, but it sure does buy a different standard of misery …
@Grasshopper: He won’t. It will achieve nothing.
@Gungets Tuft: Yep, the two boys moved at the same time as SLM. I don’t blame SLM moving, probably more money and his alma mater, taking the others along was not really a good move. Same with the new Assistant 1st team coach MV, he is a staunch Westville Old boy……its a career, you need to go where you best paid…or most happy…..
@Grasshopper: We [ i ] will stop when you guys stop defending it.Which you now have,thank you.Now lets put the pressure on TK and RD.
@QC86: @Grasshopper: I thought The Beast had hacked his account.
@Grasshopper: You can leave Staples-gate out of it. The family apparently made their own choices, and continue to do so. Might want to call it some-other-Gate perhaps, considering the other defections (and failed defections) at about the same time. Look up your captain of acquatics and polo in … 2012 – perhaps also completely coincidental … ?
@QC86: Just got irritated with your ongoing attacks on Glenwood, we know they are doing some underhanded things we don’t need to be told about it. As Old boys we trying to rectify things. I might start a Facebook group, GOB’s against Poaching and maybe then the headmaster might take his goggles off…
@Grasshopper: Jees hopper if only you had written and spoken all this sense yesterday you would have saved me hours of kak,and what was it with all those cheap shots at the beginning of every post.????? Troll ,5 year old and blogger for last 2 weeks only,but welcome back to the dark side.
@Ploegskaar:
@Ploegskaar: Ha Ha like a wolf in Sheeps clothing…
Glenwood will have a ‘weakish’ year, only the backs are settled with experience, back three of Morgan, Du Randt & Mukendi. Two forwards back, Palvie and Nama Xaba. The rest will be greenhorns at 1st team level and our Under16’s this year were average…
Wow. A complete shake up. Now we play Affies twice. I thought the organisers tried to avoid that. Thanks very much GW
@Qc86 Menlo have 3 very tough games I count Selborne in the same class as GB and GW next year ,so no easy game.
nurtured not nutured….hahah
What astounds me is the boys nutured through Glenwood prior to heavy recruitment are all doing quite well, Warren Whiteley, Kyle Cooper, Franna Kleynheins, Fred Zeilanga etc….they should stick to the previous formula and renounce buying after grade 8, set a precedence….
@Woltrui: You really missed all that sarcasm and wit
Must have been because it was in written your 3rd language 
Roids-gate with a few other schools who I won’t mention as not to wind them up…
So Glenwood have had Tom-gate, Marne-gate, Potgieter-gate x 2, Goodsen-gate, Staples-gate, King-gate….any other gates, all within 2 years…..eish!!! Surely the management group must be seeing something wrong………?? OR do they really put their heads in the sand. It’s just plain dumb ass!
@Greenwood: Judging by the correspondence that flew between Shawn v Rensburg, Steve la Marque, Rudi Dames and parents during King-Gate, they definitely read this and other blogs.
Comments like/dislike button:
LIKE: Playa (Double like), QC86, Mr Tufts, Roger
DISLIKE: Ploegskaar (Double dislike). Cmonn Ploegie. You must have been “storm dronk” when you made your last 2 comment on this thread?
@Playa: sorry boet
@spilly: if that is the case,Menlo have a very tuff draw for KERF, GW then Grey Bloem and their easy game Selb last,thats a massive ask.
@spilly: Ja and Dale now have Grey Bloem
Have been on the Rugby 365 website, and the fixtures have been altered Selborne now play Kersney HTS Middelberg and Menlo Park,just looking forward to a good festival with great school boy rugby,hope lessons have been learnt,going into the future .
@Grasshopper:
@Playa: Well, TK the current headmaster is very very strongwilled so won’t change his policy. We need someone higher than him to say, come now this needs to stop. Old Boys can only do so much, best way is to ‘vote’ by not sending their boys there….
@Grasshopper: Trust a department that can barely put together a curriculum to handle this??? I think not.
Change has to come from decision makers in the school. They have to decide whether the current strategy is worth the trouble or not. They are not doing anything illegal after all, just pi$$ing off a whole lot of people.
Beet
Hey Beet – Thanks for letting this debate continue – 365 would have bombed this out days ago – as a rabid Gwd supporter and old boy I can concede that very valid points are being made by all sides some of which are hard to defend – no doubt TK & Co read this blog – maybe the hostility toward Gwd will sink in and policies will change …………..
@Playa: I agree with you, once again I don’t like what is happening at Glenwood. Prior to Marne Coetzee in 2012 Glenwood was not attacked or brought up by any schools and had arguably the best years in ages for rugby in 2000 and 2008. I want the school to go back to pre Marne and Tom-gates, stop recruiting after grade 8 and take this heat off them. Their strategy of hosting an Under13 Primary school tourno, offering the best at that to attend the school and then visiting the best local primary schools was all legit and above board, this is the way to do it….full stop. If they are weak in a certain position later on, then the coaches need to find a way of improving those players. I don’t care about rankings and if they lose a few games, no issue with that at all. I would prefer the school to be seen in good light and as an example to others…….this full on attack of a school with 104 years of history is not right. The current headmasters and management are not bigger than the school, they will move on…..something needs to be done, but how? Do we contact the Minister of Education?
@Anti Green: A circus it surely was. Hard to believe that that pack of buffoons are the leaders of an emerging economy. Scary.
@ Playa- you on fire man
Also everyone seems to have forgotten the Goodsen affair which almost brought an end to relations between GW and College. It would be interesting to know what was put on the table as College is a tier 1 school with a fantastic rugby pedigree and the boy himself a College man through and through who would go on to captain a very proud and successful team.
The fact that after the approach was declined, he would not play representative SBR rugby again definitely has left a few local followers a bit sceptical and disappointed . Theoretically it was not beyond the rules that Grassy goes on about but was it ethical and what promises were made( forget green backs) This GW saga is becoming exhausting.
@Playa: My 50c, Glenwood don’t need to do what they do. Parents in JZN want to send their kids to Glenwood and Primary School kids want to be at Glenwood.
@Grasshopper: You would have read an article earlier this year where the Border schools’ headmasters went and attacked poaching, and specifically expressed their disgust at Westville for the Hudson boys. You would have also read a Sport Illustrated article all those years back wrt the Dale boys who ended up at KES, and the uproar thereafter. What is happening now is no different to what happened in those cases.No one is picking on Glenwood, and please do not go the victim route.It is just that GW keeps on doing this despite all the noise, and unfortunately the noise will not go away until this stops.And bringing up past incidents will not divert attention from present occurrences.
@Grasshopper: Hopper my new best friend, this is a School Boy RUGBY blog please keep this stuff off the blog. Make your own blog for this stuff please
@GreenBlooded: Did you watch that circus on Tuesday,
@GreenBlooded: I am glad you see the ‘unintended’ consequences of poaching. Unhappy boys go and displace someone else, somewhere else.
But I will once again ride on my point from last night. The issue here is that 3 schools Hilton, Selborne, and now Dale have cut ties with Glenwood. You guys don’t seem to realise that there is something wrong here, but will happily go searching for hypocrites instead of realising a problem. Gungets, made a very good point…recruitment is not the problem, it is HOW it is done. You earlier said people have problems with Glenwood’s results, otherwise they wouldn’t fuss. Now let me give you a bit of history (and present):
KES vs Dale – we all know the story, relationship almost broke down, headmasters sat, and came to an agreement. Story over
St Andrews vs Queens – SAC was depleting QC. Fixture was cancelled. Heads talked I out. Fixture came back to life, problem never happened again.
Kingswood vs Dale – S Jho leaves Dale for KC in January. Rumours fly that KC had approached Dale cricketers at the annual cricket fixture. Dale calls of sporting relations. Heads talk it out, problem resolved, and the fixture goes on as planned. Relations restored.
KES vs SACS – under 17 boy ups and leaves for KES in April after the Easter festivals. SACS writes to cancel sporting events against KES. KES offers an explanation, heads talk it out.
I am sure there are many other similar instances.
Neither KES, SAC or KC are world beaters, neither were they world beaters at the time these events. The schools affected did not suddenly throw their toys because they were being given a hiding by the poaching teams. The matter, just as with Glenwood today, had nothing to do with results. It had all to do with principle. Heck, about 6 years ago Selborne manhandled Dale with a team which had 8 ex Dale boys including the captain and vice. Difference is we knew the why and how of those boys ending up in Slummies, and everything was above board.
Personally, I am more irritated by Glenwood’s lack of engagement. And having read Kershaw’s response to the Hilton saga, he was pretty clear that GW aim to compete with the best. Reading between the lines, my view is that he fell short of adding “at all cost”. Recruit, by all means, but HOW you do it is what will determine how people view you.
@Roger: It was getting boring – he can have the last word and we drifted waaaay off track.
@Pedantic: Either people can’t read or they are just plain stupid, I have always said I DO NOT SUPPORT RECRUITMENT AFTER GRADE 8. However, if the rules allow it, how can we stop it. I am no fan of TK, ask him, he ignores my emails…….and that is from an Old Boy who’s family have been at Glenwood since 1926!
@Pedantic: Agreed, Glenwood are to be blamed for all movement in schoolboy sport, they started it…..I wonder how the Westville boys feel about the Hudson Park recruits taking their places and the hooker who was replaced by Scarra Ntubeni at KES, poor buggers…
@GreenBlooded: @Grasshopper: By totally missing the point, you guys are again displaying your blind determination to defend practises that are against the spirit of SBR and deviating the heat elsewhere.
Firstly, my comment was a response to GB’s comment that all GW boys are happy – this is speculation and untrue, illustrated by affected GW boys moving to Westville of their own accord.
Secondly, there are glaring differences between the scenarios and it has nothing to do with hypocrisy or double standards … on one side you have “mercenary” provincial players being recruited into Glenwood while on the other side you have boys who feel it’s necessary to move to a school that will give them a fair chance. What part of this do you guys not understand ?
You’re likely going to retort with “those player should man up and show they deserve their place in the teams” – in reality we all know that the mercenary players will almost always get preference as they are effectively contracted, much like the junior Sharks setup.
Looking at the above scenario, you may notice (without green shades) that GW’s aggressive approach is now having a snowball effect on other schools.
Not just a rugga school; http://www.glenwoodhighschool.co.za/mathematics-success
@Grasshopper: Hopper – if you read the blog carefully you would know Vin is class of 86.
@Vin: Hopper is a last word freak – let him have it!
@Greenwood: Agreed, create a new website for ‘Glenwood equals Satan’ website and it can be a complete free for all…..that would be awesome, save me hours of reading drivel…
@Grasshopper: Thanks
@GreenBlooded: Good point..
Beet
I suggest you create a separate thread headed “Lets have a go at Glenwood”
this should make it easier for all the Glenwood haters to get it off their chests !!!
@Anti Green: Yes, AntiGreen….you my best friend..
@GreenBlooded: Point taken.
This is like flogging a dead horse, so boring. Hopper would love to meet you, as you must only have one friend. That’s yourself, sorry and your 2nd team jersey.
@Vin: @Grasshopper: Guys – this is starting to sound like the No Confidence debate in parliament the other night. Cummon chaps……..
@Vin: let me guess a matric of the noughties?
@Vin: yes, because of your patronizing comment about my English ability….
@Vin: Arrogance is another trait it seems….
@Grasshopper: No they teach us not to suffer fools easily!
@Grasshopper: 1. St Bennedicts and St David’s are not traditional fixtures for KES I think we’ve played them a handful of times so another incorrect fact as for St Johns and Parktown (not strong rugby schools) but KES value their relationships with these schools which don’t end because they are going through a tough time.
Oh and you prefer humility – “I got an A for English and have an Honours BComm degree majoring in Economics & Marketing” – I get where you’re coming from.
@Vin: to be patronizing, is that what they teach KES boys up there?
@Vin: Nope, we are the greatest, the best, unstoppable, all conquering etc….those are drivel…
@Grasshopper: Joostvdwesthuizen @9Joost
Thank you to everyone for your amazing support of the foundation.To donate, sms “J9” to 42305 (R30)or visit http://www.joost.co.za for info
I suppose tweets like that are abit too much.
@GreenBlooded: Spot on! Double standards again…
@Vin: Yes, I got an A for English and have an Honours BComm degree majoring in Economics & Marketing. I certainly understand you, stop being so condescending. There congratulating and then there in KES blowing wind up it’s own ass, it’s such drivel some of it. Heard of arrogance? That is why KES is quite disliked by some and why I had an issue with them a few years back. Claiming to be this all conquering school when they were smashing little schools like St Johns, St Stithians, St David’s, St Benedicts, Parktown etc……glad they finally smelt the coffee and playing Affies & Monnas again. I prefer balance, so use Twitter yes, but for factual things. The social media topic has nothing to do with my feelings on the issues in schoolboy rugby. I don’t like the over professionalism in it now and feel the schools need to come together to agree a charter or set of rules governing movements, checks etc….
@Pedantic: I’m aware of one boy (RH) that is moving to Westville but I accept that there may well be others.
1. Will they play for a higher team at Westville than they did at Glenwood?
2. What is the probability of the same thing happening at Westville?
3. I wonder if these boys and their parents see the irony (and hypocrisy) of moving to Westville because they were displaced from their teams by imports, and promptly displacing a Westville boy from his team?
@Grasshopper: People are having ago at GW issues(I have no issues for the record) and Hopper’s response “KES self promote on twitter”
@Grasshopper: If I could I would type slower so you could understand (is English your first language?)……….and KES self promoting on twitter is your problem with SBR? How many times have you said I wish GW was as active on twitter? Nothing wrong with using twitter to congratulate old boys,scholars and teachers on achievements, we are proud of them. #Redlovetoyou.
@Vin: I stopped following KES cos it was getting nauseating, all day long about how great and passionate they are. I prefer humility. But as I follow many sportsman and schools sport sites I get all the retweets, Red power, redisbest, red, red, red…..it’s over the top.
@Grasshopper: Ok then let me put it to you this way then (trying to make it easier for you): Of all the issues in SBR you have and issue with KES self promoting on twitter?
@Vin: the article is actually about the Kearsney festival, but bloggers usually deviate across many topics….
@Grasshopper: who said we don’t recruit at grade 8 (4 boys in our U14A rugby were on scholarship this year) and as for self promoting on twitter – do you read your comments before you post them? The conversation was about poaching, overage etc and you have a problem with self promoting on twitter??????
@Vin: Westville give out around 70 a year….
@Vin: it’s called old boy money or sponsorship….think….
@Grasshopper: if you are fully aware of the financial battles how could you even grasp the thought that KES gave 112 scholarships per year??????
@Vin: so KES don’t recruit at grade 8 or promote the school? What a laugh, they are loudest self promoters on Twitter….
@Pedantic: didn’t Kearsney get virtually the whole KZN under 13 Craven week team in grade 8 for a few years? I would say 20 per age group are on bursaries, half of which maybe from outside of KZN….so 50 out of 1250….not a huge % really..
@Grasshopper: Not defensive just get annoyed when people like yourself, who don’t know the facts go shouting your mouth off…..”what about other schools doing the exactly the same thing. DHS, Northwood, Westville, Hilton, KES, Garsfontein etc etc etc” Another one of your statements that holds no water.
@Vin: Glenwood are of similar size and gov like KES, I am fully aware of the financial battles these schools have…
@Vin: remember not all bursaries are 100%, mostly 50% or less. Not sure why you so defensive and aggressive, I mentioned KES as they have been involved recently in a recruitment tussle and in the past with Dale boys, that’s all…
@Vin: I actually not bothered by what KES are doing, my only link is probably it’s oldest living old boy, my grandad at 89….otherwise good luck to them…
@Grasshopper: Just the fact that you thought KES give out 112 scholarships per year proves you don’t know what you are talking about when it comes to KES. No school the size of KES would be able to survive financially if it gave that many scholarships. So again don’t enter waters you don’t know anything about.
@Grasshopper: obviously maths not a big thing with you 112 throughout the whole school pal you said that GW give out 45 per year so let’s see 45 x 5 = 225 and you have a friend????? Love to know your best mates name because once again I bet you’re grasping at straws.
@McCulleys Workshop: you right, it’s a grey area I’m grappling with. I don’t like recruitment after grade 8 fullstop, BUT if the rules say it’s ok up to grade 10 then why not. Other schools will operate within the rules and gain significant advantage….it’s a tough moral debate. I love my school but not the management, hence the confusion….
@Vin: 112 scholarships? Jeez, that is double what Glenwood give out. Oh yes, I do know what is happening at KES, best mate son attends..,
@Grasshopper: I’m surprised we haven’t had your delirious defense yet, that TK is doing a PHD and is very bright and manages one of the largest schools and he (and the school) is very successful and therefore wouldn’t do anything to jeopardize GW. So let’s go back to the garden of Eden, hide (by denying it’s actually taking place wholesale) and blame (all other schools are doing it). It would be decent if you Greens, Woods and Bloods had a lapse in concentration and for a moment admitted that this isn’t exactly in the spirit of school sport, as I admit Post Matric sportsmen weren’t, and I agree the Wright saga wasn’t great, etc etc If it were my Alma Mater I wouldn’t blindly agree to all they did. Hopper you vacillate between vehement opposition to poaching beyond a certain grade, and then wholesale acceptance of all TK does (but mainly chuffed at you current provincial rugby standing) , and then back to let’s start a petition against the PHD student. Which one is it, I’m so confused one of us needs Prozac.
@Grasshopper: 3, 6 & 7 are nowhere near the real numbers – maybe in U16A alone, but across the age group those are fractions of the real numbers – why do you think the opposition schools are up in arms! ?
@GreenBlooded: I think you may need to go chat to some of the U16 rugby boys – not all GW boys are as happy as you think.
In fact, it might be an idea to do the exercise Gungets mentions in @Gungets Tuft: and then cross reference how many of those GW names appear on Westville team sheets next year.
@Grasshopper: you are seriously an irritation, please don’t mention KES when you don’t have any facts as per usual. Currently KES has 112 scholarships across all sports, academics, cultural and boys that need financial aid – that is a fact. To say KES are doing the same is another one of your thumb sucks. Rather continue your conversation defending GW than bring other schools that you know absolutely nothing about into the conversation. Once again clueless comment from you.
How the lack of interactionn between boys is now the fault of the EC schools?
Since the 365 days,it was predicted that one day,schools will boycott those that aggressively recruit/poach.People even talked about the possible seperation of leagues.Now that it’s happenning,it is now the fault of the boycotters.
Educate me,when has a symptom ever been the cause of the disease?How is it that it’s always the “everyone does it” excuse that pops up when this issue comes up.It has seriously grown old.
I am not using this example to put my alma mater on a pedastal,it is just the only personal experience I can draw from.When Dale took on a couple of Zim boys who turned out to be star players a few years back,there was an outcry.Century old relationships were at stake.Like a lot of GW fans I made excuses myself.But I had to take my Dale hat for a moment.The Dale decision makers had to either carry on and break relationships,or take the lesson,backtrackin order to keep those relationships.I am proud of what they decided.
Hopper,you have a point.GW won’t be dterred,they’ll just find other opposition.But that relationship will only last until they start taking that school’s players as well,and they’ll find another.But point is,that is a decision taken by the powers that be,and those who don’t agree with the methods have every right to distance themselves from such a school.
The other schools accept,though they may not agree with GW methods,and they have taken their stance.Likewise,the GW community needs to accept that these are the consequences,whether they agree or not.Look within and stop pointing fingers at the rest of the world.
@Ploegskaar: Wouldn’t go so far as to call it jealousy Ou Ploegie. Just seems to me that it might not be as much about the recruitment as it is about the results. Maybe I’m wrong. It happens sometimes…….
@GreenBlooded: But we agree then, it’s simply got nothing to do with how GW gained good results or how they recruit. It’s irrelevant, because everybody does it, probably just more discreet and less prolific. Like I said, can only be jealousy, my old Green friend.
@Ploegskaar:
One School recruits a whole team. No results. Not a peep.
Another recruits an entire front row one of whom goes on to make SA Schools. Schools doesn’t get the results. Not a peep.
Another school recruits a few players in Gr 10. Not good I concede. Great results. Absolute mayhem.
You do the math Chopper.
@GreenBlooded: Sparky, I think those dirty bastard haters have a problem with how you attained your results, which is by means of high profile and often botched recruitment, in their opinion anyway. So it seems, in their despicable minds, it’s mostly about the recruitment. Jealous hyenas, I tell you, shame on them.
@Grasshopper: “other schools doing the exactly the same thing. DHS, Northwood, Westville, Hilton, KES, Garsfontein etc etc etc” – the difference (with the exception of Westville) is that none of these other schools are winning!! Last year, almost the entire DHS U14A team was from the EC. This year – almost the same. If DHS were setting scoreboards alight you would no doubt have heard heaps about the immoral unethical practices at DHS. Payi would be the poster-boy for overage cheats. Likewise with the Northwood imports – never a peep. Hilton – well say no more. The problem with the haters is not Glenwood’s recruitment. It’s Glenwood’s results.
@Grasshopper: I don’t think it’s the bursary thats the issue, it’s how the recruiting is done. Above board, as agreed in the TSA, all sorted. No consultation with departing headmaster, issue.
@QC86: Nope, seems you have only been on this blog a few weeks, I don’t agree with movement after grade 8, but the rules currently allow it. Hopefully we can get a few more stringent requirements to be met for movement. However, you perpetually attack Glenwood, what about other schools doing the exactly the same thing. DHS, Northwood, Westville, Hilton, KES, Garsfontein etc etc etc…..all ‘buying’ players in either at grade 8 or above…..no one will ever know exactly what is happening behind the scenes. I could decide right now to pay for a boy to go to Glenwood and no one will ever know, same can happen at any other school that proclaims being completely innocent. Unfortunately parents are the ones who have allowed this to get out of proportion……I’m against it…
@Grasshopper: is it really a case of green pastures or green backs,so you happy to see our schoolboy rugby descend to a level of the school with the biggest cheque book wins.
@QC86: You sound like a 5 year old debating, remember there is a Headmasters Agreement in KZN, not sure if it applies elsewhere, but it allows boys to move for rugby or sport reasons up to grade 10, so Glenwood are operating within the rules. I only know of two new boys, one being the Selborne kid. The others I have no idea on, but in the end if they did move good on them, looking for greener pastures….isn’t that what a free democratic country is about, freedom of choice. Those boys are certainly not been dragged there kicking and unhappy there. Parents have obviously seen a better opportunity for their kids and taken it. I certainly can’t help the EC & Border regions are declining in terms of infrastructure and opportunities….oh yes, hundreds of other schools are doing the exactly the same thing. Also, this is not a new thing it’s been going on for years. Ngcobani Bobo to the Cape, Scarra Ntubeni to JHB, Nic Strauss from Dale to Glenwood in 1994……many many many times over…
@Grasshopper: I think Umbiloburger said the team that played against College on Snows had 2 new players in it.
There is no way any school is going to play completely open cards, why should they. Couple of perfectly decent reasons I can think of.
1. Benefactors don’t always want their names announced as sponsors of bursaries or scholarships.
2. Naming the kids might embarrass the boy, or the parents. Not everyone wants their names up in lights, boys and parents.
So, the bursaries announced are the ones we know about, there are no doubt others. Such is life.
Grassy – if you want outright knowledge, ask for the names of the U16A and B players for the first 5 games of the season, compare them to the last 3 games. Then cross reference them against the top 4 open sides next year. Do the test yourself.
But, why knock yourself out. It’s within the HMA, and if the recruitment is done according to the terms the the traditional schools agreement, then is all straight and level.
@Grasshopper: go read your comment posted on the 23 Aug 2014 @ 9’35 on the Hilton pulls the plug heading.you said “3 and they all approached GW”
so please delete your poor attempt.
@GreenBlooded: read my above comment,if kids are looking thats fine,but your school is doing the looking and the paying,not the kids.No anger green,read ploegs guide lines to rugby development .There and then i have no problems with it.
I fully agree with you and I am absolutely certain that nobody of GW ever approached them and they are paying their own way as is the same with the boys that is going to DHS and Northwood and at no time has any of those schools made a trip down to KWT and bought the boys kit and so on.
@GreenBlooded: the difference then was they applied ,now GW fetch them ,and if they were flocking why does GW have to pay them.
@QC86: No I’m not. But I also recognize that blocking boys from playing each other isn’t going to solve the problem. All it will do is give satisfaction in certain quarters when the headline “Another School refuses to play Glenwood” appears.
If the boys in the EC who think they can make it in rugby (deluded or not) and that they need to make a move for that to happen, stopping them from playing other schools will not stop them looking. Or the schools themselves from looking. And there are MANY of them out there – not only Glenwood who appears to be the sole target of your anger.
@Grasshopper: sticks and stones boet,try reading and you won’t get so confused,u16 i have always said 6 you said 3 you back to one again?if you want to lie you better have a good memory,go back and read your comments under the Hilton headline
,7 has got too do with the firsts,shall i draw a picture for you
@Grasshopper: Just imagine if those mystery boys on the plane also arrived? Then we would be talking about the entire U16 age group.
@fairplay: Why not? Primary school kids moving to high school are fair game. Boys from all over SA flock to Glenwood in droves. Why should we not allow primary school boys from the EC to come to such a great school? When I was at Glenwood there were even some guys from Zimbabwe and Kenya. So boys from a short hop down the coast are welcome to come.
@GreenBlooded: Jeez, this QC86 dude has absolutely no clue about Glenwood, just sounds like Beast and all the other trolls in the past. On a mission to tarnish Glenwood even with lies……..oh well, taken with a pinch of salt….it goes from 3 to 6 and now 7 new boys in the Under16A’s…..gosh I wish I knew who all these kids are…..the team I saw last had one new kid in it…
Personally I think all schools buy players so nobody can complain. I just think it is funny how everybody say we dont buy players. My problem with buying of players come when a school buy so many players as some of the KZN schools and still they arent even in the same class as grey bloem; boishaai; p gim; Affies and the list goes on and still have though matches against the small EC schools.
@GreenBlooded: In those days that is how we all did it,and it was tough,it was man against man,and the playing field was the same for all,the harder you trained the better you did,but now as a kid how do you fight against a cheque book ?after GK some of the best u16’s in the country arrive at his school, what are we teaching the kids? let money buy our number 7 ranking,jippy us old boys are so proud.?? can’t be.I can read between the lines you not 100% happy about this.[ you shouldn’t be]
@Greenblooded. You sure you are good? So we wont see any Dale Junior Boys at GW next year?
@QC86: Not sure that actually happened but I’ll take your word for it – you do seem to know exactly what pots at Glenwood afterall. Assuming it did, if I know Glenwood Boys, they probably played their guts out for the B’s to try and prove themselves worthy of getting back into the A’s.
Places in sports teams are not guaranteed – you need to constantly prove your worth. When complacency sets in – mediocrity ensues. Same thing happened to me at Glenwood – made the 2nds in matric, got complacent, got dropped. Dragged my lip for a week or 2, then decided to fight my way back. I eventually made it back – after playing for the 3rds against College on the day of our matric dance, I got called on for the 2nds 5 minutes into the game after my replacement pulled a fat. Never looked back – stayed there the rest of the season. 2 games against College and then a matric dance – eesshhhh. It builds character – which according to you is very much needed by Glenwood boys. So it has it’s positives too.
@GreenBlooded: maybe you should ask the parents and the 6 boys that were playing u16a’s before the June-July holidays and are now in the B’s, how happy they are,now that they have been shafted by a cheque book.
@fairplay: Nah – were good mate. If you want to know what pots at GW – ask any one of the GW boys. Never found one that isn’t happy there and proud of his school. Hard to fathom going by the comments of all the know-it-alls on this blog.
@fairplay: Tell us more about the shopping trip,you amongst sane people.
@QC86: Glenwood Boys are about the most respectful and friendly okes you will encounter. Top notch gentlemen. If the EC boys are not allowed to socialise with them it would be their loss.
Be that as it may, I will be attending the KERF next year as always. As a pro-bono service to School Boy Rugby I will be on the lookout for any fraternising between EC and GW boys. Any such encounters will be snapped with my trusty Samsung S5 and WattsApped to their respective coaches for further action.
You might want to arrange with the Kearsney people beforehand that dinner times are staggered to avoid the EC and GW boys being in the dining room at the same time. Who knows what get’s discussed between 18 year old boys while waiting in line for beef stroganoff.
All the money to buy players and the best facilities and over a 1000 boys but only just makes it into the top 10 and still struggles against other schools the same size or sometimes smaller. Then I would say that not everything is up to scratch at a school like that.
And yet again the KZN schools came to do some shopping in King Williams Town .
@GreenBlooded: if you are having to pay boys to attend your school of 1200 boys,they most probably not worth socializing with.
@GreenBlooded: Boys had nothing to do with the decision,just some sane adults making a stand against stupidity.
@noordwes: Don’t let facts interfere with a good story.
@QC86: Noordwes raises an interesting point: Will the boys from Selbourne and Dale refuse to play against KZN at Craven Week if there are GW boys in the team (which there surely will be)? What will happen at Kearsney next year? Not allowed to dorm near the Glenwood Boys? Not allowed to socialise with any of them? How far does this embargo carry?
@noordwes: one here and one there,last count on this blog we got to 7 okes that played for GW this year that had moved,big DIFFS
@QC86: Every school do that.I think it was last year at Paarl Gim the no.8 was at Upington till gr10.The prop of Grey Bloem this year was in Potch till gr10.
@noordwes: They not GW players boet,they playing there because they get MONEY.A school with 1200 pupils has to buy a team??????????????????????????????????????????
The next step will most probably be not to play trials against GW players or at Cravenweek against the GW players because they are to big or something
@spilly: Yes Morgan was playing with a hairline fracture in his wrist and a small tear in his MCL,having a rest LOL@Grasshopper: You pointing fingers at the EC for playing overage players???? we might be the source of desperate PDI’s but you are the school that played Tom for 3 years not us,and secondly no other school in the country is doing anything close to the volume of recruiting that GW is,or bending the rules to the degree you guys are.Blatant cheating if you ask me.
Oh yes, to add yes we all admit Glenwood have made some bad decisions, pushed the rule books and do some recruiting at grade 10 level, but everytime they do they are literally burnt at the stake. Any other school does this and it’s swept under the carpet OR kept very hush. Rant over..
To be honest I don’t think the EC schools pulling out of fixtures against Glenwood will deter the likes of the Glenwood management, they are head strong and will just find others who are prepared to play them. I don’t agree with it as I would like to see Glenwood play the EC College’s and Grey PE. However, what does irritate me though is schools with double standards where they withdraw from a fixture but don’t have their own house in order. When a school is audited for age checks, steroids abuse and no poaching after grade 10, then they can get the ‘whiter than white’ seal or kitemark of trust. Until then, no school can claim to be completely innocent of dodgy behaviour, be it old boys assisting kids with school fees on the quiet or kids on steroids in the off season or kids older than they should be in particular age groups. The EC & Border seems to be the source of many overaged boys, are their age audited? I don’t think so…….double standards really irritate me.
@QC86 Reading between the lines , looks like the fixture vs GW is off. Hope the boys see the bigger picture, as i am sure, they would like to do the talking , on the rugby field.How is Grants rehab, hope ready to go for 2015, looking forward to the 3 Vs for Victory trio Voigt Venter and van Tonder next year. See Morgan not down for Cape Cricket Week, did her have post season repairs done, hope he is well.
@pietretief: Schools had been withdrawing for decades – go check the history. Also, I have no problem with Affies. It is a great institution – you should have known that this is my viewpoint if you read my posts. I have a problem with their decision maker. And I say it openly – I don’t hide like other people.
In connection with your question about the reasons – they differ from school to school and there are many. The problem is people see this school withdraw and that school withdraw and then assume that they all withdrew for the same reason.
Just as an aside, it is very interesting that Affies and Garsies and Menlopark will play cricket against each other this year. And some of the rugby players are also playing for the respective cricket teams.
And that alone should tell you the reasons put forward for withdrawing on the rugby fields hold no water.
@Djou: thank you for the history lesson, quite entertaining.
Any one who reads the blog know you have a problem with Affies but you also the one who knows the most about them. The comment was not made to Affies in a good or bad light just that it might have been the beginning of schools withdrawing because of the same reasons. Maybe I have affies reasons wrong but I am sure you will enlighten me.
@QC86: Doesn’t make me happy at all. I doubt it makes that 46 boys who would have played the match happy either. I’ll bet that if you had to ask the 23 boys from Selbourn, or the 23 boys from Dale if they would have liked to have played against Glenwood they would, to a man, say yes.
@QC86: I wouldn’t be surprised. Sad really
@pietretief: Did you know that Piet Retief was a criminal found guilty of fraud by several magistrates – and he conned a number women out of their money. He thought he could do the same to Dingaan.
And what stand did Affies make – they withdrew against Garsfontein and Menlopark this year, and last year against Outeniqua, and a few years earlier from the Tuks series and also from the Beeld trophy. And they also withdrew against Waterkloof – only after their deputy headmaster became headmaster at Waterkloof they started playing again.
Do you call this behaviour a stand, and if so a stand for what?
mmm . This is getting interesting … maybe there will be a “Transgressors” league shortly – I’m sure there will be quite a few candidates …………….
@Playa: a little bird told me Dale won’t play them either.
@Playa: Mark my words won’t be long and Kearsney and MH refuse to play GW.
@QC86: Oh boy!
Game changer in the right direction. No story of 60 point hidings or crying rich mommies’ boys this time. I am very interested in hearing the Glenwood faithful’s views on this one.
When Affies made a stance it was chaos, more and more schools is going to do this.
@Playa: Heard yesterday that the GW game is off,so happy that people are taking[ making ] a stand against this madness.
@Playa: but you know that sometimes the kids just don’t see the bigger picture.
@QC86: Eish…
At the end of the day, that’s all the kids want to do
@Playa: Not going to happen,just listening to the chatter around school.I spoke to Grant and he said they only want to play rugby and not concerned about politics,made me feel bad.
@GreenBlooded: Very nasty sense of humour indeed.I reckon this was discussed at the headmster’s conference.Selborne will honour the fixture I’m sure.My worry is if JB makes the Glenwood 1st XV…he may need a chiropractor afterwards.I hope there are plenty in Durban
Can anyone enlighten us on how these fixtures are decided? Drawn out of a hat? Committee decision? Rotation system?
Not that I have any problem with them – just wondered how Selborne and Glenwood got paired up given the bad blood. Or has someone got a nasty sense of humor?
I wonder if Selborne will agree to the fixture?
I don’t think Glenwood vs Selborne will happen considering the latest ‘head to head’…