@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah seemed to be enjoying his time. Wouldve loved to see him back in the flyhalf position in the A side though. Played well there. Also helped that he had a player he’d been playing with for years at inside centre in Noot.
As for successful DPHS teams, although its still early, their 2011 side seem to be doing well at HS level thus far. Guys like Harker,van Noordwyk,Hlope,Spooner,Hamilton,Walker,Conversano,Simpson,Kershaw,Moletshe, Mertsch all doing well!
@Gungets Tuft:
Tristan Ross did the exact same last year. Stopped rugby too focus on cricket and turned out as a prop for the U15C a week later. Except he didn’t get concussed
@Pedantic: I remember he got a solid concussion last year as well, was out for a month at the same time as my son was hospitalised, remember him running the line during the College game. Perhaps they both have thin skulls. He is a cricket talent so perhaps that is his game.
@Gungets Tuft: Koekemoer decided not to play rugby this season but in true sportsman style couldn’t keep himself off the field and debuted in the C’s a couple weeks ago, getting a big knock and possible concussion in the process.
With his obvious cricketing talent I guess he has decided to focus on that instead.
@flyparent:
I meant that there aren’t doing as well as other years in rugby which is true. Keyword being as. Fact is, some are still doing well in anycase. Guys like Mthembu,Swanepoel,Holdcroft,Whitfield,Simpson,Noot.
In other years its much better. Not saying its because of the boys though…
Yes some have done very well in other codes. Eg last years DHS U15A polo side had a great 4th term with a climax of beating Clifton 5-2 in their last game.
The cricket boys are also doing quite well
@flyparent: Tend to agree with you. I don’t think it was 2010 stellar year for DPHS, there was way, way too much parental interference (it reached a crescendo in 2010 as far as I could see) and not the best teams picked as a result. However, many of those in the 2010 year have gone on to do very well. The boys who have not managed to go on to top teams in high school have had their early size advantage not carry on into high school, and have had mom and dad not being as influencial as they were. Others, overlooked for potential at primary school, have gone on to do very well at High School – I saw one of these “pigeonholes” playing 2nd Water polo for their school in Gr10. There, I said it.
@Horsefly No.1: It is a bit harsh to brand the DPHS 1st XV of 2010 as not doing too well at HS level. If you check more closely you will find that at least 15 of the 24 are all playing A team level Rugby at their respective HS.
Two others were until this year and have now given up rugby along with a couple of others who have given up at some point since starting HS.
Of those not playing A team level or of whom I am not sure of their rugby position, there are 2 provincial cricketers (I think), 1 provincial water polo player, 1 1st X1 hockey player and 1 very high level paddler.
It seems as if the DPHS 1st XV of 2010 are doing alright to me, albeit not all on the rugby field. Coincidentally at least 6 of the boys still playing rugby are also very successful academics!
@GreenBlooded: I agree with you, and I’m talking from experience. Value for money, DPHS is the way to go versus Highbury.
The parents pay the same fees up the hill, but they are not all equal. Certain boys are more equal than others for reasons only they would know.
They generally have very talented sportsmen, but tend not to give them recognition and encouragement. The coaching and approach to rugby and most other sports is very old school.
There have been many occasions when certain parents ( ex International and provincial players ) have offered their help, but have been turned down. I find this really strange.
They are making huge efforts in marketing via the media etc. What that they do not realise is, that one of the best ways to market a boys school, is to achieve really good sporting results, especially on the rugby field. Imagine if they were on par with DPHS in rugby ?
@HORSEFLY NO.1: It would be interesting to see the stats of the conversion rate of primary schools Craven Week players to Grant Khomo, U18 Craven week and even 1stXv level at their chosen senior schools.
My sense is that it is not very good, especially amongst the forwards, where I think you see a lot of early developers at the U13 CW.
I can recall several boys arriving at MHS as U14’s as Craven week reps, being outstanding initially, sometimes even up to U16, and then falling out of the picture and not even playing 1stXv in matric. In one instance the player in question was displaced by one who had played B team until the latter part of his U16 year and who then went on to play for the Sharks and is a Bok 7’s player.
Pat Lambie did not play U13 Craven Week or Grant Khomo but made the Craven Week and SA schools side in Grade 11 in his first year of open rugby. At U14 to U16 level the star of that group was Awande Khumalo from Crdwalles who had played at U13 CW and GK. Khumalo made the Craven Week side in 2008 but did not go on to play pro rugby.
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah. The best thing for me though has been to see some of these boys doing well in HS rugby. Boys like Jackson,Visser,Mare,du preez,Francis,Goodson,Tedder,Reece-Edwards,Ellse,Paverd.
The 2010 group isn’t doing to well at HS level. Some not even in A teams.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: That team with the Doops, Reece, Jackson, Guy Francis and others was Michael Dicks “dream team”. They were better than good, they were outstanding. Something like 13 in the KZN side, they simply crushed everyone they played. I remember going on the Cape Town tour with the school, seeing them demolish SACS, Wynberg and Rondebosch (I think).
@House:
Lol which one? They’ve been strong every year since 2008 except 2010. They only lost twice in past 2 years( think both to Selborne).
Think DHS has managed to get a couple of top talents every years nnow since 2009. Already 3 for next year including 2 development boys put into the school by DHS.
House players Thomas Walker and Tyran Faber are part of the 2009 DPHS team which was pretty good.
@House:
Yeah there’s 5 DPHS boys in Kearsney 1st side and only 3 at WBHS. Most are in matric though.
DHS currently have 3 in their 1st side. They had 7 in last years U14A side and about 8 for the U14s of the years before.
@ruggaman:
This depends on the success of the feeder schools tho, if the feeder school was good that year then they’ll have the high school offer quite afew bursaries and the chance to have a decent number 5 years later is large. Simple really.
Would be interested to see the stats with regards to how many kids start at the traditional primary feeder school, and end up playing first team at the school. For example wsps to westville, dphs to dhs, merchiston to college etc. Looking at last years teams can only think of Kearsney (highbury) and college who had decent amounts. Also st Charles maybe with their junior school?
@GreenBlooded:
I think that DHS and Glenwood are doing great things by putting development players from unknown schools into DPHS and GWD Prep respectively
@GB I reckon 99% of those talented kids from the smaller schools are snapped up by the big highschools anyway, representitive selections are very subjective with a quota to boot
@House: Not with you?? I’m talking about at zonal and provincial trials where kids from certain schools are at a massive advantage – not within the kid’s own school.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I have a son at Highbury and a nephew at DPHS. If I knew then what I know now, and were it not for the morning traffic schlepp – I would have sent him to DPHS. Not for the reason’s you mention however (Highbury is also on the favoured list) but because I think DPHS is far better value for money.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Not saying that at all – but is it worth offering U13 boys a free ride through high school in the hope of him being a good 1t team player one day when the conversion rate is so low? 75% may be stretching things a bit. I’d say more like 50-60% correct. The view is very different when you are at a non-favoured school and you see talented boys getting stiffed.
@Greenblooded tend to disagree with you, it is a lot easier for a talented kid to stand out in a smaller school and get noticed, I do agree however that primary school sport is just that and does not translate into highschool success
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah I’ve noticed that the boys from lesser known schools are usually put in the KZN U13B sides. Someone also mentioned that kzn u13b rugby had a better conversion rate than u13a. I would say 75% of primary schoolss selections are correct. Just because the conversion rate is quite small it doesn’t mean they got it wrong at U13. Remember, 5 years is a looong time.
@GreenBlooded: Totally agree! I was at Brighton Beach on the Bluff, a very good gov primary school at the time (not sure now) with some excellent sportsman. We had to go through allsorts of trials etc to even make South Durban. Most of the time the teams had already been picked so we would have to have done something amazing to get noticed. However, a few of us did thank goodness. The 1st team rugby in 1996, which was admittedly not Glenwood’s best had 4 Bluff boys playing of whom not one had played rugby at primary school. One was the head boy and captain. Going to DPHS does not guarantee anything. Our best player that year, Greg Manning was a DPHS old boy though….
@HORSEFLY NO.1: As has been noted many times before, KZN representation at primary school level is not all it is cracked up to be for 2 reasons: 1. Success at U13 level does not always translate to success at U18 level and 2. The KZN selections at U13 levels are so blatantly biased towards certain schools (DPHS certainly being one of them) that many talented yougsters which would well make the KZN teams are overlooked. The way to find the truely talented youngster would be to start with the KZN boys who are NOT at the favoured schools because you know then that he is at least 5x as good to have been noticed. Classic example is last year’s U13 Craven Week captain who was at Kloof Senior Primary (where is that??) who is streaks ahead of anyone in terms of rugby talent and was impossible to ignore.
@Gungets Tuft: It certainly does and I’m sure the private high schools are also feeling the pinch. I know that Highbury advertise extensively and there are empty spots in the school. Also know of cases where boys did not make the cut at the likes of Westville / College / Glenwood and ended up at the privates. This tells me that a parent faced with Glenwood/College with boarding for R70k or Kearsney with boarding at R130/140k are seeing value in the former option and taking the latter as a last resort. If things were more flush they would probably go for the private option without hesitation. Times are tough!!
Its not that DPHS is the only decent school, its that they have the most kzn represnetation, a quality which high schools love. Their results vs kzn opposition have been all wins in the past 2 years and last year and in 2011 I think they only lost to Selborne.
@grassy
As for Penzance, I think the last good year was 2009 where they had the likes of Mngadi(Glenwood 1st, SA U16), Gouws, Philaretou(DHS 1st) etc. These years they just provide B team players to Glenwood although last year they had a goood flyhalf in Van Rensburg.
DPHS usually get about 25-30 boys oon scholarship. Madness!
@GreenBlooded: I wonder if the generally tight economic situation affects schools like Highbury, and to a lesser extent DPHS. I was paying R2800 a month at DPHS 3 years ago (I guess the windows and roof still need fixing so they would have pumped fees by another 11% or more each year ), Highbury is R4500 a month (10 months) for Grade 1, R6700 for Grade 7. I wonder if that scares off prospective parents, considering you have to have some tin to even ask about Highbury .. guess it must .. perhaps we should ask Roger …???
@Grasshopper: Not sure how they did at the Glenwood festival. I don’t think they have every ascended to the level of Glenwood Prep though – in my day they were certainly a lot stronger than Park View (which became Glenwood Prep). I notice that La Marque Jr is on the staff at Penzance – not sure whether just as a hired gun or if he is following Steve into teaching and there as an intern.
@Gungets Tuft: Eish – the DPHS Highbury clash may have been close then but last year I think Highbury copped a 50+ point hiding!! This year didn;t start well for them with a 17-0 loss against Graeme College this weekend. They are still one of the KERF featured primary schools being the main feeder into Kearsney. As I’ve said before – a great pity that there will not be some decent primary school clashes this year – it will be Westville SP, Highbury and Glenwood Prep all against KZN Development. Would rather see the Dev team play one of the fixtures and DPHS and perhaps Pelham or Hllcrest SP take the other 2 spots. They also moved the fixtures to sparrows-fart which means we will have to run like hell come lunchtime if we don’t want to miss the action.
@CapeMan: It’s not only DPHS, that implies that they are the only decent primary school in KZN. They have a big derby against Highbury (feeds mostly Kearsney, with a few to College and Westville) which has been pretty close for a few years, certainly was for the 2004-2010, couple of years in there where the results were split. Merchiston in PMB are also a decent school and their kids are highly sought after. Glenwood have an “information session” there once a year. Pelham have their moments, two of their boys are on bursaries to Glenwood. Cordwallis (private) are a good rugby school and their kids feed House, Hilton and St Charles.
The Durban schools are well known, except nobody mentioned Northlands, Virginia and Chelsea who also have their share of good performers. They feed Northwood, DHS, Glenwood, Clifton and a few up the hill to Kearsney. DPHS does get a “disproportionate” number of the really good sportsmen, probably due to their reputation as a good school (old fashioned values, tight ship run by Neave/Pike/Phipson and the other staff) and also due to their reputation as being a bit of a scholarship hunting ground.
Its very interesting how it works out in kzn. Alot of recruiting is done from all the schools for the dphs boys. Makes for a very interesting topic at the old boy functions. As far as us Capetonians in the southern suburbs go, each of the four boys schools(Bishops, Rondebosch, SACS & Wynberg) each have a junior/prep school and these schools feed directly to the senior schools but there are many many primary schools in cape town such as the Grove, Sweet Valley, st josephs, fish hoek, blouberg, milnerton that spread their boys to the four southern suburb boy schools. One thing i do think is that the eastern cape primary schools are formidable and schools from around the country offer bursaries to kids from there.
Re Michaelhouse, they attract from all over due to the high costs, it’s pretty much for any parents who can afford R200k a year, which is only a handful especially if you have 2 or more boys there. So Michaelhouse probably even gets boys from the UK, Australia etc…..also politicians sons etc. I’, sure plenty of the boys come from Bryanston, Sandton etc where parents are on like 3 bar plus…Hilton will be the same……
@Amalekite: I’ve always thought of Cordwalles and Clifton notties as the two major Natal feeder schools to MHS. There is always a spread of other schools as well – Clifton Dbn – Pat Lambie’s alma mater – Highbury etc. Jhb is similar – largely the Ridge & Pridwin but also from St Johns/Davids/Peters etc. The Cronje twins came from Trinity House in Jhb for eg. Others such as Mike Rhodes come from the Lowveld and other farming areas like Dundee, Vryheid and Pongola (Ruan Combrinck).
@Amalekite: In fact Cordwalles was founded as the main feeder school to Michaelhouse. From the schools website:
Cordwalles Preparatory School was founded by Bishop Samuel Baines in 1912 as a direct result of Michaelhouse moving from Pietermaritzburg to Balgowan and needing a preparatory school of its own to ensure its future enrolment.
It was in March 1911, Bishop of Natal, Rev. FS Baines and the Board of Governors of Michaelhouse decided that it was very important for Michaelhouse to have a preparatory school of its own, so that there would be a steady stream of boys of the correct age to enter Michaelhouse. At that time, Michaelhouse itself was very small, with only 59 pupils, so was itself unable to make funds available to open a new school.
@meadows:
Yeah true, the mhs oldboys twitter handle put that up a few months ago but yeah they attract from everywhere. I’ve also noticed they offer quite a few scholarships to boys at Pridwin and the Ridge too
@HORSEFLY NO.1: @GreenBlooded: I’m not sure what the split currently is but MHS (and Hilton) have also always drawn substantial numbers of their intake from outside of Natal. The JHB prep schools – the Ridge and Pridwin for eg – as well as further afield in SA and other parts of Africa (Zim, Zambia, Kenya etc)
@Gungets Tuft:
Eish, that sucks(for other schools that is). If the boy isn’t in gr.7 then she won’t be too influential this year. Saw Kearsney u14A rugby line-up, three very good former Prep boys there.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Unless I am mistake UberSuperMom aka SAWOTY is going to be influential for another year or two. Might be wrong, think there is another boy still at the school.
@beet
Although some would beg to differ,DPHS is still a feeder school to DHS, maybe not as much as we would like but with about 35 out of 75 usually going to DHS, I’d call it a feeder school
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah I know but I meant that its mainly Old Boys kids, don’t get me wrong there are still boys from Prep who go there without being oldies kids, was just told 7 out of 9 in this years gr.8 group were.
Seems supermoms do all the work these days. Wonder if there are already any this year trying to tell kids to forget about DHS and go to Kearsney for example.
Yeah our current U16A cricket cappie, U16A rugby cappie, headboy, deputy head and top music boys are all Prep boys and it definitely doesn’t go unnoticed.
It was always in the Patter, think DHS has gotten lazy now, don’t see their section anymore
@Grasshopper: in New Zealand for some time but no accent that I could hear. More a Captonian accent I think with just a touch of Queens English in there :-)
Can’t remember a head more straight up and down, approachable and set on doing the right thing right. I am sure he will bring experience from Queens, Wynberg and New Zealand
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Although I see your point about DPHS boys in particular, agreed, although we have had some very successful DPHS boys at College who were not OBs sons. Andrew Hay and Jesse Fillaferro spring to mind, both DPHS boys who went on to become Head Boy at College. Don’t underestimate the value of that “advertising” as DPHS were not slow to put it into the Patter and yearbook (I think). Add Reegan as Deputy head, and the fact that at one stage last year the captains of 1st, 2nd, 3rd, U15A rugby and 1st Cricket were all DPHS Old Boys, something that did not go unnoticed at the school, a little birdy tends tends to send info to LH.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: remember that DHS has its share of SuperMoms, I know a few. What sets them apart from the UberSuperMom from DPHS last year was tactics. You know the DHS mom I’m am talking about, she sold the strengths of School without the stealth undermining of other schools. Recruiting with honour.
As for College only getting Old Boys sons, way off the marks there. This year I believe there were 9 Old Boys kids in total, 7 of them DPHS.
I think that DPHS sets itself aside to an extent by the fact that it is quite expensive, about R3000 a month now?. That probably means that many of the parents (me excluded) are able to afford private school. I don’t think I am oversimplifying when I say that a large number of those families can afford private schools and will take that option. Similarly there are probably quite a few College Old Boys that cannot pony up the R70,000 that it costs to send a boy to board at College, so you will see them at schools local to where the OB lives.
All just summising though, would only know if we try to survey all College Old Boys. I am told there are 3000 OBs living in PMB which supports my views of PMB being a dying town, with the added downside of a declining KZN farming industry not helping fill the BE with our traditional support base. Eeisch, lots of issues, all to be dealt with in the course of things. College remains strong, the new head is adding a nice personal touch, there is a magnificent feeling on campus. As they say in the classics, if i was College opposition in the next 10 years “be afraid, be very afraid” :-)
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I seriously beg to differ. My wife taught there under Louis and was on his management team for about 5 years. He is VERY pro Glenwood and pushes Glenwood very hard. She never once heard him mention DHS in the years that she was there. I think you have this one very wrong……actually – I KNOW you have this very wrong. She is still in touch with people who are there and is on the pulse of things there.
@GreenBlooded:
Well Louis isn’t NOT loyal .
Maybe that was at the request of Glenwood because before then waaaay too many boys were going across the Berea. It has decreased abit now but its still too much for Glenwoods liking. Glenwood had about 15 or so boys from GWD Prep this year in gr.8 and 10 of them are on bursary. I know of 4 that wouldve gone to DHS had it not been for the bursary(dhs didn’t offer them)
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah maybe so but their twitter page did announce that the biggest feeder school for this years gr.8 for them was Clifton Nottingham Road hence me saying so.
You’ll be surprised at how many end up at DHS whom were headhunted by others. As for College, most of the boys don’t really go there unless they are old boys sons. I think 7/9 that are doing gr.8 there are oldies sons and only 2 can be regarded as the CREAM.
You will also be surprised at how many WANT to end up at DHS but due to initiatives and supermoms etc don’t. Gungets knows more about that.
I can think of at LEAST 5 former Prep boys at DHS that were head-hunted probably all kzn schools. One of them is kzn for all his sports and isn’t bad at all on the academic side of things.
Not too many go up to Hilton and MHS mate. About 6 in total.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Michaelhouse official feeder school is Cordwalles in Martizburg.
Do you really think the cream of DPHS end up at DHS? I have my doubts. I think you will find that the cream get headhunted but the privates up the hill, Clifton and many of them go to Maritzburg College.
@Grasshopper: I don’t know that Arde is that loyal to DHS. It was him that changed the school name to Glenwood Prep and changed the uniform to Glenwood colours and touted it as the ‘home of the junior Grasshoppers’. He is very, very tight with TK and has aligned the school as closely to Glenwood as it is possible to be. If Glenwood Prep kids are flooding to DHS then it is certainly not him behind it.
@Grasshopper:
yeah them too. WSPS seem to be good in SOME years though hence Westville usually having a lot or either just one from there. Glenwood rely on GWD prep and Penzance for depth especially. The boys coming from there might not be good enough for 1st team but they sure make a good B team and 4 years later an unbeaten 2nd side like last year
@HORSEFLY NO.1: what about Merchiston for College and Westville Senior Primary for Westville? Glenwood has always relied in good old tough kids from the Bluff, Umbilo and the Borough! Not much rugby experience but tough kids who are fighters!
@Grasshopper:
Yah think that’s how it is everywhere. Only difference is that some schools have feeder schools that are partially loyal and have good rugby teams. If your feeder school isn’t good enough then you have to look elsewhere. Glenwood has decided to instead put about 6 development guys at GWD Prep and then offer scholarships later which is fine.
DHS is just lucky that DPHS is a really good sporting school. so is Kearsney with Highbury
@horsie, you mistook my statement, it had nothing to do with the boys not making it through to senior rugby and more to do with Glenwood gets it talent from numerous sources and then tries to form a team which means it may take a year or two for them to gel. If DHS got 80% of the DPHS side they can hit the road running eg last years side. College is another that gets a group of kids from many different schools.
@Grasshopper:
Glenwood to my knowledge usually offer about 5 or so Prep boys rugby scholarships and usually nobody accepts beside maybe 1. The thing about DPHS boys is flawed since so many of them are still performing so well for their schools at open level. Think of Matt Jackson(the big WBHS prop), Dayne Mare,D du Preez, J-L duPreez,G.Francis,M.Reece-Edwards,R.Killian,Bradley Ellse,Keegan Paverd,James Hall,Daryn Goodson,Masikane Mazwi. They are all playing opens 1st or 2nd for their schools and are doing well to this day.
A school that manages to get a lot of boys from a DPHS rugby team that was really good will generally be pretty good. Same goes for the current DHS U15A side.
At u14 level this year they are quite spread out with DHS having 3, College 2, MHS 2, Kearsney 3, Glenwood 1, Hilton 2, WBHS about 2.
@Horsie, the thing is Glenwood doesn’t need all of the DPHS side, they just need the best from each of the participating schools. Yes, the DPHS guys will know each other and play together in grade 8 so will probably have a good year. However, once all the good kids from the other schools start to gel by grade 9 or Under15 they start to play better. The key for DHS is to keep the DPHS group together, almost impossible to do when Westville, Kearsney, College, Hilton and Michaelhouse are throwing bursaries at them. I don’t think Glenwood actively offer bursaries to DPHS knowing they will have 4 or 5 other offers and considering the rivalry. Glenwood just need to stop the rot at Glenwood Prep, far too many going over to Musgrave for my liking. Arde being the instigator here for obvious reasons. Pretoria is also becoming a feeder area for Glenwood…
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah true. They do go to all schools but more often than not 55% of them are at DHS.
RE Glenwood. Doubt they’ll be there next year, maybe 2 maximum. The ones who do go there go because they are old boys sons. Think it has a little to do with the dhs glenwood rivalry.
Were there DHS scouts there? If so I wonder what the GWD reps felt about it?
Don’t think anyone with their right mind would stay away from that tournie. I certainly wouldnt
Ja Horsey – there we go. Personally I hope the parents do what is best for their boys – not suits their pockets the best or what sounds most impressive in Daddy’s four-ball or Mommy’s book-club. DPHS boys go to all schools. I know there are about 9 in the boarding house at Maritzburg College, one prominent one at Glenwood and countless others at the privates and Westville. Hopefully after getting a taste of Glenwood, some of them will go there as well.
Just hope those DHS talent scouts had Glenwood’s blessing to be there on a recruitment drive. Wouldn’t support the cause next time DHS raises ethical concerns now would it. The same goes for the others – specially the man with the clipboard. Hope he had the decency to stay away.
@GreenBlooded:
I see DPHS 1st beat Dale Junior. The parents of those boys will now have theirr phones rigning non-stop after this festival. Hopefully a few of them will answer only the DHS calls
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah seemed to be enjoying his time. Wouldve loved to see him back in the flyhalf position in the A side though. Played well there. Also helped that he had a player he’d been playing with for years at inside centre in Noot.
As for successful DPHS teams, although its still early, their 2011 side seem to be doing well at HS level thus far. Guys like Harker,van Noordwyk,Hlope,Spooner,Hamilton,Walker,Conversano,Simpson,Kershaw,Moletshe, Mertsch all doing well!
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Tristan probably handed out a few concussions. He is one solid young man. Prop … eeisch.
@Gungets Tuft:
Tristan Ross did the exact same last year. Stopped rugby too focus on cricket and turned out as a prop for the U15C a week later. Except he didn’t get concussed
@Pedantic: I remember he got a solid concussion last year as well, was out for a month at the same time as my son was hospitalised, remember him running the line during the College game. Perhaps they both have thin skulls. He is a cricket talent so perhaps that is his game.
@Gungets Tuft: Koekemoer decided not to play rugby this season but in true sportsman style couldn’t keep himself off the field and debuted in the C’s a couple weeks ago, getting a big knock and possible concussion in the process.
With his obvious cricketing talent I guess he has decided to focus on that instead.
@Gungets Tuft:
Nope not playing. Way too many have taken this road for this age-group
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Koekemoer? .. Not playing any more??
@flyparent:
I meant that there aren’t doing as well as other years in rugby which is true. Keyword being as. Fact is, some are still doing well in anycase. Guys like Mthembu,Swanepoel,Holdcroft,Whitfield,Simpson,Noot.
In other years its much better. Not saying its because of the boys though…
Yes some have done very well in other codes. Eg last years DHS U15A polo side had a great 4th term with a climax of beating Clifton 5-2 in their last game.
The cricket boys are also doing quite well
@flyparent: Tend to agree with you. I don’t think it was 2010 stellar year for DPHS, there was way, way too much parental interference (it reached a crescendo in 2010 as far as I could see) and not the best teams picked as a result. However, many of those in the 2010 year have gone on to do very well. The boys who have not managed to go on to top teams in high school have had their early size advantage not carry on into high school, and have had mom and dad not being as influencial as they were. Others, overlooked for potential at primary school, have gone on to do very well at High School – I saw one of these “pigeonholes” playing 2nd Water polo for their school in Gr10. There, I said it.
@Horsefly No.1: It is a bit harsh to brand the DPHS 1st XV of 2010 as not doing too well at HS level. If you check more closely you will find that at least 15 of the 24 are all playing A team level Rugby at their respective HS.
Two others were until this year and have now given up rugby along with a couple of others who have given up at some point since starting HS.
Of those not playing A team level or of whom I am not sure of their rugby position, there are 2 provincial cricketers (I think), 1 provincial water polo player, 1 1st X1 hockey player and 1 very high level paddler.
It seems as if the DPHS 1st XV of 2010 are doing alright to me, albeit not all on the rugby field. Coincidentally at least 6 of the boys still playing rugby are also very successful academics!
@GreenBlooded: I agree with you, and I’m talking from experience. Value for money, DPHS is the way to go versus Highbury.
The parents pay the same fees up the hill, but they are not all equal. Certain boys are more equal than others for reasons only they would know.
They generally have very talented sportsmen, but tend not to give them recognition and encouragement. The coaching and approach to rugby and most other sports is very old school.
There have been many occasions when certain parents ( ex International and provincial players ) have offered their help, but have been turned down. I find this really strange.
They are making huge efforts in marketing via the media etc. What that they do not realise is, that one of the best ways to market a boys school, is to achieve really good sporting results, especially on the rugby field. Imagine if they were on par with DPHS in rugby ?
@HORSEFLY NO.1: It would be interesting to see the stats of the conversion rate of primary schools Craven Week players to Grant Khomo, U18 Craven week and even 1stXv level at their chosen senior schools.
My sense is that it is not very good, especially amongst the forwards, where I think you see a lot of early developers at the U13 CW.
I can recall several boys arriving at MHS as U14’s as Craven week reps, being outstanding initially, sometimes even up to U16, and then falling out of the picture and not even playing 1stXv in matric. In one instance the player in question was displaced by one who had played B team until the latter part of his U16 year and who then went on to play for the Sharks and is a Bok 7’s player.
Pat Lambie did not play U13 Craven Week or Grant Khomo but made the Craven Week and SA schools side in Grade 11 in his first year of open rugby. At U14 to U16 level the star of that group was Awande Khumalo from Crdwalles who had played at U13 CW and GK. Khumalo made the Craven Week side in 2008 but did not go on to play pro rugby.
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah. The best thing for me though has been to see some of these boys doing well in HS rugby. Boys like Jackson,Visser,Mare,du preez,Francis,Goodson,Tedder,Reece-Edwards,Ellse,Paverd.
The 2010 group isn’t doing to well at HS level. Some not even in A teams.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: That team with the Doops, Reece, Jackson, Guy Francis and others was Michael Dicks “dream team”. They were better than good, they were outstanding. Something like 13 in the KZN side, they simply crushed everyone they played. I remember going on the Cape Town tour with the school, seeing them demolish SACS, Wynberg and Rondebosch (I think).
@House:
Lol which one? They’ve been strong every year since 2008 except 2010. They only lost twice in past 2 years( think both to Selborne).
Think DHS has managed to get a couple of top talents every years nnow since 2009. Already 3 for next year including 2 development boys put into the school by DHS.
House players Thomas Walker and Tyran Faber are part of the 2009 DPHS team which was pretty good.
@horse that dphs year was very strong
@House:
Yeah there’s 5 DPHS boys in Kearsney 1st side and only 3 at WBHS. Most are in matric though.
DHS currently have 3 in their 1st side. They had 7 in last years U14A side and about 8 for the U14s of the years before.
@ruggaman:
This depends on the success of the feeder schools tho, if the feeder school was good that year then they’ll have the high school offer quite afew bursaries and the chance to have a decent number 5 years later is large. Simple really.
ruggaman i think there are more dphs than highbury boys in the kearsney 1stxv, quite a few prep boys in the westville side as well
Would be interested to see the stats with regards to how many kids start at the traditional primary feeder school, and end up playing first team at the school. For example wsps to westville, dphs to dhs, merchiston to college etc. Looking at last years teams can only think of Kearsney (highbury) and college who had decent amounts. Also st Charles maybe with their junior school?
@GreenBlooded:
I think that DHS and Glenwood are doing great things by putting development players from unknown schools into DPHS and GWD Prep respectively
@GB I reckon 99% of those talented kids from the smaller schools are snapped up by the big highschools anyway, representitive selections are very subjective with a quota to boot
@House: Not with you?? I’m talking about at zonal and provincial trials where kids from certain schools are at a massive advantage – not within the kid’s own school.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I have a son at Highbury and a nephew at DPHS. If I knew then what I know now, and were it not for the morning traffic schlepp – I would have sent him to DPHS. Not for the reason’s you mention however (Highbury is also on the favoured list) but because I think DPHS is far better value for money.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Not saying that at all – but is it worth offering U13 boys a free ride through high school in the hope of him being a good 1t team player one day when the conversion rate is so low? 75% may be stretching things a bit. I’d say more like 50-60% correct. The view is very different when you are at a non-favoured school and you see talented boys getting stiffed.
@Grasshopper:
It doesn’t guarantee anything but if you can afford it and you want to get a scholarship, DPHS is probably thje best place to go
@Greenblooded tend to disagree with you, it is a lot easier for a talented kid to stand out in a smaller school and get noticed, I do agree however that primary school sport is just that and does not translate into highschool success
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah I’ve noticed that the boys from lesser known schools are usually put in the KZN U13B sides. Someone also mentioned that kzn u13b rugby had a better conversion rate than u13a. I would say 75% of primary schoolss selections are correct. Just because the conversion rate is quite small it doesn’t mean they got it wrong at U13. Remember, 5 years is a looong time.
@GreenBlooded: Totally agree! I was at Brighton Beach on the Bluff, a very good gov primary school at the time (not sure now) with some excellent sportsman. We had to go through allsorts of trials etc to even make South Durban. Most of the time the teams had already been picked so we would have to have done something amazing to get noticed. However, a few of us did thank goodness. The 1st team rugby in 1996, which was admittedly not Glenwood’s best had 4 Bluff boys playing of whom not one had played rugby at primary school. One was the head boy and captain. Going to DPHS does not guarantee anything. Our best player that year, Greg Manning was a DPHS old boy though….
@HORSEFLY NO.1: As has been noted many times before, KZN representation at primary school level is not all it is cracked up to be for 2 reasons: 1. Success at U13 level does not always translate to success at U18 level and 2. The KZN selections at U13 levels are so blatantly biased towards certain schools (DPHS certainly being one of them) that many talented yougsters which would well make the KZN teams are overlooked. The way to find the truely talented youngster would be to start with the KZN boys who are NOT at the favoured schools because you know then that he is at least 5x as good to have been noticed. Classic example is last year’s U13 Craven Week captain who was at Kloof Senior Primary (where is that??) who is streaks ahead of anyone in terms of rugby talent and was impossible to ignore.
@Gungets Tuft: It certainly does and I’m sure the private high schools are also feeling the pinch. I know that Highbury advertise extensively and there are empty spots in the school. Also know of cases where boys did not make the cut at the likes of Westville / College / Glenwood and ended up at the privates. This tells me that a parent faced with Glenwood/College with boarding for R70k or Kearsney with boarding at R130/140k are seeing value in the former option and taking the latter as a last resort. If things were more flush they would probably go for the private option without hesitation. Times are tough!!
Its not that DPHS is the only decent school, its that they have the most kzn represnetation, a quality which high schools love. Their results vs kzn opposition have been all wins in the past 2 years and last year and in 2011 I think they only lost to Selborne.
@grassy
As for Penzance, I think the last good year was 2009 where they had the likes of Mngadi(Glenwood 1st, SA U16), Gouws, Philaretou(DHS 1st) etc. These years they just provide B team players to Glenwood although last year they had a goood flyhalf in Van Rensburg.
DPHS usually get about 25-30 boys oon scholarship. Madness!
@GreenBlooded: I wonder if the generally tight economic situation affects schools like Highbury, and to a lesser extent DPHS. I was paying R2800 a month at DPHS 3 years ago (I guess the windows and roof still need fixing so they would have pumped fees by another 11% or more each year
), Highbury is R4500 a month (10 months) for Grade 1, R6700 for Grade 7. I wonder if that scares off prospective parents, considering you have to have some tin to even ask about Highbury .. guess it must .. perhaps we should ask Roger …??? 
@Grasshopper: Not sure how they did at the Glenwood festival. I don’t think they have every ascended to the level of Glenwood Prep though – in my day they were certainly a lot stronger than Park View (which became Glenwood Prep). I notice that La Marque Jr is on the staff at Penzance – not sure whether just as a hired gun or if he is following Steve into teaching and there as an intern.
@Greenblooded and Gungets, where do Penzance sit these days? They usually supplied about half of the decent rugby players at Glenwood..
@Gungets Tuft: Eish – the DPHS Highbury clash may have been close then but last year I think Highbury copped a 50+ point hiding!! This year didn;t start well for them with a 17-0 loss against Graeme College this weekend. They are still one of the KERF featured primary schools being the main feeder into Kearsney. As I’ve said before – a great pity that there will not be some decent primary school clashes this year – it will be Westville SP, Highbury and Glenwood Prep all against KZN Development. Would rather see the Dev team play one of the fixtures and DPHS and perhaps Pelham or Hllcrest SP take the other 2 spots. They also moved the fixtures to sparrows-fart which means we will have to run like hell come lunchtime if we don’t want to miss the action.
@CapeMan: It’s not only DPHS, that implies that they are the only decent primary school in KZN. They have a big derby against Highbury (feeds mostly Kearsney, with a few to College and Westville) which has been pretty close for a few years, certainly was for the 2004-2010, couple of years in there where the results were split. Merchiston in PMB are also a decent school and their kids are highly sought after. Glenwood have an “information session” there once a year. Pelham have their moments, two of their boys are on bursaries to Glenwood. Cordwallis (private) are a good rugby school and their kids feed House, Hilton and St Charles.
The Durban schools are well known, except nobody mentioned Northlands, Virginia and Chelsea who also have their share of good performers. They feed Northwood, DHS, Glenwood, Clifton and a few up the hill to Kearsney. DPHS does get a “disproportionate” number of the really good sportsmen, probably due to their reputation as a good school (old fashioned values, tight ship run by Neave/Pike/Phipson and the other staff) and also due to their reputation as being a bit of a scholarship hunting ground.
Its very interesting how it works out in kzn. Alot of recruiting is done from all the schools for the dphs boys. Makes for a very interesting topic at the old boy functions. As far as us Capetonians in the southern suburbs go, each of the four boys schools(Bishops, Rondebosch, SACS & Wynberg) each have a junior/prep school and these schools feed directly to the senior schools but there are many many primary schools in cape town such as the Grove, Sweet Valley, st josephs, fish hoek, blouberg, milnerton that spread their boys to the four southern suburb boy schools. One thing i do think is that the eastern cape primary schools are formidable and schools from around the country offer bursaries to kids from there.
@Roger: I suppose Maths Literacy at a R200K school is out of the question?
If it was co-ed I would definitely want to do biology. Skip wearing my specs and insist on braille in anatomy ….
@Gungets Tuft: as long as you write the chemistry paper
@Gungets Tuft:
@Roger: I earn the remaining R500k – can we get a team spot, like a timeshare, I get the final 4 weeks of the last term???
@Grasshopper: heh Grassy – I live in Sandton but only earn 2,5 a year – please can I join, oh please, oh please, oh please
Re Michaelhouse, they attract from all over due to the high costs, it’s pretty much for any parents who can afford R200k a year, which is only a handful especially if you have 2 or more boys there. So Michaelhouse probably even gets boys from the UK, Australia etc…..also politicians sons etc. I’, sure plenty of the boys come from Bryanston, Sandton etc where parents are on like 3 bar plus…Hilton will be the same……
@Amalekite: I’ve always thought of Cordwalles and Clifton notties as the two major Natal feeder schools to MHS. There is always a spread of other schools as well – Clifton Dbn – Pat Lambie’s alma mater – Highbury etc. Jhb is similar – largely the Ridge & Pridwin but also from St Johns/Davids/Peters etc. The Cronje twins came from Trinity House in Jhb for eg. Others such as Mike Rhodes come from the Lowveld and other farming areas like Dundee, Vryheid and Pongola (Ruan Combrinck).
@Amalekite: In fact Cordwalles was founded as the main feeder school to Michaelhouse. From the schools website:
Cordwalles Preparatory School was founded by Bishop Samuel Baines in 1912 as a direct result of Michaelhouse moving from Pietermaritzburg to Balgowan and needing a preparatory school of its own to ensure its future enrolment.
It was in March 1911, Bishop of Natal, Rev. FS Baines and the Board of Governors of Michaelhouse decided that it was very important for Michaelhouse to have a preparatory school of its own, so that there would be a steady stream of boys of the correct age to enter Michaelhouse. At that time, Michaelhouse itself was very small, with only 59 pupils, so was itself unable to make funds available to open a new school.
@meadows: One of the other main MH feeder schools in KZN is Cordwalles.
@meadows:
Yeah true, the mhs oldboys twitter handle put that up a few months ago but yeah they attract from everywhere. I’ve also noticed they offer quite a few scholarships to boys at Pridwin and the Ridge too
@HORSEFLY NO.1: @GreenBlooded: I’m not sure what the split currently is but MHS (and Hilton) have also always drawn substantial numbers of their intake from outside of Natal. The JHB prep schools – the Ridge and Pridwin for eg – as well as further afield in SA and other parts of Africa (Zim, Zambia, Kenya etc)
@Gungets Tuft:
Eish, that sucks(for other schools that is). If the boy isn’t in gr.7 then she won’t be too influential this year. Saw Kearsney u14A rugby line-up, three very good former Prep boys there.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Unless I am mistake UberSuperMom aka SAWOTY is going to be influential for another year or two. Might be wrong, think there is another boy still at the school.
@beet
Although some would beg to differ,DPHS is still a feeder school to DHS, maybe not as much as we would like but with about 35 out of 75 usually going to DHS, I’d call it a feeder school
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah I know but I meant that its mainly Old Boys kids, don’t get me wrong there are still boys from Prep who go there without being oldies kids, was just told 7 out of 9 in this years gr.8 group were.
Seems supermoms do all the work these days. Wonder if there are already any this year trying to tell kids to forget about DHS and go to Kearsney for example.
Yeah our current U16A cricket cappie, U16A rugby cappie, headboy, deputy head and top music boys are all Prep boys and it definitely doesn’t go unnoticed.
It was always in the Patter, think DHS has gotten lazy now, don’t see their section anymore
@Grasshopper: in New Zealand for some time but no accent that I could hear. More a Captonian accent I think with just a touch of Queens English in there :-)
Can’t remember a head more straight up and down, approachable and set on doing the right thing right. I am sure he will bring experience from Queens, Wynberg and New Zealand
@Gungets Tuft: On the new version of Tippex 321, I see that the word UberSuperMom gets automatically replaced by “SA Woman of the Year Nominee”
Not sure why but I think the programme’s logic just recognises good work when it comes across it.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Although I see your point about DPHS boys in particular, agreed, although we have had some very successful DPHS boys at College who were not OBs sons. Andrew Hay and Jesse Fillaferro spring to mind, both DPHS boys who went on to become Head Boy at College. Don’t underestimate the value of that “advertising” as DPHS were not slow to put it into the Patter and yearbook (I think). Add Reegan as Deputy head, and the fact that at one stage last year the captains of 1st, 2nd, 3rd, U15A rugby and 1st Cricket were all DPHS Old Boys, something that did not go unnoticed at the school, a little birdy tends tends to send info to LH.
@Gungets, heard the new head had been living in NZ a while, does he have a kiwi accent? Maybe bring in some of the good ideas from the Kiwi system?
@HORSEFLY NO.1: remember that DHS has its share of SuperMoms, I know a few. What sets them apart from the UberSuperMom from DPHS last year was tactics. You know the DHS mom I’m am talking about, she sold the strengths of School without the stealth undermining of other schools. Recruiting with honour.
As for College only getting Old Boys sons, way off the marks there. This year I believe there were 9 Old Boys kids in total, 7 of them DPHS.
I think that DPHS sets itself aside to an extent by the fact that it is quite expensive, about R3000 a month now?. That probably means that many of the parents (me excluded) are able to afford private school. I don’t think I am oversimplifying when I say that a large number of those families can afford private schools and will take that option. Similarly there are probably quite a few College Old Boys that cannot pony up the R70,000 that it costs to send a boy to board at College, so you will see them at schools local to where the OB lives.
All just summising though, would only know if we try to survey all College Old Boys. I am told there are 3000 OBs living in PMB which supports my views of PMB being a dying town, with the added downside of a declining KZN farming industry not helping fill the BE with our traditional support base. Eeisch, lots of issues, all to be dealt with in the course of things. College remains strong, the new head is adding a nice personal touch, there is a magnificent feeling on campus. As they say in the classics, if i was College opposition in the next 10 years “be afraid, be very afraid” :-)
@GreenBlooded:
I did say MAYBE…
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I seriously beg to differ. My wife taught there under Louis and was on his management team for about 5 years. He is VERY pro Glenwood and pushes Glenwood very hard. She never once heard him mention DHS in the years that she was there. I think you have this one very wrong……actually – I KNOW you have this very wrong. She is still in touch with people who are there and is on the pulse of things there.
@GreenBlooded:
.
Well Louis isn’t NOT loyal
Maybe that was at the request of Glenwood because before then waaaay too many boys were going across the Berea. It has decreased abit now but its still too much for Glenwoods liking. Glenwood had about 15 or so boys from GWD Prep this year in gr.8 and 10 of them are on bursary. I know of 4 that wouldve gone to DHS had it not been for the bursary(dhs didn’t offer them)
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah maybe so but their twitter page did announce that the biggest feeder school for this years gr.8 for them was Clifton Nottingham Road hence me saying so.
You’ll be surprised at how many end up at DHS whom were headhunted by others. As for College, most of the boys don’t really go there unless they are old boys sons. I think 7/9 that are doing gr.8 there are oldies sons and only 2 can be regarded as the CREAM.
You will also be surprised at how many WANT to end up at DHS but due to initiatives and supermoms etc don’t. Gungets knows more about that.
I can think of at LEAST 5 former Prep boys at DHS that were head-hunted probably all kzn schools. One of them is kzn for all his sports and isn’t bad at all on the academic side of things.
Not too many go up to Hilton and MHS mate. About 6 in total.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Michaelhouse official feeder school is Cordwalles in Martizburg.
Do you really think the cream of DPHS end up at DHS? I have my doubts. I think you will find that the cream get headhunted but the privates up the hill, Clifton and many of them go to Maritzburg College.
@Grasshopper: I don’t know that Arde is that loyal to DHS. It was him that changed the school name to Glenwood Prep and changed the uniform to Glenwood colours and touted it as the ‘home of the junior Grasshoppers’. He is very, very tight with TK and has aligned the school as closely to Glenwood as it is possible to be. If Glenwood Prep kids are flooding to DHS then it is certainly not him behind it.
Horsey Dale College beat DHS 3-1 today at hockey
Northwood also have Chelsea Prep with Michaelhouse having Clifton Nottingham Road
@Grasshopper:
yeah them too. WSPS seem to be good in SOME years though hence Westville usually having a lot or either just one from there. Glenwood rely on GWD prep and Penzance for depth especially. The boys coming from there might not be good enough for 1st team but they sure make a good B team and 4 years later an unbeaten 2nd side like last year
@HORSEFLY NO.1: what about Merchiston for College and Westville Senior Primary for Westville? Glenwood has always relied in good old tough kids from the Bluff, Umbilo and the Borough! Not much rugby experience but tough kids who are fighters!
@Grasshopper:
Yah think that’s how it is everywhere. Only difference is that some schools have feeder schools that are partially loyal and have good rugby teams. If your feeder school isn’t good enough then you have to look elsewhere. Glenwood has decided to instead put about 6 development guys at GWD Prep and then offer scholarships later which is fine.
DHS is just lucky that DPHS is a really good sporting school. so is Kearsney with Highbury
@horsie, you mistook my statement, it had nothing to do with the boys not making it through to senior rugby and more to do with Glenwood gets it talent from numerous sources and then tries to form a team which means it may take a year or two for them to gel. If DHS got 80% of the DPHS side they can hit the road running eg last years side. College is another that gets a group of kids from many different schools.
@House:
Will be interesting to see where they end up especially since it seems they are every bit as good as last years side
@Grasshopper:
Glenwood to my knowledge usually offer about 5 or so Prep boys rugby scholarships and usually nobody accepts beside maybe 1. The thing about DPHS boys is flawed since so many of them are still performing so well for their schools at open level. Think of Matt Jackson(the big WBHS prop), Dayne Mare,D du Preez, J-L duPreez,G.Francis,M.Reece-Edwards,R.Killian,Bradley Ellse,Keegan Paverd,James Hall,Daryn Goodson,Masikane Mazwi. They are all playing opens 1st or 2nd for their schools and are doing well to this day.
A school that manages to get a lot of boys from a DPHS rugby team that was really good will generally be pretty good. Same goes for the current DHS U15A side.
At u14 level this year they are quite spread out with DHS having 3, College 2, MHS 2, Kearsney 3, Glenwood 1, Hilton 2, WBHS about 2.
Think DHS already have 3 for next year
@Horsie, the thing is Glenwood doesn’t need all of the DPHS side, they just need the best from each of the participating schools. Yes, the DPHS guys will know each other and play together in grade 8 so will probably have a good year. However, once all the good kids from the other schools start to gel by grade 9 or Under15 they start to play better. The key for DHS is to keep the DPHS group together, almost impossible to do when Westville, Kearsney, College, Hilton and Michaelhouse are throwing bursaries at them. I don’t think Glenwood actively offer bursaries to DPHS knowing they will have 4 or 5 other offers and considering the rivalry. Glenwood just need to stop the rot at Glenwood Prep, far too many going over to Musgrave for my liking. Arde being the instigator here for obvious reasons. Pretoria is also becoming a feeder area for Glenwood…
@GreenBlooded:
Yeah true. They do go to all schools but more often than not 55% of them are at DHS.
RE Glenwood. Doubt they’ll be there next year, maybe 2 maximum. The ones who do go there go because they are old boys sons. Think it has a little to do with the dhs glenwood rivalry.
Were there DHS scouts there? If so I wonder what the GWD reps felt about it?
Don’t think anyone with their right mind would stay away from that tournie. I certainly wouldnt
Ja Horsey – there we go. Personally I hope the parents do what is best for their boys – not suits their pockets the best or what sounds most impressive in Daddy’s four-ball or Mommy’s book-club. DPHS boys go to all schools. I know there are about 9 in the boarding house at Maritzburg College, one prominent one at Glenwood and countless others at the privates and Westville. Hopefully after getting a taste of Glenwood, some of them will go there as well.
Just hope those DHS talent scouts had Glenwood’s blessing to be there on a recruitment drive. Wouldn’t support the cause next time DHS raises ethical concerns now would it. The same goes for the others – specially the man with the clipboard. Hope he had the decency to stay away.
@GreenBlooded:
I see DPHS 1st beat Dale Junior. The parents of those boys will now have theirr phones rigning non-stop after this festival. Hopefully a few of them will answer only the DHS calls