@beet: Beet please be carefull. In the old days Indians were banned by law in the States. Souties however was shot on site. When asked why not ban Souties in the States also. An old farmer answered because it is so much fun shooting them.
@Gungets Tuft: Aye GT, the eyes move further apart until they are eventually on the side of the head. Gansbaai other side of Hermanus is an example of such a successful and probably voluntary case study
@beet: Thanks for clearing that up, but for future reference keep in mind that the Northern and Southern Afrikaners don’t have much in common apart from the dialect of Ofrikons they speak, some like BOG refer to them as a sub-culture and others as a concentrated gene pool. I do not necessarily agree with all of this though.
@Ploegskaar: No there was no pattern to it. English and Afrikaans comments were being moderated. A program called Aksimet that prevents spam etc isn’t working well. The Souties however did not think much of it and accepted the problem for what it was. A few others who shall remain nameless however though it was some kind of plot or conspiracy to get rid of them.
@Gungets Tuft: You spot on there MC have played QC 20 times and are ahead by one only thing you must remember is only 3 of these games were ever played at home for Queens
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I keep hearing “the better team lost”, not just from you, all over the place. College have no intention of extending the scoreboard for a Remarks Column. All we have is the score after 70 minutes of rugby. By all means take heart from performances, but talk of lucky there, unlucky here, it’s enough to make a monkey bite it’s mother.
By that logic rugby will be like ballet or gymnastics where you get points for the Artistic Interpretation.
And College would not have decided the offsets, that is the “offset team” that decides. Check closer to home.
@horsefly NO.1:
In no way do I disagree with college being stronger (generally) but its the logic behind some of the staggering I don’t get. Glad I’m not the only one.
16A’s close win against a stronger, bigger transvalia earlier this year showed their hunger
And with new head of rugby,” coach Nass” as the new coach they may also do better than expected.
then again I’m very patriotic to DHS and as a result
I am naïve.
@School:
Yeah agree with those games. Dunno why College decided on DHS U15B to play their C side even though DHS U14B beat College U14B last year. That’s a weird one for me. The U14B this year are also pretty good while the U14 and U15A sides. I rate too. U16A was one I looked forward too. They’ve had some bad luck but their performances vs College have been amazing. Last year they were better IMO
@CapeMan: I have to agree, there is no consistency. There are schools in the Paarl that would cancel a match if the field is NOT covered in 6 inches of rain
@School: It means not delayed to later today. Look, it is a crowded fixture list this year with the 150th and Wildeklawer, but one would hope they could work something out for at least the 1st team and the A-teams. I have no influence, it is hard to see where it would fit unless in the 3rd term. Depends on the will I guess. We can only hope.
@CapeMan: The College motivation would have been partly due to the 1/2 Fixture fill-up (the rest filled up with teams from all over the place that we will have already played), as well as the desire to preserve the fields for Wildeklawer in 10 days.
@star: I just got back from Westville and it was looking quite light. Back in Durban North now and it is closing in a bit again but no rain. You might just get lucky there.
@grasshopper:
Also a list of games I gave DHS a fair chance of taking today.(Realistically)
14A,14B
15A,15B
16A*(good game last year)
2nd vs 3rd
3rd vs 5th
*just the few I know and watch very closely.
@gungets tuft:
Love you idea of playing the DHS games without offsets, also think these games being cancelled is a blessing in disguise.
If DHS have the shock success story I predict then peoples opinions may have changed and the hype around this game may be a lot greater.
*does cancelled not imply not happening anymore(ever)
@Grasshopper: My point is that we never cancelled games even though the rain was literally 100%..We loved it because we could dive and slide when we scored tries. Hence everyone didn’t pass :mrgreen:.I do remember our matrons at the boarding house getting extremely upset because of the mess when we went to shower.
@CapeMan: boet, it’s the same cold front we got here in the Cape, my garden was a pool after 2 days heavy rain. Difference up at Hilton and Michaelhouse is if could be sleet and they too have fog and mist where you can’t even see your own hands….
You Kzn folk are scared of a bit of rain hey :mrgreen:. I remember playing against paarl boys where I couldn’t see more than 5m because of the fog and rain. I do understand though, maybe your fields don’t have proper drainage systems as you guys don’t experience that much rain on a regular basis up there.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: nope, saw it as a joke too boet. You would need to be a little dim if you didn’t see the humour in it. Yes C and D team wins vs F & G sides….
@Grasshopper:
Grassy, many a-time its been the unexpected C or D sides that have won @ College…
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah I honestly hope they do. Feel sorry for those matrics who wouldve loved to play College for one last time, specially at Goldstones.
Was joking about the coward thing, seems Grassy took it another way but yeah thhe U15 boys have lost out
@HORSEFLY NO.1: You will get your chance to put your money down – the schools are close and will almost certainly reschedule, even if a midweek game. It was only 16 fixtures, not as if it is a tough thing to organise. Perhaps College should offer to play team-for-team without offsets, just to prove we are not cowards.
Seems to me DHS have the most to lose, in U15 certainly, since that team has been so hyped.
@Grasshopper:
Haha I can bet It wasn’t. College team is good but I think they are definitely beatable! Their U16s aren’t much better while U15 and U14A were probably/likely going to be landslide victories for DHS.
@Anonymous: frustrating that. Why can’t they consider playing the 16a, 2nd and 1st later if the rain subsides and water drains away? Hopefully Glenwood vs MHS is still on but can’t see how as its close to PMB…:-(
@Rhino: 2 boys to a Westville OB, I think one of the boys might have spent a year in my lift club. If his youngest is in Gr9 you will not have had much success there beating them this year, and they are going to be a very very good unit in the future. I am going out there a bit, but watch this U14 year. If I am right the other kid is U16, this age group is coming right quickly. Savour the victories …
Hah .. ok i will do so and hope it does come to fruition. is a good school indeed. a mate of mine brother who was also a WOB actually has sent his 2 boys to college instead of wbhs and it kinda annoyed me lol .. but he is a true sports orientated man/family so has his reasons but i sometimes laugh as i see his sons results v Westville and they lose… but thats just my own little quiet smirk as i think u must stick to your own ….( just like what u say about college old boys sending theirs to hilton etc )
@Rhino: Doubt you were anywhere near my time. I think I outrank the next oldest here by about 4 years. I oldest is at University already and I didn’t start young.
College won’t go private – even if the government allowed it, which they would not, the costs would be completely unreal. Imagine the cost of that campus virtually in the middle of town, and College would not be College without that (my opinion).
It will be a quiet revolution, retaining the best of 150 years of College and moving rapidly forward as is necessary in a modern world. There won’t be a renaissance moment, but it will be rapid. Keep your eyes peeled.
Were u in similar year as myself? i actually went howick high for 1 term then left and went to westville however funny as i was accepted at college and was a done deal but i suddently said no i want go westville and so all changed. same as kearsney as my dad is Kearsney old boy but i didnt wanna board. life is funny how our paths go etc
Oi you leave hillcrest area and below to us….lol.. u have the midlands your way already so leave the highway area to us ;-)
but jeepers your words are worrying of what u say about the state and how they even treat business deals so openly corrupt. its actually not a joke.
This “trump card” is intrugueing… im guessing college may go private or something like that… maybe you making college into a state of its own lol … only way perhaps to keep going well..lol
I think Westville is on the right track and Trevor Hall is the man who has led it from a good school to a great school ( and yes i know u wont all think so but it is true if you look at the all roundedness of WBHS )…. I think our own rivalry has too started becoming strong as i know college dads who some of which dont like us………….. ha – i laugh cause imo its cause we now threaten and win… old days………… played 28 games… won 2 lost 25, drawn 1 – that kinda thing.. now even………….. is good. ;-)
@Rhino: Interesting. I lived in Howick for about 10 years, went right through primary school at Howick, and my first year of high school.
PMB is FUBAR. It is so disfunctional you would be staggered to know the whole of it. That is why College now struggle to get a lot of the outlying farmers kids, who’s parents now bite the bullet and spring for House, Hilton, Kearsney and St Charles (to a lesser degree), rather than throw their lot in with a government school in a town that drifting down in tighter and tighter circles. There was a ray of light about 2 years ago when they placed the city under administration but the #$@%@#$^ have managed to vote the same dof leaches back into power. Corruption is absolute. I tried to do business with the local municipality about 8 years ago and the deal was put to me, openly in the proposal meeting. School fees for the one son, a replacement of the other okes furniture suite and curtains. They didn’t even take me one side and whisper – it was open and to much mirth. I walked out during the first break and have refused lucrative work since.
Luckily College is not owned by the local municipality and is still the only decent affordable school for many miles. The BE is still oversubscribed more than 4-fold and the school gets more than 2-fold the applications they can accept. With a little creativity you can ensure that most of the boys in the BE are decent kids and at least 50% of the day-boys are contributors, if not more (0ver 50% of the boys travelled to PBHS last weekend which is a great number!!). The main feeder schools are also still in good shape, I could give you names and numbers but am worried about the DHS buses going back to Durban on Saturday with more kids than arrived.
The main issue for us is the Old Boys that choose to send their boys to other schools. Currently at least 20 at Kearsney, couple at House and Hilton as well as St Charles. They have their reasons I am sure and I respect that, but it does seem a shame. Some superb talent not making it’s way from Hillcrest, Kloof and Durban. Such is life – it has been said here but parenting is a partnership and sometimes the wifes wishes also need to be considered. And .. VERY IMPORTANTLY .. College is not a school that necessarily suits every kid. Blind loyalty is very seldom the right thing to do. As Mark Twain said “Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel …”, there have to be other compelling reasons.
College have a trump card being polished up. Not a shadow of doubt that all our “rival” schools will be rubbing their eyes in disbelief over the next 2-5 years. You heard it here first. And not just sport, it will be in all spheres, starting with academics where we are already no slouches but tracked by the soft stuff such as Arts and culture and sport which is level with those on the agenda. Mark this conversation. 8) 8)
I had the shock of my life going into PMB city centre in 2010 ( i was back in SA after 12 years ) and to see the total destruction of what was once a pretty decent/structured/clean’ish city.. i was gobsmacked and worrying for College too being right there… IMO. Anyhow same is for Durbs i know but going into PMB after many years just gave me a shock. I used to live in primary school days in Howick and played against Merchiston and Cordwalles and was great .. and little old Howick primary whipped all of them.. needless to say a fair few went to College at end of std 5. lol
IN fact in 93 v alex which was last match of season our no.6 mccullum who was awesome player broke his neck badly…. thank god he recovered after months in hospital etc and recovery but wasnt pleasant and gave everyone the chill factor of what can happen…
Yeah u right… i love the rivalry even when i get irritated by it lol
Yeah sh*t i forgot about Alex – we also had them on fixture list and was generally a “walkover” – or no thats wrong as they were ok….. rather i should say we would win but so yeah so sad to see it go down so rugby wise…Even Voortrekker i agree as u used to know playing the afrikaans schools you were in for a tough match even if you won…. cant believe alex 1st play college 6ths.. eish… that bad and sad.
@Rhino: And be happy that those rivalries remain after so many years. The College “Must win” derby always used to be Alexandra Road. They never beat College but we have played 27 matches since 1968. This year they were a filler during the GC day and their 1st side played the College 6ths. That’s just sad. Even Voortrekker which is not the school it was (since 1944, 68, 62, 2 draws and 6 losses) still play our seconds and win as many as they lose.
From my Westville perspective i would say our RIVAL or Need to beat as you said would go as so….
1. Kearsney
2.Glenwood
3. College ( nowadays as years ago it just didnt happen even with a good team then )
4. DHS
5. Michaelhouse
6. Hilton
7. Northwood
even an 8th which means nothing as such but just cause of the closeness and the old days when we had to face Pinetown but it was always a trouncing and we loved it ( sly grin )
But my reasoning of Kearsney as first is cause they up the hill and generally even though huge rivalry i never know of a hatred or anything in fact perhaps opposite as lots of WBHS/Kearsney boys are friends etc so figure that is why as wanna get one over etc… also prob been pretty even generally. I loved us beating them in 1993… right wing Caramanus outstripped the much vaunted kearnsey wing ( forget name ) aah Arnold it was i think but think he played ntl schools… and ran around him to score 55 metres try… was great…
BUT DEFO as Grassy says the Westville / GW game was coming into a rivalry even more so in a way and probably due to dislike but even respect as 2 huge and great schools..
@kcob: it’s not that serious. He is just unplayable if the team he supports wins, but depressed to a bipolar degree when not. I generally manage to avoid him, win or lose, but he is like a guided missile when he needs to be smug. Such is life …
@kcob: {low whistle of antici …………pation} for the contributions on this. I have just superglued my hands to the desk in case I thrash out a reply before I put my brain in gear …
My list would be formulated more around the OBs and current parents and who I would like to see dikbek the most :-) …. which would put … sorry okes … Kearsney on top of my list .. and my lips are sealed as to why/who .. :-)
How about adding “Hate to be beaten by..” to the list .. or is that the same list as the “need to beat”. I reckom most KZN bloggers would put DHS on top of the “hate to be beaten by” list because they are expected to beat them and defeat would be really tough to deal with. Next would be Northwood, same reason.
I think Kearsney have always been a middle of the road rugby school, never really shocking the day-lights out of the other KZN schools. I think there has always been a “dislike” and hard rivalry with Westville (not always sure why) but otherwise no REAL historic rivalry.
In more recent times as Kearsney’s rugby has improved, I think the hype games are becoming more prevalent (to a Kearsney old boy anyway).
In order of “Need to Beat those Bast#&d’s”:
Westville
Hilton
Michaelhouse
DHS
Glenwood
College
In order of “We Have Huge Respect”:
College
Glenwood
Michaelhouse
Westville
DHS
Hilton
Just my opinion…eeish, suppose this could open a can of worms…don’t read into it guys…just my opinion!
@kcman: Not that I am aware of, maybe it’s because Kearsney are only 90 odd years old. The nearest big school to them in the same league is Westville. St Stithians might be their longest rivalry, beet will know….
In my humble opinion I still think the Derbies carry so much more weight if they are only played once a season. Bigger build up and no chance of a comeback in the return leg.
Vs DHS – Played (17) – Won (11) – Lost (5) – Drawn (1) – 65% win rate
Based on that current ratio it will take 70 years for Glenwood to equal DHS in wins, considering they would win 35% too…….jeez I might as well give up that ever happening. DHS had a 44 year head start though….
29 games or 29 years to go I’ll be in my 60’s by then. However, Horsie keeps on reminding me about 2016 being the turnaround year so it maybe after my life time before we catch up…
@Grasshopper: Ja in a way it’s a pity that Glenwood vs DHS isn’t twice a season like before. Glenwood could have done a lot more catching up in this last decade in terms of the overall win:loss record, and provided a truer reflection of the shift in rugby power to south of Berea Road.
Then again there is more to rugby than just chancing records and the one off game does tend to make the occasion very special.
@Vleis: SACS and UCT were one until and were known as the South African College. They then split as they thought the college(university) students needed to be seperate. That’s where the ‘school’ part came into our name. The South African College Schools and the college was renamed UCT. Our badges are still the same except for some minor details in which UCT changed. So uct have the exact same sports kit because they were the South African College with us before splitting. WP also get their colours from SACS. In fact the first WP side wore SACS school jerseys. The school still has many ties with UCT.
@beet: Agreed, for a Glenwood Boy the number one priority is to shut our neighbours in the Berea up after years of ridicule and being looked upon as our poor rabble neighbours down near the harbour. My dad still has that attitude, in a friendly way of course. We have many many many more wins required to even get to a point where wins are 50/50. We will take every win over DHS with a smile knowing there are many years ahead. It works vice versa too, in those years when DHS were the far superior side we did manage to win a few based on poor guts and wanting it more. DHS Derbies bring out something special in the players, guys used to play the game concussed and suddenly could run the 100m a second quicker etc. There is a real hunger to bring down a boy in the navy and gold stripe…….bring him down hard! DHS will be back and it will be for the best, nothing for me can come close to a proper DHS vs Glenwood derby. Westville vs Glenwood was building into something like this before it was cut short this year……College vs Glenwood is also getting bigger due to the teams being more competitive. Before we almost gave up before we started, but now we have the belief that College can be beaten and on Goldstones too
@beet: You are right I think, but I can attest that there is no lack of passion for the match for the boys. I saw it with the GC match, even the crowds don’t really pitch up. Sadly, and no disrespect to DHS, the match probably does not attract the non-parent spectators that a Glenwood/House/Hearsney/Westville match might. Truth, even Westville at home is down on crowd because a lot of the Old Boys never played Westville, so there is less emotion about it.
DHS will be back, starting with that U15 side, so here’s hoping.
@Playa: Hilton vs MHS is coming up next Sat. The atmosphere for that one is electric.
For College vs DHS I don’t think it detracts from the performances on the field but the Glenwood game does seem like it brings out the best in DHS both on the field and amongst their school supporters. It’s the one and only day on the KZN SBR calendar that Glenwood risk being outshouted.
@CapeMan: Interesting – thanks for that. I attended UCT many moons ago and there were many links with SACS. For starters the rugby jerseys are the same, even the badge is similar if I remember correctly. Indeed, a UCT inter-varsity rugby war cry refers to UCT as SACS in “Die SACS kom terug!”
@beet: Thats disappointing to hear.As a youngster in the Border, I only knew of 2 massive KZN derbies…the glamorous Midlands Derby (Hilton-House) and the DHS-College derby.Always thought those were the biggest and most competitive derbies in KZN.
I experienced the DHS-Glenwood one for the first time on tv last year.Must say, that made feel like wearing my schoolboy blazer and do countless war cries.What an atmosphere that was.I can only imagine what it felt like being there in person.
I must say speaking personally that the College vs DHS game just doesn’t seem to have the hype of a big derby game. When DHS plays Glenwood, there’s this buzz that even an outsider can sense and the game draws a huge crowd. No disrespect intended but College vs DHS feels like its just a case of going thru the inter-schools Saturday motions. Compare this to what will happen tomorrow in Border or Jozi or even Kimberley. Not the same vibe IMHO.
@Gungets Tuft: Need to get a match against Dale to break the deadlock
Mind you, we had the last laugh back in ’92…College must want that match more than Dale
@Grasshopper: And those results are a doffed cap to Tony Wiblin, who still maintains College rugby and cricket results long after his retirement. If I could just introduce him to Excel instead of WordPerfect then I would look swift as well as clued up …
@Grasshopper: Our first buildings were on Long street then we moved to Gardens where UCTs drama school is. The schools badge is still on all the buildings at the drama school and because UCT and SACS were one school/college we still have many ties with them. Im not sure who has the oldest school buildings in which the school still attends there but my money would be on Wynberg
@Gungets Tuft: nice work gungets! As I thought Glenwood are your 5th oldest regular rival, with not a bad record compared to the other older rivals. I think Glenwood won 3 in a row in the early 20’s. Bishops, Queens and Grey Bloem standing out for me…
Hermannsburg (once off) – 1870 – College won 2-0
Hilton – 1875 – Played 163, Won 111, drawn 15, lost 36
St Charles – 1882 – Played 82, Won 55, Drawn 9, Lost 18
Michaelhouse – 1901 – Played 162, Won 103, Drawn 14, Lost 45
Weenen – 1906 – Played 3 Won 3
DHS – 1910 – Played 187, Won 117, Drawn 13, Lost 57
Glenwood – 1921 – Played 164, Won 109, Drawn 17, Lost 40 (I think)
Kingswood – 1923 – Played 3, Won 3, Drawn 0, Lost 2
Dale – 1933 – Played 6, Won 3, Drawn 0, Lost 3
Grey PE – 1935 – Played 18, Won 10, Drawn 1, Lost 7
Queens – 1937 – Played 20, Won 9, Drawn 3, Lost 8
Estcourt – 1938 – Played 23, Won 21, Drawn 2
Grey College – 1940 – Played 19, WOn 2, Lost 17
Potch – 1941 – Played 3, Won 3
Kearsney – 1943 – Played 68, Won 58, Drawn 2, Lost 8
Jeppe – 1945 – Played 6, Won 6
Bethlehem – 1947 – Played 1, Lost 1
Bishops – 1950 – Played 7, Won 2, Lost 5
The rest, sorry youngsters, had to leave out everything after 1950.
Westville – 1987 – Played 26, Won 21, drawn 3, Lost 3 (I think)
Northwood – 1956 – Played 39, Won 36, Drawn 3
1892 – Dale vs Selborne, Grey Bloem vs St. Andrews Bloem 1881, Kingswood vs St Andrews Grahamstown 1898, Graeme vs St. Andrews Grahamstown 1886, Grey PE vs Muir 1893….some oldies there!
@Grasshopper: Wynberg opened their doors in 1841 and have never closed since then. We opened our doors in 1829 and have never closed since then. Hence SACS being recognized as the oldest school in the country. Ive never heard of Wynberg claiming to be older than us. Ive heard of Muir claiming to be older then us as they were founded before us but they closed their doors and later opened them and went through names changes. Hence SACS is recognized officially as the oldest school in the country
@CapeMan: I hear Wynberg’s claims to be the oldest are a bit iffy as it wasn’t a proper school until much later in the 1800’s. Not sure if this I’d true….
@BoishaaiPa: haha at “superior”. Bishops vs SACS. “There is a story that Bishops first played the South African College in 1862, but I have not been able to confirm it. The earliest match I have found was in 1873, a match which SACS won.” Here is the link to that article which is the history of SACS rugby http://sacsrugby.com/history/how-rugby-started-in-south-africa/
@CapeMan: As I said..I thought the Wynberg SACS game was the oldest just on the fact that Wynberg is older than Bishops, but I will bow to suprerior knowledge!..
Michaelhouse and Hilton have played each other sine 1904 although they did play before MHS, then called Bishps College, moved from Pmb to Balgowan. The First Game was won 11-0 by Hilton (MHS only defeat that year) and the travel from Balgowan to Hilton involved a train journey and 4 miles by ox wagon.
The 1906 side was unbeaten and one Pryce-Moore, the star of the team, was picked for Natal (the senior side). 1922 was another unbeaten year.
A little known fact is that the 3-4-1 scrum formation commonly used today was pioneered by MHS in 1928 against DHS much to the disapproval of the local newspaper, the Natal Mercury, at the time.
MHS rugby was particularly strong in the 1930’s when they enjoyed a number of unbeaten seasons. In the 1920’s DHS would have to leave Durban by train on the friday night to play in Balgowan on the saturday!
Remember that even in the early part of this century school teams often included a few of the masters
I’ve always believed the Bishops – SAC’s fixture to be the oldest in SA.
@BoishaaiPa: The Bishops vs SACS game is the oldest schoolboy rugby game in the country. Beet, Oakdale vs Drotsdy is not the game of the weekend in the WC. Not by a long shot
@BoishaaiPa: Bishops vs SACS is the oldest in SA, 1862 is the thought to be the earliest but records date back to 1873. Bishops vs Wynberg (1920), Bishops vs Paarl Boys (1929) and Bishops vs Paarl Gim (1929).
@kcman: Wynberg vs SACS is most probably the oldest one I can think of..Wynberg started playing rugby in 1867 and SACS in 1873 and they started playing each other shortly after that… St Andrew’s College in Grahamstown is reputed to have played its first game of rugby in 1855, but there is no formal report on a rugby match at the school until 1868.
@Gungets Tuft: Brilliant stuff! I think it must be one of the oldest rivalries in SA as before then it was mostly soccer/football. Do you know the break-down of wins/losses/draws? Have a feeling College probably have a 60% plus win rate. I see only 13 games tomorrow, a real pity. Hopefully DHS can build on this and then match team for team within 5 years…
@ Beet. It might be interesting to find out which schools have the longest rivalry in schoolboy rugby history. Maybe everybody could contribute on this and get some stats in.
I do know that Kingswood College and St Andrews College, Grahamstown started the K-Day clash in 1896, not sure there are many rivalries which have existed this long and played every year.
Even though since 1993 Kingswood have only been victorious once, the rivalry and build up to this match is enormous within the City of Saints.
DHS v MC must rank as one of the oldest as well, I am sure Bishops v SACS as well.
College vs DHS match is the 103rd year of the fixture (first was in 1910), unless I am mistaken it is the 188th time they have played. Can’t be too many rivalries that go back that far. They play for the Skonk Cup, donated by DHS after Skonk died. Huge game, lots of emotion, no matter what the result.
@beet: Beet please be carefull. In the old days Indians were banned by law in the States. Souties however was shot on site. When asked why not ban Souties in the States also. An old farmer answered because it is so much fun shooting them.
@Gungets Tuft: Aye GT, the eyes move further apart until they are eventually on the side of the head. Gansbaai other side of Hermanus is an example of such a successful and probably voluntary case study
@Ploegskaar: Help me out here. This concentrated gene pool thing, is that the same as not having enough branches on your family tree?
@beet: Thanks for clearing that up, but for future reference keep in mind that the Northern and Southern Afrikaners don’t have much in common apart from the dialect of Ofrikons they speak, some like BOG refer to them as a sub-culture and others as a concentrated gene pool. I do not necessarily agree with all of this though.
@beet: ja ja Beet!!
@Ploegskaar: No there was no pattern to it. English and Afrikaans comments were being moderated. A program called Aksimet that prevents spam etc isn’t working well. The Souties however did not think much of it and accepted the problem for what it was. A few others who shall remain nameless however though it was some kind of plot or conspiracy to get rid of them.
@beet:Virus, hacker and old fart. Don’t forget Bog
@beet: Is that only the half that speaks “die Taal”?
@Klofie Pa: Ja its a catch 22 right now. Either I have these pingbacks above or yours and half the other bloggers comments get moderated. Can’t win.
seems like there’s a virus or hacker on your site Beet!!??
@Gungets Tuft: You spot on there MC have played QC 20 times and are ahead by one only thing you must remember is only 3 of these games were ever played at home for Queens
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I keep hearing “the better team lost”, not just from you, all over the place. College have no intention of extending the scoreboard for a Remarks Column. All we have is the score after 70 minutes of rugby. By all means take heart from performances, but talk of lucky there, unlucky here, it’s enough to make a monkey bite it’s mother.
By that logic rugby will be like ballet or gymnastics where you get points for the Artistic Interpretation.
And College would not have decided the offsets, that is the “offset team” that decides. Check closer to home.
@horsefly NO.1:
In no way do I disagree with college being stronger (generally) but its the logic behind some of the staggering I don’t get. Glad I’m not the only one.
16A’s close win against a stronger, bigger transvalia earlier this year showed their hunger
And with new head of rugby,” coach Nass” as the new coach they may also do better than expected.
then again I’m very patriotic to DHS and as a result
I am naïve.
@Gungets Tuft: Care to elaborate on what you guys are changing?
@School:
Yeah agree with those games. Dunno why College decided on DHS U15B to play their C side even though DHS U14B beat College U14B last year. That’s a weird one for me. The U14B this year are also pretty good while the U14 and U15A sides. I rate too. U16A was one I looked forward too. They’ve had some bad luck but their performances vs College have been amazing. Last year they were better IMO
@CapeMan: I have to agree, there is no consistency. There are schools in the Paarl that would cancel a match if the field is NOT covered in 6 inches of rain
@School: It means not delayed to later today. Look, it is a crowded fixture list this year with the 150th and Wildeklawer, but one would hope they could work something out for at least the 1st team and the A-teams. I have no influence, it is hard to see where it would fit unless in the 3rd term. Depends on the will I guess. We can only hope.
@CapeMan: The College motivation would have been partly due to the 1/2 Fixture fill-up (the rest filled up with teams from all over the place that we will have already played), as well as the desire to preserve the fields for Wildeklawer in 10 days.
@star: I just got back from Westville and it was looking quite light. Back in Durban North now and it is closing in a bit again but no rain. You might just get lucky there.
I would suggest driving up 1 May, play Pretoria BHS on Thursday 2 May and KES on 4 May as scheduled. Westville needs this fixture.
Also some suggestion flying about of trying to schedule a fixture in two weeks time when Westville go up to KES
@star: That’s what we are hearing. 1sts will play on Bowdens 2. No games on Bowdens 1. All subject to no more rain. Final decision still at 12.
@grasshopper:
Also a list of games I gave DHS a fair chance of taking today.(Realistically)
14A,14B
15A,15B
16A*(good game last year)
2nd vs 3rd
3rd vs 5th
*just the few I know and watch very closely.
@ Westers- My son has just phoned me to say the U16As are playing on Commons. It seems they are looking at all options.
@ Tjoppa-play nice
@Rhino: @Rhino: not yet. 1sts, 2nds and A teams still scheduled to play but final decision will be made at 12. All other games cancelled.
Westville vs PBHS has been cancelled but it seems Glenwood vs Michaelhouse is back on according to twitter
@ All
Has the Westville v PTA boys also been cancelled?
Reckon if the fields are that flooded the boys should just have a swim off as at least then we know Westville will win that for sure..lol
ah man what a pity!!
@gungets tuft:
Love you idea of playing the DHS games without offsets, also think these games being cancelled is a blessing in disguise.
If DHS have the shock success story I predict then peoples opinions may have changed and the hype around this game may be a lot greater.
*does cancelled not imply not happening anymore(ever)
What a shame. All the games in Gauteng and KZN have been cancelled. Games in the Western & Eastern Cape are still on.
It does seem a shame to cancel a Westville vs PBHS as the boys have come from so far for nothing.
@Grasshopper: My point is that we never cancelled games even though the rain was literally 100%..We loved it because we could dive and slide when we scored tries. Hence everyone didn’t pass :mrgreen:.I do remember our matrons at the boarding house getting extremely upset because of the mess when we went to shower.
@CapeMan: boet, it’s the same cold front we got here in the Cape, my garden was a pool after 2 days heavy rain. Difference up at Hilton and Michaelhouse is if could be sleet and they too have fog and mist where you can’t even see your own hands….
You Kzn folk are scared of a bit of rain hey :mrgreen:. I remember playing against paarl boys where I couldn’t see more than 5m because of the fog and rain. I do understand though, maybe your fields don’t have proper drainage systems as you guys don’t experience that much rain on a regular basis up there.
@Anonymous: Last I heard Hilton was still on so hopefully same for House.
Any news on hilton or michaelhouse fixtures?
@HORSEFLY NO.1: nope, saw it as a joke too boet. You would need to be a little dim if you didn’t see the humour in it. Yes C and D team wins vs F & G sides….
@Grasshopper:
but yeah thhe U15 boys have lost out
Grassy, many a-time its been the unexpected C or D sides that have won @ College…
@Gungets Tuft:
Yeah I honestly hope they do. Feel sorry for those matrics who wouldve loved to play College for one last time, specially at Goldstones.
Was joking about the coward thing, seems Grassy took it another way
@Grasshopper: You spot on Grassy.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: You will get your chance to put your money down – the schools are close and will almost certainly reschedule, even if a midweek game. It was only 16 fixtures, not as if it is a tough thing to organise. Perhaps College should offer to play team-for-team without offsets, just to prove we are not cowards.
Seems to me DHS have the most to lose, in U15 certainly, since that team has been so hyped.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: ok 3 teams out of 13 had a chance, it really should be 13 out of 26…..
@Grasshopper:
Haha I can bet It wasn’t. College team is good but I think they are definitely beatable! Their U16s aren’t much better while U15 and U14A were probably/likely going to be landslide victories for DHS.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I think it was probably the other way around boet ;-)
DHS vs College cancelled . REASON :College were scared
@Anonymous: frustrating that. Why can’t they consider playing the 16a, 2nd and 1st later if the rain subsides and water drains away? Hopefully Glenwood vs MHS is still on but can’t see how as its close to PMB…:-(
College-DHS cancelled due to swimming pools where the rugby field should be.
Is this blog a howick primary reunion page? I’m probably the youngest export then fin in 1997.
@Rhino: Sorry, youngest in Gr8
@Rhino: 2 boys to a Westville OB, I think one of the boys might have spent a year in my lift club. If his youngest is in Gr9 you will not have had much success there beating them this year, and they are going to be a very very good unit in the future. I am going out there a bit, but watch this U14 year. If I am right the other kid is U16, this age group is coming right quickly. Savour the victories …
@ Gungets
Hah .. ok i will do so and hope it does come to fruition. is a good school indeed. a mate of mine brother who was also a WOB actually has sent his 2 boys to college instead of wbhs and it kinda annoyed me lol .. but he is a true sports orientated man/family so has his reasons but i sometimes laugh as i see his sons results v Westville and they lose… but thats just my own little quiet smirk as i think u must stick to your own ….( just like what u say about college old boys sending theirs to hilton etc )
@Rhino: Doubt you were anywhere near my time. I think I outrank the next oldest here by about 4 years. I oldest is at University already and I didn’t start young.
College won’t go private – even if the government allowed it, which they would not, the costs would be completely unreal. Imagine the cost of that campus virtually in the middle of town, and College would not be College without that (my opinion).
It will be a quiet revolution, retaining the best of 150 years of College and moving rapidly forward as is necessary in a modern world. There won’t be a renaissance moment, but it will be rapid. Keep your eyes peeled.
@ Gungets
Sheez interesting and sad all at once.
Were u in similar year as myself? i actually went howick high for 1 term then left and went to westville however funny as i was accepted at college and was a done deal but i suddently said no i want go westville and so all changed. same as kearsney as my dad is Kearsney old boy but i didnt wanna board. life is funny how our paths go etc
Oi you leave hillcrest area and below to us….lol.. u have the midlands your way already so leave the highway area to us ;-)
but jeepers your words are worrying of what u say about the state and how they even treat business deals so openly corrupt. its actually not a joke.
This “trump card” is intrugueing… im guessing college may go private or something like that… maybe you making college into a state of its own lol … only way perhaps to keep going well..lol
I think Westville is on the right track and Trevor Hall is the man who has led it from a good school to a great school ( and yes i know u wont all think so but it is true if you look at the all roundedness of WBHS )…. I think our own rivalry has too started becoming strong as i know college dads who some of which dont like us………….. ha – i laugh cause imo its cause we now threaten and win… old days………… played 28 games… won 2 lost 25, drawn 1 – that kinda thing.. now even………….. is good. ;-)
@Rhino: Interesting. I lived in Howick for about 10 years, went right through primary school at Howick, and my first year of high school.
PMB is FUBAR. It is so disfunctional you would be staggered to know the whole of it. That is why College now struggle to get a lot of the outlying farmers kids, who’s parents now bite the bullet and spring for House, Hilton, Kearsney and St Charles (to a lesser degree), rather than throw their lot in with a government school in a town that drifting down in tighter and tighter circles. There was a ray of light about 2 years ago when they placed the city under administration but the #$@%@#$^ have managed to vote the same dof leaches back into power. Corruption is absolute. I tried to do business with the local municipality about 8 years ago and the deal was put to me, openly in the proposal meeting. School fees for the one son, a replacement of the other okes furniture suite and curtains. They didn’t even take me one side and whisper – it was open and to much mirth. I walked out during the first break and have refused lucrative work since.
Luckily College is not owned by the local municipality and is still the only decent affordable school for many miles. The BE is still oversubscribed more than 4-fold and the school gets more than 2-fold the applications they can accept. With a little creativity you can ensure that most of the boys in the BE are decent kids and at least 50% of the day-boys are contributors, if not more (0ver 50% of the boys travelled to PBHS last weekend which is a great number!!). The main feeder schools are also still in good shape, I could give you names and numbers but am worried about the DHS buses going back to Durban on Saturday with more kids than arrived.
The main issue for us is the Old Boys that choose to send their boys to other schools. Currently at least 20 at Kearsney, couple at House and Hilton as well as St Charles. They have their reasons I am sure and I respect that, but it does seem a shame. Some superb talent not making it’s way from Hillcrest, Kloof and Durban. Such is life – it has been said here but parenting is a partnership and sometimes the wifes wishes also need to be considered. And .. VERY IMPORTANTLY .. College is not a school that necessarily suits every kid. Blind loyalty is very seldom the right thing to do. As Mark Twain said “Patriotism is the last refuge of the scoundrel …”, there have to be other compelling reasons.
College have a trump card being polished up. Not a shadow of doubt that all our “rival” schools will be rubbing their eyes in disbelief over the next 2-5 years. You heard it here first. And not just sport, it will be in all spheres, starting with academics where we are already no slouches but tracked by the soft stuff such as Arts and culture and sport which is level with those on the agenda. Mark this conversation. 8) 8)
@ Gungets
I had the shock of my life going into PMB city centre in 2010 ( i was back in SA after 12 years ) and to see the total destruction of what was once a pretty decent/structured/clean’ish city.. i was gobsmacked and worrying for College too being right there… IMO. Anyhow same is for Durbs i know but going into PMB after many years just gave me a shock. I used to live in primary school days in Howick and played against Merchiston and Cordwalles and was great .. and little old Howick primary whipped all of them.. needless to say a fair few went to College at end of std 5. lol
IN fact in 93 v alex which was last match of season our no.6 mccullum who was awesome player broke his neck badly…. thank god he recovered after months in hospital etc and recovery but wasnt pleasant and gave everyone the chill factor of what can happen…
@ Gungets
Yeah u right… i love the rivalry even when i get irritated by it lol
Yeah sh*t i forgot about Alex – we also had them on fixture list and was generally a “walkover” – or no thats wrong as they were ok….. rather i should say we would win but so yeah so sad to see it go down so rugby wise…Even Voortrekker i agree as u used to know playing the afrikaans schools you were in for a tough match even if you won…. cant believe alex 1st play college 6ths.. eish… that bad and sad.
@Rhino: And be happy that those rivalries remain after so many years. The College “Must win” derby always used to be Alexandra Road. They never beat College but we have played 27 matches since 1968. This year they were a filler during the GC day and their 1st side played the College 6ths. That’s just sad. Even Voortrekker which is not the school it was (since 1944, 68, 62, 2 draws and 6 losses) still play our seconds and win as many as they lose.
@kcob , Gungets, Grasshopper and generally
From my Westville perspective i would say our RIVAL or Need to beat as you said would go as so….
1. Kearsney
2.Glenwood
3. College ( nowadays as years ago it just didnt happen even with a good team then )
4. DHS
5. Michaelhouse
6. Hilton
7. Northwood
even an 8th which means nothing as such but just cause of the closeness and the old days when we had to face Pinetown but it was always a trouncing and we loved it ( sly grin )
But my reasoning of Kearsney as first is cause they up the hill and generally even though huge rivalry i never know of a hatred or anything in fact perhaps opposite as lots of WBHS/Kearsney boys are friends etc so figure that is why as wanna get one over etc… also prob been pretty even generally. I loved us beating them in 1993… right wing Caramanus outstripped the much vaunted kearnsey wing ( forget name ) aah Arnold it was i think but think he played ntl schools… and ran around him to score 55 metres try… was great…
BUT DEFO as Grassy says the Westville / GW game was coming into a rivalry even more so in a way and probably due to dislike but even respect as 2 huge and great schools..
@kcob: it’s not that serious. He is just unplayable if the team he supports wins, but depressed to a bipolar degree when not. I generally manage to avoid him, win or lose, but he is like a guided missile when he needs to be smug. Such is life …
Ha ha dikbek. I like that. I am sorry we are putting our school on a pedestal to come crashing down from. Not cool.
If its worth anything, College was always my biggest game and hardest. Alas, I was not one of lucky few kearsny guys to claim such a prize.
Good luck all. Game to keep an eye out for is definitely that GW vs MHS.
@kcob: {low whistle of antici …………pation} for the contributions on this. I have just superglued my hands to the desk in case I thrash out a reply before I put my brain in gear …
My list would be formulated more around the OBs and current parents and who I would like to see dikbek the most :-) …. which would put … sorry okes … Kearsney on top of my list .. and my lips are sealed as to why/who .. :-)
How about adding “Hate to be beaten by..” to the list .. or is that the same list as the “need to beat”. I reckom most KZN bloggers would put DHS on top of the “hate to be beaten by” list because they are expected to beat them and defeat would be really tough to deal with. Next would be Northwood, same reason.
Kcob
Good stuff !! tell it as it is – think most Greenblooded blokes will go with this – especially ” the need to beat ” part
I think Kearsney have always been a middle of the road rugby school, never really shocking the day-lights out of the other KZN schools. I think there has always been a “dislike” and hard rivalry with Westville (not always sure why) but otherwise no REAL historic rivalry.
In more recent times as Kearsney’s rugby has improved, I think the hype games are becoming more prevalent (to a Kearsney old boy anyway).
In order of “Need to Beat those Bast#&d’s”:
Westville
Hilton
Michaelhouse
DHS
Glenwood
College
In order of “We Have Huge Respect”:
College
Glenwood
Michaelhouse
Westville
DHS
Hilton
Just my opinion…eeish, suppose this could open a can of worms…don’t read into it guys…just my opinion!
@BoishaaiPa: In your dreams
@kcman: Not that I am aware of, maybe it’s because Kearsney are only 90 odd years old. The nearest big school to them in the same league is Westville. St Stithians might be their longest rivalry, beet will know….
So Kearsney does not have a MHS-Hilton type game?
@kcman: I would say it was the Glenwood game which they won by a point now it’s Westville, their Highway neighbours….
@beet: That is a pity – I am old enough to remember College – DHS as probably the biggest game in Natal along wwith the Hilton-MHS.
@beet: Which is the big game for Kearsney every year? The main event?
In my humble opinion I still think the Derbies carry so much more weight if they are only played once a season. Bigger build up and no chance of a comeback in the return leg.
More drama!!!!!
@beet: Since 2000;
Vs DHS – Played (17) – Won (11) – Lost (5) – Drawn (1) – 65% win rate
Based on that current ratio it will take 70 years for Glenwood to equal DHS in wins, considering they would win 35% too…….jeez I might as well give up that ever happening. DHS had a 44 year head start though….
@beet: Yeah, would have helped our ratio a bit :-). Overall here are the stats;
vs DHS (1922)
Played: 142
Won: 51
Lost: 80
Drawn: 11
% Win: 36%
29 games or 29 years to go
I’ll be in my 60’s by then. However, Horsie keeps on reminding me about 2016 being the turnaround year so it maybe after my life time before we catch up…
@Grasshopper: Ja in a way it’s a pity that Glenwood vs DHS isn’t twice a season like before. Glenwood could have done a lot more catching up in this last decade in terms of the overall win:loss record, and provided a truer reflection of the shift in rugby power to south of Berea Road.
Then again there is more to rugby than just chancing records and the one off game does tend to make the occasion very special.
@CapeMan: Yes..and then WP saw the beautifull blue jerseys of Boishaai and decided a wider stripe looks much better!
“got” not “get”
@Vleis: SACS and UCT were one until and were known as the South African College. They then split as they thought the college(university) students needed to be seperate. That’s where the ‘school’ part came into our name. The South African College Schools and the college was renamed UCT. Our badges are still the same except for some minor details in which UCT changed. So uct have the exact same sports kit because they were the South African College with us before splitting. WP also get their colours from SACS. In fact the first WP side wore SACS school jerseys. The school still has many ties with UCT.
@beet: Agreed, for a Glenwood Boy the number one priority is to shut our neighbours in the Berea up after years of ridicule and being looked upon as our poor rabble neighbours down near the harbour. My dad still has that attitude, in a friendly way of course. We have many many many more wins required to even get to a point where wins are 50/50. We will take every win over DHS with a smile knowing there are many years ahead. It works vice versa too, in those years when DHS were the far superior side we did manage to win a few based on poor guts and wanting it more. DHS Derbies bring out something special in the players, guys used to play the game concussed and suddenly could run the 100m a second quicker etc. There is a real hunger to bring down a boy in the navy and gold stripe…….bring him down hard! DHS will be back and it will be for the best, nothing for me can come close to a proper DHS vs Glenwood derby. Westville vs Glenwood was building into something like this before it was cut short this year……College vs Glenwood is also getting bigger due to the teams being more competitive. Before we almost gave up before we started, but now we have the belief that College can be beaten and on Goldstones too
@beet: You are right I think, but I can attest that there is no lack of passion for the match for the boys. I saw it with the GC match, even the crowds don’t really pitch up. Sadly, and no disrespect to DHS, the match probably does not attract the non-parent spectators that a Glenwood/House/Hearsney/Westville match might. Truth, even Westville at home is down on crowd because a lot of the Old Boys never played Westville, so there is less emotion about it.
DHS will be back, starting with that U15 side, so here’s hoping.
@Playa: Hilton vs MHS is coming up next Sat. The atmosphere for that one is electric.
For College vs DHS I don’t think it detracts from the performances on the field but the Glenwood game does seem like it brings out the best in DHS both on the field and amongst their school supporters. It’s the one and only day on the KZN SBR calendar that Glenwood risk being outshouted.
@CapeMan: Interesting – thanks for that. I attended UCT many moons ago and there were many links with SACS. For starters the rugby jerseys are the same, even the badge is similar if I remember correctly. Indeed, a UCT inter-varsity rugby war cry refers to UCT as SACS in “Die SACS kom terug!”
@beet: Thats disappointing to hear.As a youngster in the Border, I only knew of 2 massive KZN derbies…the glamorous Midlands Derby (Hilton-House) and the DHS-College derby.Always thought those were the biggest and most competitive derbies in KZN.
I experienced the DHS-Glenwood one for the first time on tv last year.Must say, that made feel like wearing my schoolboy blazer and do countless war cries.What an atmosphere that was.I can only imagine what it felt like being there in person.
I must say speaking personally that the College vs DHS game just doesn’t seem to have the hype of a big derby game. When DHS plays Glenwood, there’s this buzz that even an outsider can sense and the game draws a huge crowd. No disrespect intended but College vs DHS feels like its just a case of going thru the inter-schools Saturday motions. Compare this to what will happen tomorrow in Border or Jozi or even Kimberley. Not the same vibe IMHO.
@Gungets Tuft: Need to get a match against Dale to break the deadlock
Mind you, we had the last laugh back in ’92…College must want that match more than Dale
@kcman: I Thought you might like that stats against KC…
@Gungets Tuft: Great stats, seems like Kingswood were your first real out of Province match.
@Grasshopper: And those results are a doffed cap to Tony Wiblin, who still maintains College rugby and cricket results long after his retirement. If I could just introduce him to Excel instead of WordPerfect then I would look swift as well as clued up …
@Grasshopper: Kingswood as well, albeit with just a handful of games.
@Grasshopper: Our first buildings were on Long street then we moved to Gardens where UCTs drama school is. The schools badge is still on all the buildings at the drama school and because UCT and SACS were one school/college we still have many ties with them. Im not sure who has the oldest school buildings in which the school still attends there but my money would be on Wynberg
@Gungets Tuft: nice work gungets! As I thought Glenwood are your 5th oldest regular rival, with not a bad record compared to the other older rivals. I think Glenwood won 3 in a row in the early 20’s. Bishops, Queens and Grey Bloem standing out for me…
Hermannsburg (once off) – 1870 – College won 2-0
Hilton – 1875 – Played 163, Won 111, drawn 15, lost 36
St Charles – 1882 – Played 82, Won 55, Drawn 9, Lost 18
Michaelhouse – 1901 – Played 162, Won 103, Drawn 14, Lost 45
Weenen – 1906 – Played 3 Won 3
DHS – 1910 – Played 187, Won 117, Drawn 13, Lost 57
Glenwood – 1921 – Played 164, Won 109, Drawn 17, Lost 40 (I think)
Kingswood – 1923 – Played 3, Won 3, Drawn 0, Lost 2
Dale – 1933 – Played 6, Won 3, Drawn 0, Lost 3
Grey PE – 1935 – Played 18, Won 10, Drawn 1, Lost 7
Queens – 1937 – Played 20, Won 9, Drawn 3, Lost 8
Estcourt – 1938 – Played 23, Won 21, Drawn 2
Grey College – 1940 – Played 19, WOn 2, Lost 17
Potch – 1941 – Played 3, Won 3
Kearsney – 1943 – Played 68, Won 58, Drawn 2, Lost 8
Jeppe – 1945 – Played 6, Won 6
Bethlehem – 1947 – Played 1, Lost 1
Bishops – 1950 – Played 7, Won 2, Lost 5
The rest, sorry youngsters, had to leave out everything after 1950.
Westville – 1987 – Played 26, Won 21, drawn 3, Lost 3 (I think)
Northwood – 1956 – Played 39, Won 36, Drawn 3
1892 – Dale vs Selborne, Grey Bloem vs St. Andrews Bloem 1881, Kingswood vs St Andrews Grahamstown 1898, Graeme vs St. Andrews Grahamstown 1886, Grey PE vs Muir 1893….some oldies there!
@CapeMan: I see that, but your grounds are relatively new opened in 1960. Which school in Cape Town has the oldest buildings?
@Grasshopper: Wynberg opened their doors in 1841 and have never closed since then. We opened our doors in 1829 and have never closed since then. Hence SACS being recognized as the oldest school in the country. Ive never heard of Wynberg claiming to be older than us. Ive heard of Muir claiming to be older then us as they were founded before us but they closed their doors and later opened them and went through names changes. Hence SACS is recognized officially as the oldest school in the country
@CapeMan: I hear Wynberg’s claims to be the oldest are a bit iffy as it wasn’t a proper school until much later in the 1800’s. Not sure if this I’d true….
@BoishaaiPa: haha at “superior”. Bishops vs SACS. “There is a story that Bishops first played the South African College in 1862, but I have not been able to confirm it. The earliest match I have found was in 1873, a match which SACS won.” Here is the link to that article which is the history of SACS rugby http://sacsrugby.com/history/how-rugby-started-in-south-africa/
@CapeMan: As I said..I thought the Wynberg SACS game was the oldest just on the fact that Wynberg is older than Bishops, but I will bow to suprerior knowledge!..
Michaelhouse and Hilton have played each other sine 1904 although they did play before MHS, then called Bishps College, moved from Pmb to Balgowan. The First Game was won 11-0 by Hilton (MHS only defeat that year) and the travel from Balgowan to Hilton involved a train journey and 4 miles by ox wagon.
The 1906 side was unbeaten and one Pryce-Moore, the star of the team, was picked for Natal (the senior side). 1922 was another unbeaten year.
A little known fact is that the 3-4-1 scrum formation commonly used today was pioneered by MHS in 1928 against DHS much to the disapproval of the local newspaper, the Natal Mercury, at the time.
MHS rugby was particularly strong in the 1930’s when they enjoyed a number of unbeaten seasons. In the 1920’s DHS would have to leave Durban by train on the friday night to play in Balgowan on the saturday!
Remember that even in the early part of this century school teams often included a few of the masters
I’ve always believed the Bishops – SAC’s fixture to be the oldest in SA.
@BoishaaiPa: Is 1855 not the founding year of St Andrews, Ght?
@Grasshopper: There are some rivalry stats under the Stats tab
QC-Dale 1891 P168 QCW78 DW 75 Drew16
Doesnt get closer than that
@BoishaaiPa: The Bishops vs SACS game is the oldest schoolboy rugby game in the country. Beet, Oakdale vs Drotsdy is not the game of the weekend in the WC. Not by a long shot
@BoishaaiPa: Bishops vs SACS is the oldest in SA, 1862 is the thought to be the earliest but records date back to 1873. Bishops vs Wynberg (1920), Bishops vs Paarl Boys (1929) and Bishops vs Paarl Gim (1929).
@Grasshopper: Played 188, won 118, drawn 13, lost 57.
63% win ratio.
@kcman: Wynberg vs SACS is most probably the oldest one I can think of..Wynberg started playing rugby in 1867 and SACS in 1873 and they started playing each other shortly after that… St Andrew’s College in Grahamstown is reputed to have played its first game of rugby in 1855, but there is no formal report on a rugby match at the school until 1868.
@Gungets Tuft: Brilliant stuff! I think it must be one of the oldest rivalries in SA as before then it was mostly soccer/football. Do you know the break-down of wins/losses/draws? Have a feeling College probably have a 60% plus win rate. I see only 13 games tomorrow, a real pity. Hopefully DHS can build on this and then match team for team within 5 years…
@ Beet. It might be interesting to find out which schools have the longest rivalry in schoolboy rugby history. Maybe everybody could contribute on this and get some stats in.
I do know that Kingswood College and St Andrews College, Grahamstown started the K-Day clash in 1896, not sure there are many rivalries which have existed this long and played every year.
Even though since 1993 Kingswood have only been victorious once, the rivalry and build up to this match is enormous within the City of Saints.
DHS v MC must rank as one of the oldest as well, I am sure Bishops v SACS as well.
College vs DHS match is the 103rd year of the fixture (first was in 1910), unless I am mistaken it is the 188th time they have played. Can’t be too many rivalries that go back that far. They play for the Skonk Cup, donated by DHS after Skonk died. Huge game, lots of emotion, no matter what the result.