Golden Lions contracted junior players for 2017

# NAME A/G in 2016 Pos SCHOOL SCH REGION
1 Jack Hart u18 SH Affies Blue Bulls
2 Phillip Krause u18 LF Affies Blue Bulls
3 Louritz van der Schyff u18 CT Affies Blue Bulls
4 Arno van Wyk u18 PR Affies Blue Bulls
5 Lincoln Daniels u18 CT Garsfontein Blue Bulls
6 Austin Davids u18 WG Garsfontein Blue Bulls
7 PJ Steenkamp u18 LK Garsfontein Blue Bulls
8 Sean Williams u18 SH Garsfontein Blue Bulls
9 Seun Maduna u18 CT Glenwood Sharks (KZN)
10 Dian Schoonees u18 LF Grey College Free State
11 Tiaan van der Merwe u18 HK Helpmekaar Golden Lions
12 Gianni Lombard u18 FB HJS Paarl BH WP
13 Khanya Ncusane u18 LF HJS Paarl BH WP
14 Mannie Rass u18 CT HJS Paarl BH WP
15 Cohen Kiewit u18 PR Hugenote Boland
16 Kayden Kiewit u18 PR Hugenote Boland
17 Hacjivah Dyamani u19 LF Jeppe Golden Lions
18 Tyrone Green u18 FH Jeppe Golden Lions
19 Wandisile Simelane u18 CT Jeppe Golden Lions
20 PJ Botha u18 HK Monument Golden Lions
21 Chris Havenga u18 LK Monument Golden Lions
22 Nathan McBeth u18 PR Monument Golden Lions
23 MJ Pelser u18 CT Monument Golden Lions
24 Rheyno Potgieter u18 CT Monument Golden Lions
25 Ruan Vermaak u18 LK Monument Golden Lions
26 Darryle Kameel u18 FB Outeniqua SWD
27 Tatendaise Mujawo u18 WG St Benedict’s Golden Lions
28 Michael Madosha u19 WG Parktown Golden Lions

103 Comments

  1. Ek kan nie wag vir die kommentaar van die Noordvaal ouers oor die bogenoemde groepie nie. Ek gaan nou lees en lekker lag……. :lol: :lol:

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  2. Phillip & Regardt not staying in PTA?!?!…Xander ain’t complaining though he got JC Pretorius…Kwezi Mafu…Hanru & Thian Du Randt…

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  3. The list is only contracted by the Lions. There are more at UJ and Wits and some are at the Lions on agreement/probation basis.

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  4. MJ Pelser and Rheyno Potgieter will most probably convert back to loose forwards. On paper this should be the team to beat next year.

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  5. @Alan Morrissey: Both players stand a good chance of doing well in u19 but after that age group size will start counting against them and they will have their work cut out proving they are good enough to mix with bigger players. Generally we see the smaller players finding a home at 9 or 10 these days. Perhaps Gianni can take encouragement from a player like Brice Dulin (1.75m) who had a good performance at the back against NZ the other day, far better than the form he showed when St Andre had him playing wing last year.

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  6. @Hooit: I dunno. The Bulls and WP have good intakes every year and next year does not look like it will be an exception either. At this early stage they are just as easily the favourites to do well as the Lions are.

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  7. @Hooit: I wonder how many of those “non-contracted”players have been given fair opportunities at u19 level in the past. When there’s a contracted player in a possie, he generally has first bite at the cherry and if it happens to be a big bite, it becomes that much harder for the “non-contracted” player to make an impression.

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  8. @Hooit: WP Under 19’s this year on paper looked like the team to beat……hell even the Bulle since 2010 have had impressive Under 19 squads yet they have only won a single final for the past 6 years….having “star” players from 1-15 won’t guarantee you a trophy at this level….the best coached team will win the tournament next year…just saying.

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  9. @Muzi: He’s also got Luke Fortuin and Ryno Pieterse. Plenty of options.

    Can’t be fun to be a good junior loose-forward in SA. Always so much competition around. :mrgreen: Much easier path to the top being a good tighthead or outside centre or perhaps even a quality scrumhalf.

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  10. @beet: or end up in Sevens as most of the smaller guys do. Maduna is short but very stocky….probably 85kg….Lombaard is super light, maybe 65kg…

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  11. @beet: Exactly, that is why I like Renier Van Rooyen. He battled a bit at Craven Week, but I think that is because he had a weak loosehead. The Sharks need to back him and give him time…

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  12. @beet: Luke looks a bit too heavy…Ryno Pieterse wouldn’t look out of place for Tukkies next year…same goes for Papier….

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  13. @beet: I’m keen to see if Bosch will add more bulk…he will struggle at Super Rugby level with those chicken legs…. :mrgreen: :)

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  14. @Muzi: I’ve been watching Reece Hodge at 12 for Aus. He’s got massive potential to do well in that role. He just needs slightly quicker hands and a bit better awareness of his support runners. Will be interesting to see where that 12 jersey role takes him. It’s all about the fine tuning. I’m not sure if Pelser wants to play 12. He has the dimensions to impose himself and maybe just needs coaching help to get more into the lateral thinking mode. One can never say never with any junior player. Those that have the disciple and put in the hard work improve their chances of succeeding at senior level enormously.

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  15. @Muzi: How good has Izzy Dagg been at 14 for the AB’s this season. There’s a guy Bosch could mold his own game on – they will be more or less the same height, weight and speed in a few months time. Plus Bosch is an ace goal-kicker.

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  16. @Muzi: He really needs to learn to tackle though or it will be a revolving door all season I’m afraid…. 8-O

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  17. @Muzi: I’m constantly reminded that JJ will be a Shark but lets see. Isn’t/wasn’t he a bit of a Bulls fan. Rikus will be hot property for any union to sign up. Xander will probably also be keeping a close eye on that Affies 13 Marnus Potgieter. He could be a machine in 2017.

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  18. @Muzi: Jury still out on Dulin for me. He didn’t look to up to the challenge in the close contact stuff last year. Think it was Anthony Watson who made him look silly.

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  19. @beet: He is a Bull and will end up there I’m sure. Dylan Kruger & Jacques Conradie will be one’s to watch next year….and Conan Le Fleur…

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  20. @beet: That is why playing them on the wing helps, they have the line as an extra defender and can just shepherd players into touch…

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  21. I wonder what the Lions positional plans will be for the 2 Jeppe backs Green and Simelane. Both youngsters are extremely attack-minded and flexible. I think some scouts have viewed WS potential as a flyhalf while TG could be a Christian Cullen like 15. Will the Lions look at these switches or continue to play them in their provincial u18 jerseys of 10 and 13?

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  22. @Alan Morrissey: a player can do a good deal of tackling hiding away at 15 as well :mrgreen: May more so than a wing at the moment. Dagg obviously benefits from playing in a top outfit that had the ball a lot more than their opponents did (until Ireland came along). Sergeal Petersen might tell a different story after his match against the Baabaas and that imposing Aussie wing Naiyaravoro.

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  23. @Alan Morrissey: Yeah I know, I remember a few of us were wondering how Malcolm Jaer who’s not even 80kg was going to cope against Julian Savea before Super Rugby 2016 started. Definite eish.

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  24. I also think that the Lions have a strong and talented group. They also have good depth in most positions ,which will also ensure keen competition for places in the team.

    However, I also agree with Muzi on the fact that talent alone does not secure success. And Beet is absolutaly right that hard and dedicated work still needs to be put in, irrespect of

    your talent. Saw a number of schoolboy stars falling by the wayside. And this came from all the teams in the u/19 Currie Cup competition.

    However ! If my info is right , the Lions coaching staff of this year, who became the champions , is still very much in the mix for 2017. If that is the case , then they will again be

    serious contenders for the title!

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  25. @beet: Aussies are looking for the next Stirling Mortlock maybe that’s why they will persist with Reece at centre he’s got a massive inaccurate boot though …..I thought Kyle Godwin could be the answer at 12 personally I believe he should have left the Force for the Waratahs or Brumbies at the beginning of his senior career….now he looks average….

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  26. @Alan Morrissey: I agree with you Savea would bully Bosch…take a look at the AB’s back three none of those players bar little Damian is under 95kgs……size these days DOES matter….Sergeal looked like a clown against the Barbarians defensively…..

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  27. @beet: ..talking about the subject of players like tiny Jaer…it’s the reason why I have no faith in Dewald Human making the step up to super rugby at the Bulls…… good little player BUT the NZ backs would eat him for breakfast…lunch & supper too small….this guy would get bullied in the collisions…

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  28. @beet: Green is a luxury 10 like Damian Willemse..Jean-Luc Du Plessis…..flyhalves that have x-factor aplenty BUT their kicking isn’t up to standard…. :wink: in a tight test match especially at test match level they will struggle…..Simelane is an enigma up to this day I have no idea what is best position is….

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  29. @Alan Morrissey: If the Bulls sign JJ they will be sitting with a gold mine full of young talented locks under 24 years old if you add guys like …RG..Lood…Stassen…Ruben Van Heerden….

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  30. @Muzi: Agreed Godwin was looking like a bright young prospect a few seasons ago and his game hasn’t really gone anywhere near what was expected ever since. I don’t know his detailed background – sometimes injuries do that to a player.

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  31. @Muzi: And the Bulls have already shipped out youngsters like Jacques du Plessis and Nicolaas Jv Rensburg.

    Don’t forget Jason Jenkins if he’s on the Bulls books.

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  32. @Muzi: True. Unless you have the luxury of an Owen Farrell with his boot at 12 or a place kicking scrumhalf which is quite common in the Top 14, there is a lot of pressure on the 10 to be the kicker.

    Since this is the Lions thread I may as well mention their cool as a cucumber u19 FB Cilliers who proved to be a reliable goal kicker. Don’t know why it reminded me a bit of the days of Gavin Lawless.

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  33. Very very strong group of players this. Weldone Bart and co.

    Surely green can be coached to kick the ball. He is a special talent.

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  34. @Muzi: good spot! Isn’t Lood leaving? Although he has been Kak by his standards, really hope he can get back to that level…

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  35. Great bunch of players contracted by the Lions. Bart and team did excellent again as per usual.

    Do we have any news from the other Union signings?

    @Kattes-Strofes: @Muzi: Think we saw his year that the best coached team won the U19 CC. You can have all the stars as as you guys have mentioned but you must still coach them. I believe the U19 coach from Bulls has left. Muzi can you confirm that. Apparently gone to Sharks?

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  36. @BrotherBear:Simelane’s lack of size worries me….Innocent Radebe looked class at school now at CC level the sharks are forced to hide him at wing because of his defensive frailties also in traffic he gets bullied….Wandile Mjekevu was a big boy at KES hence why the following year after matric he could play Super Rugby…

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  37. @Muzi: That is why I like Raymond Rhule and Jamba Ulengo, at least 85kg…I used to like Bjorn Basson but nothing ever happened for him…

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  38. @Muzi: Innocent still has time on his side. He could go on to do good things. He’s not big but also not any smaller than Aaron Cruden or Richie Mo’unga. He’ll need to be more like Cruden on tackle defence – old school go low, but he’s not scared to defend.

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  39. @beet: I remember Spam Ngcobo taking out some pretty heavy centres in his time, he probably only weighed about 65kg…

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  40. @Alan Morrissey: Yeah he seemed to be an example of senior year confidence. There were times in his 1st year of 1st XV when he looked to shy away from contact and the next year he was a king pin of making head on tackles. I saw him play an u19 game for the Sharks against the Bulls. Big Duhan vd Merwe, the younger brother of Lions hooker Akker was a bit too much for Sparks to handle that day. It sort of gave an idea of what it must be like for a small player to contain a big fast threat like Julian Savea. Duhan’s career hasn’t exactly flushed tho. Back then I thought he looked like someone who could go straight into SR after high school but he hasn’t come close to this level years later.

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  41. @Alan Morrissey: 85kgs-95kgs for an outside back sounds good enough for me…..Basson lacks heart…the jury is still out on Sergeal against the Barbarians he was embarrassed on “D”…..

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  42. @beet: Duhan is now at Montpellier the bloke couldn’t even catch a ball at Varsity Cup level…these days he looks more like a fitness/Instagram model than a rugby player….

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  43. @Muzi: Gelant has the physique and skills to make it, I really am holding thumbs for him to recover and perform….

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  44. @Muzi: In a way the Baabaas match was a good lesson for Sergeal and any aspiring young wing who might have thought that being uncommitted on tackle defence is acceptable. If a wing isnt big enough to wrap the upperbody of an opponent and withstand the collision, he has to make damn sure he is an expert at getting a tight grip on the jersey/shorts or be willing to lead with the head and shoulder into a lower body tackle to knock the opponent off balance.

    Sergeal has plenty of X factor on attack. I think he could have the same sort of impact on Sevens as Senatla has. It’s not a wing’s forte but Sergeal really needs to work on his linking play which leaves much to be desired. How often has he got onto a good position and made a totally hopeless pass.

    I’ve really enjoyed watching the England wings over the past few years, even when Lancaster was in charge. Guys like May, Watson, Yarde and Nowell are all impress with their 0-full speed acceleration and at the same time all seem to have a little more to offer skills wise in general play.

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  45. @beet: Basically become a human ten-pin ball, at speed run into the big wings ankles and shins, 85kg at that speed should knock them off balance or over…..obviously using arms too otherwise that would be American football…

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  46. @Muzi: I wonder what Harold Vorster will be like once he makes his return?

    Also what do you make of Johnny Kotze joining the Bulls?

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  47. Vorster 100% healthy & in form is a far better 12/13 compared to RJVR IMHO…..they should ease him slowly from the bench…he might struggle with the speed of the game next year after being out for more than 12 months he may be rusty for a couple of months…..I don’t understand the need to sign Kotze when you have JT Jackson/Franco Naude coming through…..maybe Jesse Kriel will play full back now?!?! leaving Johnny & Dries to battle it out for the 13 jersey?!?!…..interestingly though Nollis doesn’t rate Daniel Kriel hence why he wanted to ship him off ASAP…..

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  48. @beet: I would like to ask Gerrie Nel what the plan is with Willemse when you have talented youngsters like Chait/Van Der Bank/Stapelberg/Du Preez & Jean-Luc coming through….I can guerentee you with poverty 10’s like Brummer..Tony….Schoeman at the Bulls Damian would have been pushed quickly to Super Rugby level as a back up to Handre….not sure about De Beer……Joshua Stander should have signed for the Cheetahs…..

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  49. @Muzi: High expectations for Willemse. I imagine there will be some sort of fast-tracking in the pipeline and probably a starting berth at next year’s u20 Championships.

    8-O Stapelberg! Is he still in the mix. It seems like Brandon Thomson has his number.

    Lots riding on Pollard to bridge the gap at Bok #10. Hopefully trust not misplaced.

    JL du Plessis has outstanding vision. Maybe the most creative 10 we have in SA at the moment. Hopefully he can up his kicking game to compliment his decision-making.

    Obviously I’m a big supporter of Rob du Preez. I’m hoping he can work on his hand speed and offloading. Would like to see him use his frame + height advantage to stay upright a bit longer in contact, get hands over or past the tackler and make a few more Yannick Jauzion style offloads.

    Niel Marais has actually done a great job in the FS 10 jersey and has proved to be a reliable goal kicker. I’m looking forward to seeing if he and the Cheetahs are able to build on their CC success with the same aggressive high tempo attacking brand of rugby.

    I ask you one again: who is better Brummer or Boshoff :mrgreen:

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  50. @beet: Beet ! In my oppinion the jury is still out on Duimpie Willemse. Yes! He is very good with ball in hand and has a good boot. I am not saying that he is not good ! But !! This is only when he receives ball on the front foot. I have watched quite a few of his matches, for school and province, the last couple of seasons. He somehow becomes ineffective once his forwards do not dominate proceedings and he is under pressure. I know that most no.10,s prefers front foot ball. However ! The really classy ones still has a huge impact when things are going badly up front. They use their skills to transfer defence into attack with clever variations .

    A point I feel needs to be looked at by selectors , is the fact that media hype has a lot to do with the promoting of certain players. Most of tv commentators just rely on hearsay of a player,s abillity when they cover matches. This is very apparent at junior rugby level. You will struggle to find commentators on a regular basis at normal schools matches. Therefore ! to sound more informed, they rely on others to provide them with information on players. This, can then obviously lead to some undeserved promoting of certain players.
    I am sure most bloggers have noticed this fact on numerous occations, when a certain player , who is actually having a crap game , still gets called “the talented so and so”.

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  51. @Kattes-Strofes: Hi Kattes. Agreed. The jury should stay out on all junior players even more so the schoolboys who are yet to prove themselves at the immediate next level.

    Your points are noted and worth mentioning that often even top scouts assess players for contracts based on their attacking attributes and focus far less on their defence.

    For school flyhalves I like to see how they perform when exiting while pinned back against their own deadball line. Seems to share a lot about their composure under pressure, reaction speed, kicking technique and range.

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  52. @Kattes-Strofes: another good point you raise and I want to expand in is how ineffective Supersport commentators and analysts have generally been over the years. The rugby following general public is missing out on a higher level education because of too many substandard SS staff and guests stating the obvious and sometimes even overlooking it.

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  53. @Valkie: LOL. You’re in the Muzi camp then. We have been debating about who the better player of the 2 is ever since they were both in the same Bulls junior teams after school. Both players have been through peaks and troughs over the years so it’s been hard to decide who’s backed the right horse here :-D

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  54. @beet:??it shouldn’t even be a debate anymore Brummer is better….too much high expectations on Pollard he’s not a miracle worker…he’s been out for 12 months yet some already think he’s the answer to our problems at 10 for the Springboks….ridiculous if you ask me we don’t know if he will be the same after his ACL injury…..

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  55. @Alan Morrissey: ?..madness I hope the Bulls don’t rush him…people forget he’s not even the finished article…when Cruden came back from his knee injury he wasn’t the same player….

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  56. @Muzi: Dont say he is nearly our best option on current two year form.. to say the least but he is still highly overlooked and underrated.. people still struggle to forgive him for the CC final against WP and his only Test appearance.. like I struggle to forgive PL for his mishaps against AB’s, Eng, etc.etc :wink:

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  57. @beet: @Kattes-Strofes: ….blame the hype machine guys the jury is still out on Handre, Willemse & Curwin just because they have lucrative contracts as 18-year-olds they think they are “SUPERSTARS” already only to get exposed in a tight game when the pack isn’t going forward…all three need to learn how to dictate a game with the boot…Hugh Bladen is reliable the rest of the Supersport commentators know nothing??

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  58. @Laevelder: Geez they crucified Boshoff after that final….the funny thing is that the lions needed him in the CC this year because Jaco VD Walt blew hot & cold….

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  59. @Muzi: Ja maybe he must return to his roots and join old Rhinos Mark Pretorius,Emile Temperman and youngster Morgen Naude at the Pumas next year .. call up for Thormeulen too.. even Stefan Watermeyer and Faf de Klerk played their first year or two of Highschool rugby at Nellies.. what I actually am trying to say is maak al die Nellies somme bokke

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  60. @beet: @Muzi: Yes I’m in the Muzi camp. I’ve been reading Muzi’s write ups on the Bulls web site and else where for many years now. He is a Bulls man through and through. :lol:

    I know Boshoff and I’ve seen him play as a schoolboy for Nellies. I really have no problem with the young man however I think Brummer is just a better choice.

    Will Pollard ever be same? Sure he will, I have no doubt in my mind. He’s young, ambitious and challenges himself constantly, has talent and BMT.

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  61. @Valkie: I don’t want Handre to become Gaffie Du Toit 2.0…..I just feel we’re putting too much pressure on him let’s see how he does in the Super Rugby tournament first…..Valkie I have been absent in the Bulls website it has become to toxic for my liking…. :)

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  62. @Valkie: My final word for 2016 on the matter is there is no ways Brummer has been better than Boshoff as an overall package, except maybe for a short passage of time when they were 20 y.o. Otherwise not while they were u21, not anywhere in between and not now. :mrgreen:

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  63. @Muzi: Why do you make that statement about KP de Jager? Do the Pumas have a rising to prominence junior program in the works? Otherwise it makes more sense for a youngster to get strength vs strength exposure. He can always make the Pumas his home at a later stage like a few of their other players who went through the juniors age groups at big unions.

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  64. @beet: You are right Beet .. face it even if Nelspruit grow to be the next Bloem .. they will still need to start all over again at the start of season after big guns zone in on your Faf’s, Vincents & Renaldo’s… on the other hand Darren..at least the Bloem boys know how to lift a Curry Cup every ten years or so :roll:

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  65. @Muzi: Glad for KP .. any young country boytjie’s dream to play for teams like the Bulls or Province. I think he has it in him to regularly make the starting line-up.. some people even thought he had a small chance of making SA Schools this year.. let see how he will develop

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  66. @McCulleys Workshop: If I may reply to your question regarding Bader. The youngster had an up and down season. He was intially the 1st choise no.10 for the Lions u/19. Then they moved him to inside centre to accomodate Eddie Fouche. The latter picked up his game after a slow start. Both Fouche and Bader performed very well at that stage. Bader still very physical ,both on attack,as well as defence. Fouche probably kicks a little bit better out of hand. Then Bader suffered a serious leg injury, which kept him out for most of the latter part of the season. He came back right at the end, but seemed a bit rusty after the long lay-off.
    Still a quality player. I expect once again a healthy competition for the no.10 jearsey next season.

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  67. @beet: Beet ! You are so right about players should only be judged once they leave school. Schoolboys, ability, who perform well at that level, can only be judged properly when they have to work out on their own, after finishing school. No more adoring fans ,hero status etc.

    And !! There is a huge gap between schoolboy rugby and u/19 rugby , especially amongst the forwards. One should remember that the provincial u/19 competition is contested by full time profesionals, with it,s accompanying conditioning and fitness training. The youngsters is just physically stronger,fitter and mostly faster than schoolboys who train a few afternoons in a week.

    This gap also increases as you play at higher levels. My son, who is now training with the senior Varsity Cup squad of UJ , told me that on the physical side, there is an enormous difference from age group levels.

    I do think that this is one of the glaring mistakes in the SA rugby set-up.Schoolboy stars will almost always be hunted by talent scouts, agents etc. However , the unions, that contract these boys, should guide the national selectors on who of their players have made a successfull transition from schoolboy to professional rugby. The unions will know very soon who will make it ,and who will not, even before the regular season gets under way. Then the selectors must attend the matches, forget about reputations,assess the players without bias, and then finalise their training squad.
    They should by then have a group of players that they can coach properly and get ready for higher honours in the future.

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  68. @Kattes-Strofes: It’s was a pity for Bader and hopefully he can bounce back in 2017 and prove himself to be the best 10 in the Lions setup.

    The Lions u19s went on a 10 game winning streak to claim the title, this after losing 3 in a row near the start of the 2016 campaign. I checked back and saw that all theHJS players and Bader who had gone through 2015 as part of unbeaten school 1st XV were part of that losing 3-game losing run in the u19 CC. Only MC de Jongh continued to be unbeaten. What happened to him tho? I can understand being second fiddle to HP van Schoor but Justin Brandon who is quite light for a hooker also kept him out of the team.

    Concerning Eddie Fouche while at school his body shape placed him in the Andy Goode / Lee Stensness category but wow he has undergone a transformation. This year when I watched him play for the Lions u19s outside Kings Park he looked lean and mean, with a body fat % way down. Judging by that he’s obviously taken his training to a very high level of dedication.

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  69. @beet: Beet! I am sure that Bader will challenge for the no.10. However , Eddie Fouche ,as you have noticed, has also lifted his performance. I am sure that Bader will also be in the mix for inside centre.

    Regarding MC de Jongh. He continued to be part of the training squad. He benched in one of the matches and did get some running time.. Unfortunately, I cannot answer your question of why Justin Brandon was the 1st choise back -up hooker to HP. I did not attend training sessions, and none of my contacts up in JHB. gave reasons. However, I do know that Brandon did well in general play, when given the oppertunity.

    Next season, no less than 10 Boishaai old boys will play for the Lions . Apart from the current 6 , The 3 matric stars of this season, plus the 2014 headboy,1st team captain and WP Cravenweek hooker, Ruan Brits,will become Lions. Brits is also still u/21 next season.

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  70. @Kattes-Strofes: Do you want to recheck your numbers? I got 11 not 10 Boishaaiers.

    1 Leo Kruger
    2 Bradley Thain
    3 JL la Grange
    4 Tyreeq February
    5 Jeanluc Cilliers
    6 MC de Jongh
    7 Khanya Ncusane
    8 Gianni Lombard
    9 Manuel Rass
    10 Ruan Brits
    and
    11 Altmann Allers :wink: :mrgreen:

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  71. @Kattes-Strofes: Hi Kattes, thanks for the update. I feel for the guy, he is talented but to my mind not the complete 10 or 12. He is illusive and physically strong, but to my mind it seems he would be better suited to 9, but to make that change now is a stretch.

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  72. Not one EG Jansen player contracted in the Lions team in 2017? That has not happened in years. :-o On the other hand seems like the Blue Bulls contracted more EG Jansen players in 2016 than any other School from the Bulls region. So is the Bulls handing out contracts before the Lions does these days? Bulls contracted some good players from EGJ last few years.

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