The KwaZulu-Natal schools youth weeks coaches and selectors for 2014 have been finalised. As a result of changes, Glenwood and Kearsney “appear” to have gained a bigger say in the overall running of the provincial age-group selections for the various national youth weeks.
The Big Positives
- A second assistant coaching position has been created in each of the 4 provincial teams. Each team will now have a head coach and two assistant coaches. This should have positive spinoffs, as it is now possible to separate the duties of forwards and backline coach as well as share the rest of the ancillary task load that the coaches bore. As long as the various coaches can work together, the teams should benefit from this initiative.
- Westville coach Grant Bell is rewarded for a job well done at the under-16 Grant Khomo Week by being promoted to the position of Craven Week assistant coach. Bell comes across as an avant-garde coach and the more his forward-thinking ideas can rub off on others, the better off the system will be so thumbs up for his appointment.
- The under-16 selection panel has a much better independent look about it: 8 officials with 6 from different schools along with 2 Sharks representatives. This has been made possible by Bell’s promotion and Piet Snyman of College surprisingly not reapplying for his post.
- A new under-18 selector post has been created. The motive behind it is to have 9 voters, so that there are no split decisions requiring one selector to have a casting vote. Each selector’s vote now carries equal weight.
The Big Concerns
- Be it true or not, there is definitely a perception out there that Glenwood has too much say in the under-18 selection process. This season 32 of their players made it into preliminary under-18 trials and then several of their 2nd XV players were selected for teams ahead of 1st XV players from other schools. Going forward if these B-team players are as good as the school believes they are, then who better to prove them right than a collection of independent selectors, in appearance at least. So everyone who is not Glenwood affiliated and possibly many reasonable minded Glenwood supporters are probably going to see the issue with Glenwood’s increased involvement. Glenwood deputy-head Tony Pinheiro was the successful applicant for the newly created 9th under-18 selector post. Glenwood now have 2 out of 9 under-18 selectors, while Tier-1 big guns Maritzburg College is unrepresented and Westville has limited say via opinions that Grant Bell shares with CravenWeek head coach Barend Steyn of Kearsney, who is a selector. The existing selection panel have been described as men of strong character but even if Pinheiro goes out of his way to be objective and is harder on boys from his own school, the appearance of independence looks to have been compromised from a general public point of view. Also like it or not those that have been saying all along that Glenwood coach Sean Erasmus has too much influence in the selection process, just got handed an extra reason to suspect him of this – he can now sway 2 votes, not that he will do this.
- Kearsney’s Francois Lubbe, a really nice guy by all accounts, is Grant Bell’s replacement as under-16 head coach. This is not to say that the system should be so picky that good coaches get overlooked for roles simple because it results in their schools being overrepresented but there is bound to be concern that Kearsney coaches are now in charge of the two main teams namely the Craven Week and Grant Khomo teams. As selectors and those who will ultimately determine the gameplan, head coaches do have a big say in the way things happen. With 2 coaches from the same school, there is possibly better opportunity to bring about continuity in selections between under-16 and under-18 now but this should be a goal all along anyway, irrespective of who the coaches are. Again with appointment options available, maybe more consideration should have been given to the impression it creates when it looks like control is being centred around just a couple of schools rather than spreading the love around.
- Hopefully this is not being said out of turn but College, KZN’s most successful rugby school and a major player in the keeping the standard of KZN school rugby at an acceptable level, look like they are losing interest rather than adopting an approach of all hands on deck. With Piet Snyman no longer being a selector at under-16 level, one would have hoped that College would have initiated a drive to get a replacement selected to the position in Piet’s place or even better encouraged a candidate to apply for the new under-18 selector’s post.
At the end of the day, selecting players is one of the most difficult jobs around. No matter how hard they try, selectors are bound to take flak from the support base of those who missed out and are unhappy with their decisions. As long as these officials are suitably qualified and prepared to genuinely put aside their school allegiances in order to pick the best players for the job at hand, it really shouldn’t matter what schools they work for.
Also outstanding at this stage is a revised and honest definition of the role that the Sharks now plays in KZN school rugby as this would go a long way to determining how neutral they are or if “neutral” is still an appropriate term to use.
| 2014 | 2014 | 2013 | 2013 | ||
|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| OFFICIAL | SCHOOL | OFFICIAL | SCHOOL | ||
| EXECUTIVE COMMITTEE: | |||||
| Chairman | Noel Ingle | George Campbell | |||
| Secretary | Dean Moodley | Kearsney | |||
| Members: | |||||
| Member / Vice Chairman | Gerald Pyoos | George Campbell | |||
| Member | Pius Mnikathi | ||||
| Member | Kevin Smith | Kearsney | |||
| Member | Ryno Combrinck | Michaelhouse | |||
| Member | Garth Giles | The Sharks (KZNRU) | |||
| Member | Quentin Reynolds | The Sharks (KZNRU) | |||
| TEAM OFFICIALS: | |||||
| CRAVEN WEEK | |||||
| Coach | Barend Steyn | Kearsney | Barend Steyn | Kearsney | |
| Assistant Coach | Sean Erasmus | Glenwood | Sean Erasmus | Glenwood | |
| Assistant Coach | Grant Bell | Westville | |||
| Manager | Dean Moodley | Kearsney | Dean Moodley | Kearsney | |
| Physio | TBA | Brent Grimsley | Kearsney | ||
| ACADEMY WEEK | |||||
| Coach | Rudi Dames | Glenwood | Rudi Dames | Glenwood | |
| Assistant Coach | Antonie Prinsloo | George Campbell | Antonie Prinsloo | George Campbell | |
| Assistant Coach | Roland Norris | Westville | |||
| Manager | Nhlanhla Bulose | Northwood | Nhlanhla Bulose | Northwood | |
| Physio | TBA | TBA | |||
| KZN COUNTRY DISTRICTS | |||||
| Coach | Deon Gericke | St Charles | Deon Gericke | St Charles | |
| Assistant Coach | Ryan Kyle | Creston College | Ryan Kyle | Creston College | |
| Manager | Lukhanyo Nontshinga | George Campbell | Mandla Mtshali | ||
| Medic | Musa Mgabhi | Umlazi Com Tech | Andre Pelser | ||
| GRANT KHOMO | |||||
| Coach | Francois Lubbe | Kearsney | Grant Bell | Westville | |
| Assistant Coach | Jeremy McLaren | Kloof | Piet Snyman | Maritzburg College | |
| Assistant Coach | Torsten Sorensen | Westville | |||
| Manager | Sibusiso Ncamane | Michaelhouse | Sibusiso Ncamane | Michaelhouse | |
| Physio | TBA | Jaco Ras | |||
| SELECTORS: | |||||
| SELECTORS – UNDER 18 | |||||
| Convenor | Garth Giles | The Sharks (KZNRU) | Garth Giles | The Sharks (KZNRU) | |
| Selector | Quintin Reynolds | The Sharks (KZNRU) | Quintin Reynolds | The Sharks (KZNRU) | |
| Coach/Selector | Barend Steyn | Kearsney | Barend Steyn | Kearsney | |
| Coach/Selector | Rudi Dames | Glenwood | Rudi Dames | Glenwood | |
| Coach/Selector | Deon Gericke | St Charles | Deon Gericke | St Charles | |
| Selector | Gerald Pyoos | George Campbell | Gerald Pyoos | George Campbell | |
| Selector | Tony Richter | Hilton | Tony Richter | Hilton | |
| Selector | Ryno Combrinck | Michaelhouse | Ryno Combrinck | Michaelhouse | |
| Selector | Tony Pinherio | Glenwood | |||
| SELECTORS – UNDER 16 | |||||
| Convenor | Bruce Collocott | Maritzburg College | Bruce Collocott | Maritzburg College | |
| Coach/Selector | Francois Lubbe | Kearsney | Grant Bell | Westville | |
| Coach/Selector | Jeremy McLaren | Kloof | Piet Snyman | Maritzburg College | |
| Selector | Torsten Sorensen | Westville | Roland Norris | Westville | |
| Selector | Steve La Marque | Glenwood | Steve La Marque | Glenwood | |
| Selector | Paul Venter | Hilton | Paul Venter | Hilton | |
| Donald Ngwenya | The Sharks (KZNRU) | ||||
| Ntso Mkhwanazi | The Sharks (KZNRU) |
Someone had a heavy night last night
@Grasshopper
Dont try bring wbhs into it again………….. you fielded marne illegally or accordingly illegally and were stopped rightfully so. 3 other schools stood by that. You also kept on fielding TOM who was like 4 years too old and would have won you many a match(being over ages by miles) to which you should have those gaes being called no contest just like in boxing as it was out of order.. so please please please shush!
and BTW to all that dont know… Glenwood DECLINED to play WESVTILLE this year……..NOT US !!! so……………
Well Said gungets…
I wonder how much Kings Park knows about this, and how much influence they will have there. Interesting nonetheless – it is the one big gaping hole in the KZN rugby setup.
http://www.rugby365.com/article/56031-mitchell-takes-over-at-ukzn
@Grasshopper: Nice website indeed!
I remember playing Affies at The Graveyard in 2000. One of only 2 home losses that year.A most embarassing loss.They then went and lost to Selborne in EL 3 days later.Then we klapped Selborne 20-0, 3 days after that.The unpredictability that is schoolboy rugby
@All Black: Yeah, Noord Kaap last year had about 8! Surely that is a huge advantage over other schools as a year at this level is huge…
@Grasshopper: Agreed. Noord Kaap have been known to have a few as well.
@All Black: correct, 19 in matric. However my point is some schools like DHS and George Campbell have half the team under 19, surely there should be a limit there too. 2 max!
@Grasshopper: He was U20 not U19.
@RBugger: Check the Affies results here; http://www.affiesrugby.co.za/2000—2009.html
Great site this, wish all schools did this….
@RBugger: True, but Kearsney were stronger than Glenwood this year and Westville claim they were stronger than everyone, so 3rd best in KZN losing by 30 to the top school in SA (debatable again as I feel that belongs to Paarl Gim)……not that bad….also at the end of a very very long season….
@Grasshopper: Not to bad but the reality still remains, that is a win ratio of just 29% – so we can look at 3 out of every 10 games – fantastic that you guys beat them 2 years running, very impressive, I need to have a look at Affies seasons for 2008 and 2009 to see how good these wins really were, but still, a great achievment.
But as we can clearly judge from these results, it is always going to be a very tough ask for KZN at CW…
@RBugger: Sorry it’s played 7, see below;
2013: Affies won 53 – 23
2012: Affies won 28 – 10
2011: Affies won 18 – 9
2010: Affies won 54 – 32
2009: Glenwood won 24 – 10
2008: Glenwood won 24 – 7
2007: Affies won 48 – 11
Points for Affies: 218
Points for Glenwood: 133
Avg score: 31-19 to Affies, certainly not a complete mismatch. Biggest points difference being 37 in 2007…..
@Gungets Tuft: OK, you are right but it was Westville who made the stance the day before when they knew he was there for months. Marne did actually play the majority of games hence his appointment as captain. DHS, Northwood, George Campbell etc accepted it as they too had quite a few under19’s in their team. Westville even had an Under19 in their side who had failed a year or two, but that was OK……it’s a complete gemors really. Schools can tweak the agreement to how they feel fit. For me, no under19 should play if they have failed an academic year, they should be playing club level. That is what happened to the Glenwood No8 Wayne Dalton last year as he was too old but still in matric…
@RBugger: Nope, I think it’s played 6 vs Affies, won 2 lost 4. One of the wins was at Affies which is a huge achievement. I get what you saying though, the majority of the time it’s a big loss. Our 2nd’s have beaten Affies 2 years in a row though. The Grey Bloem win was in Durban against one of their weaker sides. My point is we can be competitive every now and again, we just need to become competitive annually….
@Grasshopper: “In his first local match against Westville get’s used as a pawn by Westville to make a point and unfairly gets excluded and get’s negative press.”
Not quite true hey. Gets excluded according to the Headmasters agreement, and not just by Westville but by House and Hilton as well. The emphasis on “Westville” and “unfair” is a little unfair.
I know others have done it, albeit a little more cleverly, but the fact remains it was not unfair. Other schools decided to not exclude Marne but that should not reflect on Westville, House or Hiltons stance.
Damn, I can’t believe I am saying this … might have to get that chainsaw warmed up, I know this is going to start another {snigger} Groundhog thread …
@Star: He was always big and athletic – he played a few 1st xv games in grade 10 at centre and then the following year was moved to lock and then 8.
I personally feel he could have been kept at centre, he certainly has the speed and skill to play there and could have offered the KZN side a good go to man in the midfield.
@Grasshopper: Beaten Affies twice in 10 years… My point exactly, beating them is deemed a massive achievment rather than a 50/50 outcome between the teams.
In other words, more often than not, Glenwood have been beaten and more than likely drilled?
@Grasshopper: The unions will go on, the school will go on, but the loser is…..!
Therein lies the problem.
@Playa: Spot on! Take Marne Coetzee as an example, made SA Schools in grade 11 at Waterkloof, was going to be under19 in grade 12 so that excluded him from Die Beeld trophy etc. He or his family then looked at alternatives and the Sharks obviously offered them a place in the Under19 side if he moved to Durban. Glenwood has a good relationship with Pretoria schools via attending Pukke, Wildeklawer etc and also has a good number of Afrikaans speaking boys in the boarding establishment and the coaches are fluent too. The KZN Union then probably offered to pay his schooling at Glenwood, as long as he played 1st team. He uprooted from Pretoria, where he should have stayed and played club/under19 rugby in the comfort of his home and familiar surroundings. He then moves to a predominantly English school in a foreign city. In his first local match against Westville get’s used as a pawn by Westville to make a point and unfairly gets excluded and get’s negative press. Think about the poor kid, he must have felt down and humiliated, confidence shot. Then with the whole Tom age cheat issue, he is given the captaincy at a school he hardly knows. I can tell you there must have been alot of jealousy and anger from the boys who had been at the school from grade 8. His arrival was seen as a positive thing by the Glenwood management, but it backfired big time. Marne then went on to play for the KZN Under 19 side and be picked for the Junior Boks, rightly or wrongly. In my opinion he did not do very well at the Junior World Cup, getting scrummed every game. My fear is the kid will get lost in the system now and end up back in Pretoria studying a Sports Science diploma or something……messy story but this is what is happening everywhere now with this stock trading of players…
@beet: Topic that is very close to my heart.
Look at it this way. The Bulls, who have been notorious for such an approach are sitting at the bottom of the Currie Cup table at the moment.One would think that with the amount of buying, placing kids at preferred schools etc that they have been doing for the last few years would have yielded some material depth by now.Not to be. Where are those players that they “brought up” through their system? How many players actually go through the ranks from under 19 , 21, to Super Rugby at the Bulls?
Point is, the “grab them while they’re young” approach employed by unions is a flawed mechanism.Pollard and Pietersen did not need to be placed in ‘special schools’ by a union. Neither did Eben Etzebeth, Siya Kolisi, Marcel Coetzee, Patrick Lambie, Frans Steyn, Johan Goosen (guys whomade Boks by 21).
The sooner people realise that this placement programme instilled by unions is a short cut to the premature end of boys’ rugby careers and nothing else, the better.Schools who participate in such programmes are fulfilling their number one mandate – and that is to be educational institutions that aim to produce well-rounded individuals. Schools who agree to be these pawns, can go and play in their own league IMO. Tradition and fair competition comes first where schoolboy rugby is concerned.
@RBugger: fyi – Glenwood have beaten Affies twice in the past 10 years, home and away…..Waterkloof, Monnas, Paul Roos twice, Grey Bloem, Boland Landbou twice, Outeniqua twice, Paarl Boys, Noord Kaap etc…..so KZN schools can be competitive, just not this year where we only had the Doops and Schramm who could match them physically. Next year maybe different….
@ RBugger- Dixon did play flyhalf early in his high school career. Was Schramm a very big center in grade 10 or did he develop later? My son played soccer against Tedder’s cousin who was the U16A center for Kearsney this year. He has also grown and must be over 6 foot now.
I agree that we do not produce the same quality of players and that is why it is essential we get the selections spot on. Sithole who played for SA U20 this year was only deemed the 3rd best prop 2 years ago.
@Gungets Tuft: A question that has to be asked. Why would schools who still abide by the traditional beliefs of what a school is all about, a rounded education, wish to continue competing against schools who clearly have taken a semi professional route?
@Beet: Onr more thing, if you look at the scores between Affies and Glenwood, KZN schools are just not in the same league at the moment, in fact, not sure they have been at that level for many, many years.
No matter the coach, KZN will struggle at CW for years to come as we simply do not produce the amount of quality players as the other regions do.
@BEET: Affies certainly did rule the roost so to speak, but only managed to scrape home against us – if memory serves correct, we lost by 3 points…
But having said that Beet, we only deserved the representation we had – 3 players in the starting CW side… The rest of the team played with huge heart, but lacked the size to really compete week in week out against the likes of Affies.
Funnily enough, in that year, we lost to both Kearsney and Maritzburg College – very powerful teams in that year, KC being captained by Matt Stevens. We had to travel up by train which did not help much, too much excitment amoung the boys meant a late night and even a sneaky drink – boys will be boys.
@HM: Schramm was a centre in Grade 10 – Dickson plays 8…
@Gungets Tuft: Agreed, the rot needs to stop! Maybe we should all start a petition to stop ‘professionalism’ in schoolboy rugby and get parents, old boys and anyone interested in it to sign. Imagine Springboks, provincial players and coaches signing it too. From a Glenwood perspective we cannot have another ‘Marne-gate’ episode, it severely soured relationships with traditional rivals and hurt the reputation of the school. I for one will be talking to the Glenwood OB Chairman about this…..
@beet: Short lived and doomed to fail. You erode depth, start importing, loyalty is gone. It has no soul, I will not support a mercenary approach, it’s pointless.
What will happen is two separate tiers. There will be the pre-professional “schools” and the rest. Some will survive for 150 years, others until the sponsors withdraw.
@Gungets Tuft: I think you have to imagine that you get appointed as the junior rugby manager at an RU and come from out of town.
So a) you don’t give a flying you know what about school tradition and derbies etc. in that region.
b) Your interest is in acquiring and developing individual star players, some of whom need to be ready for senior rugby in 2-3 years.
Do you want to be trying to keep a tab on each of them at a different school in a different province or do you want to try get them under one roof as near as possible to you.
The concern at Union level in the school/s only extends to the effect it has on in the players they are interested in. So if all their players can be at one school, then there would be no reason to care about all the other schools in that region.
@RBugger: From my experience, when the system works in one’s favour, there is rarely ever reason to complain or even identify the obvious flaws.
When you were at PBHS, Affies and possibly Klofies ruled the roost coz they were quality teams, but did you ever think that perhaps some of your teammates were a little hard done by the provincial week selections and if so then why? There’s a chance you might have no regrets or your memories might help you to relate to situations at Westville and College right now
@beet: “They need to partner with schools.”
They need to partner with the schools, not some of the schools, or all they are doing is starting a junior academy or two and then enticing the best kids there on the assumption thant that school is the only route to professional rugby. They will end up losing more talent than they find because they will 1. Lose the ability to play local strength vs strength, 2. End up with a limited pool of players that they can take, losing lots of depth.
I agree, strong school leadership is the key, but it is going to take all of them to make it work. One or two breaking ranks and that boat sinks like a stone. I am not betting on that teamwork just yet, there may need to be a little “encouragement” to scrum down… Gnome sane?
@star: With the example you have presented about the other sport and other age-group, there are so many instances around the country where you just have to sub the sport and/or age-group and you have the exact same issue – identical. Just like you say a virus that has spread but someone we’ve accepted that the virus will dominate us when we should be fighting the virus and keeping it under control.
When one thinks of the likes of Handre Pollard and Sergeal Petersen playing pro rugby within a year of leaving school while many u21s are Currie Cup regulars, it suggests that Unions need to prepare kids at younger ages. However they don’t have the funds to set up proper secondary schools of their own. They therefore have to partner with existing schools in their region.
But at the same time, schools must find their own niche as well. Its pointless just going with the flow if schools are uncertain where it will eventually take them and I imagine it’s to a place that is no good at all.
One can already see that the good values on which many schools have built their reputations is being challenged by the lack of ethics that seem to go hand in hand with accepting pro rugby into the school.
We need some strong headmasters to come together now and say this is how we will play this game, this is where rugby fits into the school curriculum these are the rules, screw the unions.
@Gungets Tuft: Worried you might miss!
@McCulleys Workshop: A little cross-blog there. The more I hear of the influence from Kings Park the more my toes curl. It wouldn’t be too bad if they weren’t so damn short sighted and lazy. Or maybe I don’t know how it all works, that concentrating power in one or two places is going to work for them long term. {sigh} … we’ve had this discussion. I will stab myself in the face with a chainsaw if I have to talk about this next year.
@HM: Are you talking about managing the trials teams? If so, then that smacks of pettiness.
@Gungets Tuft: GT, I agree. Keep KP out of it.
@HM: I am told Giles would miss anything that do not happen within 5km of Kings Park. Not a big traveller by the sound of it. It makes a big case for having representation from each tier 1 school. I think the Union should back right off, allow the same committee that chooses the top school to choose trialists. Not like me to suggest more rather than fewer but I just like the idea of fewer from Kings Park. It’s a woodpile daarso ..
@star: @Gungets Tuft: @Grasshopper: Star, very interesting points: So you are suggesting if you have ‘influence’ in the CW selection as a school, you have an extra card up your sleeve for attracting 18/19 year old rugby players from other provinces, to either give them a pink ticket into KZN CW or if you are over 18, into the academy via the front door. Mmmm sadly it doesn’t sound like a conspiracy. Even more interesting is that I heard recently from an unreliable reliable source, OK, he is reliable but was pissed, that JS is wanting to get involved in KZN school rugby, and ensure good inflows into the academy – the green and brown schools were mentioned. I get the benefit but as discussed ad nauseum it is a broken and biased approach. As far as the selectors are concerned, no point in Schwartz being included, MHS has been criticized as Giles is an ex MHS coach and Combrink the current head of rugby at MHS. It all seems flawed and unacceptable, Bells inclusion seems like a bonsai olive branch, to small to really appease anyone and TP a waste of time. They think we are doos’s.
Don’t know Toppy but I hear only good things. I also hear good things about SE, not only from here but from mates who know and respect him.
@TJ: I was led to believe that Strudwick was appointed to run the 4th XV but Swarts from MHS looked after them. So, he could not have been fired, he works locally and therefore the question if he withdrew. Strange that Swarts did not get a look in with all the new positions, considering that he is at least a 1st XV coach.The u18’s have Giles, (KZNRU) as convener and maybe it should be a consideration in the future to have a KZNRU official in this all important position. It is said at KC that Dickson is a better u16 player than what Schram was, just don’t think Giles would have missed that.
@Gungets Tuft: yes, agreed about Skonk, that is why Toppy Hortop should be the sole Glenwood selector, in the same vein as Skonk. Very experienced too. Yes, but these days they pick squads of 22/23 and there are 4 different sides. I reckon in the 60’s they picked about 17 max, 2 reserves and only one side so get a cap/blazer meant something. Would be good to know who coached the sides, will check with my uncle too. College and DHS did dominate the sides, but I’m sure many a brilliant individual missed out. Ill try and dig up Glenwood stats for those decades….
@Grasshopper: Funny you should mention the 70’sw actually, because in general the 70’s were a relatively poor period for College in terms of results and in representation. in those 10 years College had only 47 representatives, and only 5 in SA Schools. Played 129, won 105, drew 11, lost 13. In the 60’s we had 62, 80’s we had 48, 90’s was 51. So it wasn’t College stealing your spots in the 70’s – must have been DHS. In the 2000’s it has been 58 in 13 years.
@Grasshopper: He might have coached the squad, but I don’t believe Skonk would have had a bias. Unless you knew him you coulnd possibly know the depth of honour and fairness in the man.
College, between 1964 and 1995, played 394 matches against KZN opposition. They won 332 of those, drew 24 and lost 38. By the standards used this year and last to justify the numbers of certain schools in the selections, I reckon College was hard done by to have just 6 or 7 in the side, there wasn’t a single second team player picked …
It’s all moot anyway, we don’t know who the selectors were. I will try to find out.
@Gungets Tuft: I think you will find there was quite a bit at stake prior to 1974, my uncle played KZN schools in 1964 and 1965, the first Craven Weeks. Doc Craven attended those and put words in for players he thought were good. He actually got picked by the doc as kicker and wing of the first tourno. You will know his name if you work it out. Surely Skonk coached the side a few years and might have had a slight DHS and College bias. Anyway, my point is College and DHS were the two powerhouses in those days and would have had the most reps by far. I’m certain many a great individual at Michaelhouse, Hilton, Glenwood and Kearsney didn’t get picked. I know of a few at Glenwood in the 70’s that were hard done by…..
@Grasshopper: Until 1974 there was nothing at stake. Only picked SA Schools from 1974 and until 1995 you only got pockey money paid under the table (unless your name was Naas Botha).
May I ask when you might feel that past injustice has been “swung and roundabouted” enough, I fear it is an argument that might also be applied to quotas as well. The spotlight will surely focus on College during that time, averaging about 6 or 7 a year for a long time. Will be interesting to see who the selectors were.
Can anyone list the natal/KZN coach since 1964? That would show which schools had bias prior to the semi professional era. Glenwood never used to get their fair share of reps, I say swings and roundabouts. But I would still like a fair representation of schools to ensure fingers are not pointed…
@ Grassy- the first game against the Free State Carel played flank with Moon( 8th) and Jean Luc making up the balance of the back row which had a stormer. I think Reegan was up against Adendorff( also GW) and although he was a big ball carrier, did not bring the other qualities required at that level and was exposed a bit against the Lions. Reegan would have brought some composure especially with regard to lineout options where we struggled badly.
Also you make an interesting point about social media and how possibly it could force some accountability in that issues very quickly get disseminated and dissected. No where to hide really. In the example above minutes after the selection the boys were on Twitter etc putting their views and choosing the team they believed would have done justice to KZN.
Glenwood really do seem to get a hard time.
This years selection at CW was not biased, the players selected were the best in their positions – appart from Brad Ellse, there was not one player who stood out, who should have been picked for the CW side.
In terms of the Academy Side, I have heard how Goodsen should have made this team, and perhaps he should have, but he was certainly never going to play ahead of Schramm, never.
Funnily enough, the Academy side was very successful at their respective week – the CW side performed poorly, but who would have changed that – there were no backline players this year who could have made a dramatic difference to the CW side – we lacked on size and pace!
Even if all coaches get changed, the selections would have will be similar in the years to come
If ever their was an oportunity to rid KZN Craven week selections of the bias ( be it percieved or real) in favour of Glenwood this was it – now it looks like that will be even more entrenched with the new appointment. Do the Sharks not pay enough ? Why else would SE still have to be assitant coach for school boys as well ? Suerly it can not be to keep the Glenwood flag flying for this years horse trading !
Looking forward to next year and I can only endorse the comment from Gungets about the schools doing their talking on the field
@Gungets Tuft: Carel Swart was the incumbent, yes he didn’t have a great 2012 by his standards, but the coaches had to give him a chance with Moon as the first pick. I don’t think Reegan was that much better than Carel to justify Carel’s exclusion. Carel is playing Bulls Under19 now so he too is doing OK. Not sure about what he is studying if anything.
Let me throw something in here regarding selections. Last year Reegan Smith did not make the second round of KZN selections. Even here there were comments about his abilities. My response was that the selectors were not capable of seeing alternatives, not capable of seeing potential, for whatever reason.
Reegan was contracted by the Bulls and is now in the Bulls U19 squad, despite being probably the only full time student, coping with all the demands of a full on law degree. So, the Bulls understand he cannot make all the practices but still he is in the squad, where young men who made their own provinces CW sides are not playing.
Has that much changed in 8 months. I doubt it. Anyone feel like airing views, who missed what, and how?
@Star and Gungets, agreed on your points. Let’s look at the positive though Bell is now in the coaching group so Westville have a senior rep. We just need one senior rep from each of the top 4 schools to have balance. Glenwood have 3 in the Under18 group, Erasmus, Dames and now Pinhead and one in the Under16 group in La Marque. Westville have 3 in Bell, Norris and Sorensen, Kearsney have 3 in Steyn, Moodley & Lubbe. College with just Collocott is under represented. La Marque with his College history and unbiased morals would not make dodgy decision. Pinhead should never have been brought in, what does he know about coaching. I know looking at the past does not right a wrong, but for many many years there was a bias towards certain schools in selection, it’s just with social media and the web, people are asking more questions. I remember in the 90’s when the Craven Week side was selected that was that, no questions asked…
@star: Politicking on behalf of your own kids at primary school is rife. It is a little more subdued at high school, desperate at club level. There is lots of noise at DRSU level about favouritism. The very last thing we need at KZN Schools level is a belief that what school you go to influences your possible success at post-school level but there is no question at all that this is the case (the belief). Whether it is true is debatable in the dog-eat-dog world of provincial rugby and S15, but that same pushy parents we detested at grade 5 level will respond and react to that.
College given up? – I don’t think so – they will do their talking on the field. If the people reading this blog are still doing so in 3 years time, then we can chat again. I can tell you this though, the process apparently being followed now is cheapening the value of the KZN Schools blazer which is a shame for the kids. They all work their #rses off to achieve that level only to have it discredited by the politics. Schools aren’t victims, kids are. The so-called grown ups need to wake up.
There is worrying trend that if you control the selection process you can unfairly promote and entice potential candidates. DG/BS come to mind. I have had conversations with parents who are asking what ” if” questions regarding due exposure of their sons. The problem is that this process is becoming entrenched . In another sport in another age group I witnessed a similar scenario unfold where 2 schools controlled the selection process . The 2 schools in question had 4 x the representation of 2 schools who had been the form teams over their time at high school. The parallels did not end there. A B team player was included over other A team candidates and the end result was that KZN as hosts won only 1 game out of 5. Surely we must reject this as it just erodes inter school relationships and the ultimate performance of our KZN teams. It is sad the College seems to have given up the fight as we need all hands on deck to get rid of this Trojan virus
( Sorry Beet but had to put that in there although not wanting to undermine the importance of the issue at hand)
@HM:Please elaborate on that statement that you are making about Collecott and Strudwick?
@HM: Care to explain that comment about Strudwick?
Bless TP with his appointment as I know he is desperate to be recognised by his peers since his stint as coach. The timing just aren’t great as we should have another large contingent representing the various teams next year. Lets face it, good players, many of them while doing quite a bit for development will by default have that result. The thing is that around May next year it will all be blamed on his influence. I see TP as a administrator, a good one at that but coaching or selecting at provincial level, nah. Must add that College have now overtaken DHS as our English Premier div side when it comes to hiring and firing of coaches. Collicott can count himself lucky actually to be the convener, the point his that College is desperate when it comes to coaches and maybe that’s the reason they have no representation. Did Strudwick not withdrew after he was appointed last year? That doesn’t help does it?
Hmmmm, I have written 5 different responses to this blog, deleted the lot. It’s not in my nature to be personal about others, not going to start now. Suffice to say that the spotlight gets increasingly focused and generally generates heat. I will wait and see how it all goes, principle wins in the end, always. Stay on that side of the line and it’s all good. It will be very obvious if the okes in the hotseat stray.
And people wonder why College is becoming disillusioned with the NRU. College did attempt to have more representation but by the looks of it that has been scuppered by the cabal of technical schools in and around central Durban.
@Tarpeys: agreed on all fronts! Ex Glenwood and Sharks scrum half Thulani Nteta used to coach at age group level, he could have been a good candidate. Glenwood and George Campbell are over represented. How Pinheiro got in there only god knows, does he even coach at Glenwood. If there was any Glenwood rep it should have been Toppy Hortop for his experience, knowledge and ability to see potential and nurture it.
Sounds like they have complicated the situation. Good luck to Barend. It’s not a situation I would have agreed to. Having such strong characters together could create tension. It looks like they have tried to make everybody happy and created a potentially explosive situation. Good luck to the players and wives of these gentlemen. Maybe it’s criticism like this that can make them more determined to work together.
The appointment of Lubbe and Dames as head coaches is a sign of the poor state of coaching in this province. Are there no schools first team head coaches out there that schools assistant coaches have to be put in these positions. Lubbe is a great oke but he has no pedigree as a head coach to take up this crucial position.
George Campbell seem to have quite a few personnel in various positions in the structure for a school of their stature.
Last point, in terms of transformation, where are the black coaches? Not a single black coach amongst the 12 or so appointed. Are schools not appointing black coaches, are there none that are worthy or qualified, are they being blatantly over looked or are they not interested?
@Westers: It is definitely not the former
@Grasshopper: Thanks for the honesty. Here’s to next years bun fight. At least we know the powers that be either don’t read this blog or don’t care what they read.
As a Glenwood supporter I don’t like Pinheiro in a selector position and would prefer no involvement from Dames or Erasmus. That way when Glenwood boys are picked there can be no hooha about their selection…….not great news at all…