Thing is: you have so many excellent schools in easily accessible locations theses days, that you do not have to go to boarding school in many cases. No logical reason to split family if you do not have to! Ps: I attended board and boy-school
@Grasshopper: I told my wife that I’ll pay all the fees and extras PLUS buy her a pair of shoes a month as long as my son boards at a boys’ school.I hope this will still stick when the time comes in 10 years’ time.
@GarsieOuer:
Om jou kind by Tuks stoei klub in te skryf is ‘n baie goeie besluit. Stoei is baie goed vir totale ontwikkeling van ‘n atleet en Tuks is een van die mees proffesionele klubs in die land.
@GreenBlooded: According to a well experienced almighty u14E team coach, it gets said each year that Gr8 gets easier, even in his days. It can’t be too bad though, my son hasn’t had any bruises or dreaded going back….
Come the end of the holidays, my lighty is like a fish out of water. He just want’s to get back to school, his mates and his routine. Can’t say it was like that in Gr8 though. Nathan’s must be getting soft…… 8)
@Redblack White: funny things sons; mine has told me even if live next door to College he is not moving out of the BE, he loves it so much. Must be really good if you can say that in Form II (Gr8 ) already. Any boy who boarded, myself included, will tell you it is tough and you learn to get organised and tough quickly, but on the counter side it is the best camaraderie ever and arguably the best days of your life! Of course moms will never ever get this, and every goodbye, even in matric, still has mom hiding some tears.
@Grasshopper: True – and given a choice I would keep mine at home by me – in this specific case I have hinted to my son before that Gauteng might be on the cards and the simple response: I’ll miss you guys……..
@Redblack White: Boarding is not for all boys or parents for that matter. Some might say you only have them for 18 years, why send them away for 5 of those. Others will say boarding helps them grow up and understand life isn’t easy and things are handed on a platter….it’s tough. I can tell you the mothers would prefer the boys at home ;-)
@Goldstones: Maybe I should have clarified – if we had to move and if local schooling was the only option………
I can tell you my son has already said he would be straight into the BE – regardless of where the move is (College till I die) – so my comment was more from a parents perspective and out of respect for PBHS, left with a choice it would be a no brainer.
@Tang: I hear exactly what you are saying about the modernisation of the gym and facilities. A good, and talented, kid I know passed up on a position at PBHS next year because of it, a real pity. Probably the best Gauteng school but the powers that be need to move it forward. Surely the old boys need to weigh in because I am sure, like most model C schools, they contribute significantly to the running expenses of the school. Like Hopper says, a gym is not that expensive, surely this can be pushed by the parents and old boys very quickly?
@Redblack White: Is there a reason you would swap from MC to PBHS, or for that matter the other way, if there was a move from KZN to Gauteng or other way? I know I’m in the minority but my boys chose MC over PBHS and would never have it any other way. The eldest, now in varsity, still swears it was the best thing ever for him. Yes I know the N3 like the back of my hand! No disrespect to PBHS, they were and still are one of my highly regarded high schools but not the obvious choice because I live in Gauteng. If some schools just north and one further south of MC have so many Jhb boys, why not College? Maybe 4.5 hours drive and a weekend in the countryside is not everyone’s cup of tea…
1)Teachers can be excellent rugby coaches – Jake White, Eddie Jones, Paul Anthony, etc.
2) There is a high risk of giving sports scholarships to Grade 7/ 8 boys.
I think the mantra Boys High needs to adopt is; “Success breeds success”.
There are few great case studies for Boys High to take a look at. Michael House is a classic example. If you are going to use teachers to coach, you must have specialists advising them and coaching them. This is a never-ending process.
I know there is not a single teacher or pupil at Boys High who plans for failure but the stakes with school boy rugby are extremely high and there is no time for slow experimentation. It is better to learn from schools who have evolved and then apply a model that is close to your ethos.
I am sure the Boys High director of rugby already has suggestions on how to build a sustainable winning rugby programme. I just hope the Boys High management will be progressive enough to adopt the recommendations.
@Tang: I think that a good coaching set up can go a long way.
I have not seen the benefit of handing out numerous scholarships for rugby players based on U13 performance by boys that are simply early developers and are often outstripped in their teenage years. Incidentally the entire coaching structure at MHS is comprised of teachers who I believe do a pretty good job with the 500 odd boys they have to work with.
@Die Ken: Die skole wat nie die squad systeem gebruik nie, ontneem spelers die kans om vir hul spanne rugby te speel. As daar 8 ekstra gebruik word in die A span, is daai plekke oop in die B span en so gaan dit deur tot in die laaste span. Ek is seker as die besluitnemers mooi gaan sit en dink hoe hulle sou voel indien hul seun een van daai seuns is wat opgeneem word om in die 1st team se squad te kom, dan sal hulle n ander deuntjie sing. Die feit dat die skole PRG wil boikot gaan oor politiek en die eie ek syndroom wat ons sport siek maak.
@rugbyfan: They went to the St Stithians festival this year where, unfortunately, they weren’t extended in any of their games. I suspect Helpmekaar were expected to provide more of a challenge than what transpired. The problem faced when drawing up these festival fixture lists is that it is difficult to judge the relative strength of schools at that stage of the season. Grey High were also at Saints and I think that they would have been a better fixture.
@Die Ken: Twee goed keer sommige skole…
1. Nie die groot poel spelers om so sisteem te maak werk nie.
2. Ooreenkoms tussen WP skole om nie squad sisteem te gebruik nie.
Kan my persoonlik min skeel of skole met squad of sonder speel..Grey speel al jare met so sisteem en daar is nog nooit gekla nie.
@PaarlBok: ek skud net my kop re die gesanik oor die squadstelsel – ons Boere darem. As die ABs ons terugtrek bd rucks dan kla ons dis onregverdig ens ens, maar niks keer ons om dieselfde te doen nie. In hierdie geval net so, hul kla en sanik oor die squad, maar niks keer hul om dieselfde te doen nie.
So twee drie jaar terug het Kempies0/14 Waterkloof gewen (in die Beeld reeks) met so amper helfde van die Waterkloof span wat in die laerskool in Kempton Park was.
Ek weet ook van ‘n bussie wat Kempton parkers Helpmekaar toe ry en baie van hulle ook maar goeie rugby spelers (ook ander sportsoorte op beurs).
Ja Laerskool kaalvoet rugby is awesome. Ek was gister in Nelspruit, met die Puma final tussen Laerskool Nelspruit & Laerskool Bergland (twee aartsvyande hier in die dorp)..Altwee spanne het 3 Craven week spelers. Bergland het verassend gewen 17-5 nadat hul vroeer in die liga verloor het teen Nellies. Was n uitstekekende game! Bergland is n klein skooltjie (minder as 700 leerlinge ek dink) en is seker die eerste keer in die geskiedenis dat hul Puma champs is! Onthou toe ek daar op skool was tussen 1978 en 84 .. het ons naby gekom.. maar elke keer in die finals verloor (dink teen Kriel en Klipfontein).. Bly om te verneem na hewige werwingsaksies deur top stads rugbyskole gaan die meeste outjies NHS toe volgende jaar.. so ons 0/14 behoort ook hulself te laat geld volgende jaar. Wat great is om te sien is hoe hul afrigters n klompie ordinary outjies kan vat en te verander in n extra ordinary span!
@Tang: Agree, I only have great memories of being hosted by PBHS in 1995 on athletics tour. I really got on with the boys there, down to earth and just genuine guys. There are many really good young coaches at the private schools, that can be enticed over to PBHS, it’s not only the money it’s about the numbers of kids involved and potentially playing top tier schools, my friend is an example. Coached 10 years at Westville, most Under15B and some A team, now coaching St David’s Under15A and doing really well with little resource. He is also coaching at club level, this is the kind of coach you guys need. Young and hungry. The gym is a no brainer and not a huge expense, R100k max. Get John Smit, Chiliboy, Brian Liebenberg etc involved, video clips etc…..
@GarsieOuer: Ja tygerpoort het n sterk span… die goeie nuus is dat van die 2 spanne wat in die finaal gespeel kom omtrent almal garsfontein hoërskool toe… garsies behoort dus volgende jaar n baie sterk o14 jaar te hê…
I think there are three key factors that need to be addressed:
1) Scholarships
2) Coaches
3) Gym
I guarantee Boys High are behind all their major opponents in the above areas.
Boys High have the following:
1) No sports scholarships (the English speaking Bulls recruits are placed at Southdowns).
2) Coaches – teachers are the A team and first team coaches.
3) A gym that can only be described as belonging to the dark ages.
If you don’t learn from history, your are bound to repeat the same mistakes in the future. The definition of insanity – trying to do the same thing over and over but expecting a different outcome. The variables that you can control, control properly.
I think all your points are valid – Feeder schools, coaching, etc
We look forward to the trip down to PMB. Always a hard tough fixture. Our boys know that Maritzburg are hard but fair.
Hopefully I can delay a trip to Aus so I can be in PMB.
@Grasshopper – You couldn’t ask for a better school. If I had the choice over, I would send my boys back to PBHS. Generally speaking, the boys turn out to be excellent young adults.
I think we all agree that a weak rugby programme has a negative impact on the perception of the school. I don’t have factual evidence to support this but I would be willing to bet there is a causal link between rugby results (A teams and first teams) and the number of children you attract to the school. Boys High might point out that they have not shown a decline in the number of boys applying. It would be interesting to see how many of the boarding school applications have boys who have played rugby at representative level. I would be willing to bet money on a decline in the number of boarding applications where a boy has played u13 Craven week.
@Tang: Hi Tang – I feel your pain , we are all brothers from different mothers after all.
make no mistake, you have a great school there – ask any College parent where they would send their kid if they had the misfortune of having to disappear behind the boerewors curtain
You have a point though – sound coaching across all age groups will result in good teams across the board – Yes, it does help to have some superstars, but these guys are difficult to attract and it is a dogfight out there. College firsts have had a decent season – not great, but as a team they have potential and have sometimes let themselves down, nevertheless, they have had a decent season without necessarily having any superstars (as evidenced by the CW selections)
I think as a school PBHS should look at enlisting help from its old boys, I dont know, maybe they have some prominent ex-Boks lurking somewhere Directional assistance – not saying they need to find a million dollar man.
Secondly, have a look at your traditional feeder schools – closer ties in trying to secure the up and coming rugger buggers – after all , this is not recruiting or poaching or buying, merely securing what would have been a natural choice in the time before pro-rugby and shop around season.
If it means starting with those few scholarships doesnt sound half as sleazy not so?
I know MC have lost out to quite a few good kids from traditional feeders right on their doorstep in recent years. Not even talking about boarders, these are day boys from right here in PMB. Hence my reason for saying that the starting point should be your feeder schools. Even the round ball proponents – youd be surprised at some of the raw talent that can be converted.
Anyways, good luck with this. we look forward to hosting your guys in the 3rd term – always a pleasure
@gimmie: PRG het hul bench gespeel in die o/19B games teen Gimmies en Boishaai. En soos ek verstaan, is daar altyd net 30 manne op die veld, behalwe as die reels onlangs verander het…
@gimmie: PRG het nie squad teen Gim gehad. Onthou , julle het mos Vrydag voor die game beswaar gemaak.
Teen Oakdale het julle verloor, maar ref het julle laat wen.
@Tang: I didn’t know that, good to have a chat to him to see if he would assist. PBHS are extremely strong in most of the major sports, swimming probably 3rd in SA, cricket up there but more importantly academics is top notch. If I’m still in Gauteng in 12 years from now my boy will go there. I just love the school. A friend of mine is the St David’s Under15A coach and he reckons PBHS have the players just lack the proper coaching and structures…
@JPS_10 – I had no idea that Boys High had dropped off so significantly in terms of CW contributions.
You are 100% right about the impact these players have. If the school is producing so few CW players, then young up and coming rugby players will think twice before coming to boys high.
Against Bennies, it was very clear. Bennies had a few real game changers in their backline (missed tackles certainly didn’t help). Bennies have brought in quite a few Zimbabwe CW players – they have some real game breakers in T Mujawo, M Manhambo and S Hlanguyo, etc.
@meadows: @McCulleys Workshop: I think what did effect the MH fixture list this year was they usually played 3 games at the Grey PE festival which was not held this year I know in 2014 they played 3 games there which was against Graeme/Queens/Grey PE which gave there fixture list a bit of a external mix to it.
Hopefully that is on again next year and they should be there.
@Grasshopper – I know who you are talking about.
Are you aware that there is another Boys High Old boy in the coaching set up at the Sharks. He was probably the most successful Boys High first team coach before he left for the Bulls and then moved on to the Sharks.
I know that many Boys High parents and teachers will think I am over reacting to the Bennies results. My view is that Boys High have to draw a line somewhere and find a way to improve at rugby. Other sports are in good shape.
I think the approach to rugby has to be different to other sports. In my view school boy rugby is the most professional of the school sports and you can’t ask the Boys High boys (in the A teams) to prepare and play like the B/C/ D/ E teams prepare and play – it is just not fair to them.
I am sure the new director of rugby will address these issues (I certainly hope he does).
There are a few key questions:
1) To Scholarship or not to Scholarship – will scholarships have a positive influence on Boys High rugby without any negative effects on the school.
2) Employ more professional coaches – kicking, defense, scrumming, etc
3) Build a proper gym that matches the rugby culture of the school (Danny Boy has a rugby ball in his one hand).
I can tell you that many PBHS old boys would welcome the former first team coach back to Boys High.
@Tang: Agreed, I hope someone steps in to sort this. I also thought the Bennies results to be a surprise. The Sharks might need to get rid of a PBHS Old Boy shortly if their results continue to decline. Maybe PBHS should bring him in as a consultant or even Director of Rugby, you know who I’m talking about….
Oakdale is een van die beste spanne in SA. Gim het egter welverdient gewen. Verskeie Oakdale driee was teen die verloop van die spel en Gim het heelwat gebiedsvoordeel gehad (meer as 60% sien http://www.ruggas.co.za). Dit was egter n baie goeie wedstryd en albei spanne het puik vertoon.
Geluk aan Boishaai met puik oorwinning. Ek wonder of Paul Roos nie maar eerder volgende jaar met n groter squad wil speel nie. Hulle sukkel om met 23 teen 15 spelers die Paarlse skole te klop…
@Rugger fan: He injured it playing for the KZN B team in Vryheid if I’m correct. Some advice. He must have professional rehab and develop the other leg at the same time. Too many players recover from the one leg and then injure the other. Your son is a talented player and could have a decent future ahead of him.
@scrummie: ek weet laerskool garsfontein speel teen tygerpoort in die o/13 finaal en sover ek weet is die game vanmiddag 16:20 by hoërskool oos-moot se velde…
@Cappie: Dis presies die probleem. Die bal is voor die lyn verloor en dit is reg voor die skeidsregter wat die drie toeken.
Die ergste van als is dat niks sal verander nie. Gim het die game gewen en dit sal so bly staan! Ek is egter verbaas dat daar nog nie een Gimmie iets oor die game gesê het nie.
@PaarlBok: Op die fotos lyk dit of die bal nooit oor die doellyn was nie, maar het die nr 6 van Oakdale nie die bal terug geknie na hy oor die doellyn was nie? Die ou wat die drie druk is duidelik oor die doellyn. Die skydsregter is in die perfekte posisie om presies te sien wat gebeur het.
@Tang: Ja, daar sal inderdaad iets by PBH moet gebeur. Hulle het nog steeds 24+ spanne, maar die kwaliteit van rugby is besig om skipbreuk te lei.
@Cappie – Thank you. When Boys High win one A team fixture against St Benedicts (no disrespect to Bennies), alarm bells should be ringing at every level.
In my view this is an unmitigated disaster and one which needs immediate corrective action.
On another note. What do Affies get out of a fixture with Boys High (besides the tradition). Boys High struggle to win a single match against Affies.
I think there is a widely held and misguided opinion that results go in cycles. However, I would urge the management of Boys High not to become complacent and just accept this fate. Boys High have heaps of talent but it is not coached from u14 level up to open level. There is no incentive for any budding rugby player to come to Boys High. The last five to six years results have been mediocre at best and they are getting worse not getting better.
If Boys High only want to be an academic and cultural school, then stop arrranging fixtures against schools who take rugby seriously.
@Tang: Sjoe Tang, I share your pain with respect to PBH’s performance over the last few years. I really hope they can adapt and live on. We need a strong PBH. May a solid traditional relation between PBH and Affies not be affected as a result of the newest trend.
@Tang: Yep – knee unfortunately. Initial prognosis is 12 months out. We are off to a 2nd opinion tomorrow. Praying for a speedy recovery of his ACL/MCL
@Rugger fan – I think it may be easy for college on their home turf.
I may be in Australia for the fixture so I might not be traveling down to PMB.
What happened to your son? Nothing serious I hope.
Hopefully I can delay the trip to Aus and then we can catch up at College. Don’t give me a hard time about the results though. Our tolerance level for losing is very low at the moment.
The loquacious headmaster delivers another garrulous homily filled with platitudes about being a school that plays sport and not being a sports school.
The confused boys listen expectantly. Bruised bodies put on the line week after week. Maybe it is just better to play chess, join the Dixie band or the Pipe Band. At least then you don’t have to take responsibility for yet another set back and incur the wrath of the old boys and parents.
When will our headmaster realize that we are playing against teams who are infinitely more prepared than we are? Surely he will take note after this weekends setback. We know we are a “School who plays sport and not a sports school” but then why do we play Westville, Affies, KES, Maritzburg College? Are these schools sports schools? Perhaps they are just the same as we are but have realized that playing school boy rugby in South Africa is becoming more and more professional – they have evolved.
The boys wait. Hopefully today is the day our head, our leader realizes that we also need to evolve. Our environment has changed. We are playing against teams filled with boys on sports bursaries, We are playing against teams coached by professional coaches. To survive in this jungle we had better adapt.
It just feels wrong when week after week Boys High win one A team fixture. It just feels wrong when Boys High fail to adapt to the environment they are in. Adapting is not admitting failure, it is the foundation of evolving and surviving.
@Oakdale supporter: Ek het elders ook verneem die skeidsregter was nie op standaard nie en albei spanne is daarmee van ‘n regverdige wedstryd ontneem.
Ek dink die skeidsregterstelsel behoort te verander waar skole se eerstespanwedstryde nie as proeflopies/geleenthede vir ontwikkeling gebruik moet nie. Die top skeidsregters behoort na my mening deesdae ook die skolewedstryde te hanteer vanwee die groot belangstelling daarin.
Ja, PG se dryfmale is ‘n sterkpunt, maar ek was ook beindruk met hul agterspel.
Sterkte vorentoe, julle het ‘n stywe program wat voorlê.
@Djou: Jy is heeltemal reg dat ‘n wedstryd 70 minute duur en ek wou nie gister se dit was nie ‘n drie nie, want dit sou na suur druiwe klink. Ek weet nie hoe om die link te plaas nie maar gaan kyk gerus na Brakkies Sport Fotos se Facebook blad. Daar is baie duidelike bewys dat dit nie ‘n drie was nie. Dis hartseer as die beter span van die dag so moet verloor. Een ding wat ek Gim moet krediet voor moet gee, hulle was Oakdale oor as dit kom by die dryfmaal vanaf lynstane. Dit is beslis hul wapen.
@CharlesZA: Hy was in Garsfontein. Jammer die keurders in die Kaap het hom nie kans gegee nie, want ek het lanklaas (op vroee ouderdom – o.14 en o.15) ‘n losskakel gesien wat soveel visie en goeie oordeelvermoe het. Dit is talent wat net met groot moeite aangeleer kan word.
@BoishaaiPa: Ek is nie ‘n negatiewe mens nie, maar wanneer ek ‘n punt uitwys gaan my nie keer nie, maak nie saak hoe afgesaag nie.
Terloops, ek is nie negatief teenoor Kaapse skole nie. Maar ek verdra nie windgatte nie want ek dink dit is ‘n negatiewe eienskap, daarmee is jy reg.
Ek het dieselfde punt al uitgewys teenoor baie bloggers. Wanneer ‘n wendrie gedruk word maak nie saak nie want ‘n wedstryd duur 70 minute, nie 69 minute nie. Hierdie is ‘n klassieke geval in die sielkunde. Mens voeg ietsie by om die pyn sagter te maak. Bv., eintlik het ons die hele wedstryd voorgeloop behalwe vir 1 minuut en dus die grootste deel van die wedstryd gewen. M.a.w. omdat die wendrie eers in die laaste minuut gedruk is, is dit nie so erg vergeleke met indien die wendrie 10m voor die einde gedruk is.
@BoishaaiPa: Ek hoop wedstyde teen HHH en Primrose word replace met games teen Bishops en Rondebosch. Behalwe vir die feit dat dit heeltemal mismatches is, het ons ook nou te veel spanne vir daardie skole en speel die laer spanne in elk geval week in en uit teen Prem A.
@Oakdale supporter: Na Interskole moet ons nog julle speel…ek sien nie uit na daai trippie nie!…Want ons gaan of op n high wees of op n low en geen span kan so ongebalanseerd Riversdal toe gaan nie!
@CharlesZA: Baie geluk met julle goeie wen…Boland is nie speletjies nie. Julle verdien n kans om n slag meer gereeld teen die Premier A skole te speel. Julle resultate regdeur die ouderdoms groepe regverdig dit. Julle is besig om dinge reg te doen en dit is altyd goed vir skolerugby.
@LAEVELDER: Ekskuus, het vergeet – jy glo nie om vele goed in results te lees nie, maar wel wat op die telbord staan. Nou wat is die verskil tussen die result en wat op die telbord staan?
@LAEVELDER: Sjoe, wat ‘n redenasie. So die Bulle is nou swakker omdat hul eerste keuse spelers wat of beseer of nie beskikbaar was vir die wedstryd nie nou wel in die span is – dit is waarop jou redenasie neerkom.
Maar geluk, die Pumas het gewen. Hoop jy is nou tevrede. Kan nie glo ‘n mens kan so aangaan nie.
Geluk aan Paarl Gim met julle wen vandag. Oakdale was baie ongelukkig om nie te wen maar dit was naby. 31-28 met Gim wat wendrie in laaste minuut druk.
Was bevoreg om langs die veld te staan en te sien hoe Stellenberg vir Landbou 21-17 wen. Span het regtig goed gespeel en die loskakel moet man of match wees met die wen drie wat hy gemaak het.
Onder 14 en 16 spanne ook gewen. Seker die beste dag se rugby vir ons skool
in n baie lang tyd of dalk ooit.
@Vleis: The Wellington game was pretty tight on the scoreboard at the end, 24-21, but I think that they scored at the death to close the gap. They were a big, well drilled, side.
Here is a youtube link to the highlights of that game if you are interested. Lions players Ruan Combrinck (2) and Robbie de Bruyn (1) scored tries and Pat Lambie kicked everything. 2m Kings lock Cameron Lindsay dominated the lineouts.
@Grasshopper: I am sure that if it were put to the boys they would prefer the system of a few years back where rugby continued in the 3rd term. The decision to change that was not one that I agreed with. That would have resulted in about 4 additional games.
The reality is that the school does not give a continental about either claiming a “big” scalp or aiming and, by implication, planning for an unbeaten season. The fact is that the last one was in 1910!
They simply do not have the depth to play annual inter-schools fixtures against the likes of Affies, Grey or Paul Roos. in good years they would be competitive in some of the A team games but I am sure that it would get messy from there on down as it tends to against the big government schools in Natal.
The only opportunity that they have to claim a “big’ scalp is the Easter festivals and to my knowledge they have never ducked anyone they have been asked to play at those tournaments. I can recall a MHS beating Affies at St Johns in around 2004 and then being well beaten by Paul Roos in their next game. Similarly, the U16’s have regularly attended the excellent Paarl Gym tournament where they have played the likes of the hosts, Paarl Boys and Grey College.
it is a pity that the Saints fixture list this year did provide a stiffer test but i suspect that the organisers thought that Helpmekaar would do that. Commentators on this site predicted a loss for House in that game and not the 50pt win that resulted. Incidentally the same Helpmekaar that claimed one of your “big” scalps, Waterkloof, a few weeks back.
Glo ook nie om vele goed te lees in results nie, kom ons lees maar net wat op die telbord gestaan het toe die eindfluitjie geblaas het.. die span met die meeste punte is die wenner en hoef nie n “claim” in te sit nie. Maar as dit jou sal laat beter voel kan ons maak of die game nooit plaas gevind het nie…
Onthou ook om 6 spelers te vervang in n span beteken nie altyd die span is nou sterker nie. Sterkte vir julle met Bondedag en Cravenweek! Hou die Noorde se naam hoog (veral teen WP)!!
Personally I would take a huge scalp like Affies, Monnas, Waterkloof, Paul Roos, Boishaai, Paarl Gim, Grey Bloem etc overran unbeaten season any day. Glenwood have a few of these over the past 5 years..
12 games over 4 to 5months is taking it easy to the max. Tons of prep & recovery time. 15 to 20 is average these days. Some play 25! For me about 18 is spot on, avg 1 per week. But if having an unbeaten season is important, best to give your team the best chance to achieve that.
@McCulleys Workshop: Yes, St John’s is out of town, but you only travel there every second year. [To be honest, you don’t need to be an actuary to work that out] Many schools (most even) have one guaranteed away fixture per annum for all the winter teams, or at least the A teams.
I don’t know of any school in the country that has only 12 games per annum, apart from MHS, but if that (or 12.5) floats your boat then no worries. Given how defensively you react whenever said topic is raised, I suspect that your boat has a few cracks.
No, I’m not an actuary…that’s far to racy and exciting for the likes of me.
@meadows: Last year was also very close at Grey against their ‘dream team’. Are you able to post the results of the 2008 season? I sincerely hope that you thumped Wellington. I think that I watched the MHS v Hilton game at MHS in 2008….but in those days, I had no clue which school was good/great/etc. I stayed at a mate who lives close to the school and went down for the party, more than the rugby.
@Vleis: Thanks Vleis, I will pass on your well conceived ideas. Are you an actuary? I think St Johns is an out of town side, unless we have been playing the girls side down the road for the last 10 years! I personally think they should have played 12.5 games, that would have added spice to it all, and certainly aimed for better sides than College or Glenwood.
@Vleis: I agree that 12 is too few. I much preferred when rugby was played in the 3rd term.
By way of example the 2008 side played 19 games, 4 of which took place in the 3rd term – including Westville, Hilton and the touring Wellington College side that had just won the Daily Mail Cup at Twickenham. 3 games at the Grey festival including Grey and Middelburg and 3 in Vryheid including a great game against the Harmony Academy. That doesn’t include games played by a MHS XV (comprised of a few 1st Xv, 2nd and U16’s) that played at that years ISRF which clashed with the provincial weeks.
It was a pity that they didn’t play Grey at Saints. I think that Helpmekaar were expected to be tougher opposition than it turned out but perhaps that is a reflection of how good this side is given Helpies win over Waterkloof.
There have been some great games against Grey over the years – 2007 at KES and 2008 at Grey as well as at Grey again in 2012. The ’08 side’s only loss in 19 matches was to Grey in PE.
@meadows: I think that House’s fixture list is largely fine, but 12 is too little. They should add two more fixtures – one local one and one further out of town fixture. That way, they have one out of town fixture per annum. Unfortunately, they didn’t play Grey PE at Saints this year – to be honest, Saints made a proper mess of the final day fixtures.
@Vleis: I guess that it’s the nature of rugby in a 500+ boy private school. 2013 was possibly the weakest MHS side that I can recall, preceded by a good side in 2012, and followed by a decent side last year and another very good side this year. I suspect that next year will not be very strong. Lack of depth, even in good years, is a perpetual problem.
What is pleasing is that the coaching set up does seem to develop players over their time at the school if one looks at the improvement against many opponents from U14 through to the open age group. it is also a good reason for sticking to your traditional fixture list (including the St johns inter-schools) supplemented by attendance at one of the Easter festivals and/or the occasional tour rather than trying to develop an inter-provincial program against bigger opponents.
@meadows: Thanks – that’s interesting. I didn’t realise that Hilton’s biggest win was in 2013.
One of my son’s friends moved from House to St Alban’s in grade 11. He was unhappy to leave House, but that changed by the time his was in matric (2013) as House lost to Hilton twice (including said largest ever loss) but his new team beat Hilton that year.
@star: @meadows: I seem to remember a 4 year winning streak which would have been more than 6 games, although there may have been a few draws. That ended in 83.
@LAEVELDER: Nege van die 15 spelers teen Pumas het Cravenweekspan gehaal.
Dink nie daar kan enigiets in die oefenwedstryd gelees word nie, hoewel jy graag ‘n oorwinning wil “claim”. Punt is, dit was nie die werklike spanne wat kragte gemeet het nie.
Teen KZN was dit anders want dit was die werklike spanne wat gespeel het.
@Kempie Pa: Ek is nie so seker oor die gesukkel nie..so elke nou en dan sal jy n afjaar he..oor die algemeen gesien doen WP spanne altyd goed by die verskillende weke..Ek dink nie hulle sukkel nie as mens na die stats kyk nie….Regdeur die ouderdomsgroepe van 0/13 tot 0/18 speel en wen hulle gereeld die verskeie weke…Ek dink nie daar is n provinsie wat dieslfde record het as dit by al die versklilende weke kom nie..Van die 44 “finals” wat sedert 1971 gespeel is het WP in 21 daarvan gespeel..net mooi amper1 elke 2de jaar…Die naaste span aan hulle is OVS met 16 verskyings met Grey as hulle hoofbron van spelers..Klink nie vir my of WP te veel sukkel nie of hoe?
@BoishaaiPa:
Ek het meer na laas jaar se vertonings verwys as die glipsie laas week deur WP. Dit is net vreemd dat WP met soveel talent tot hulle beskikking so sukkel. Al die provinsies het dieselfde probleem om van skole oor te skakel na CW toe.
@star: Can’t confirm that 7 is correct but I got that from the school newsletter so I assumed that they had consulted the archive According to the same source one of the fixtures in ’84 did not take place due to flu so that may have an impact on your calculation. Similarly one fixture was abandoned in 2010 due to thunderstorms which would have affected the 2007 – 2010 MHS streak.
@meadows: We have had plenty of family discussions on the length of the winning streak. I remember my younger brother playing in a Hilton team that stopped such a streak in 1985.( Although that would mean that Teichie would have lost in the games he played.) If I count back to when I played in 1982 then that is a minimum of 6 games. I am also pretty sure that I came in in the midst of a loosing streak so that 7 games does not seem right.
@ Red,Black White- I suppose you can’t give the game that your son is reffing on Saturday. I would not mind a gander.
Hilton’s win against Kearsney and the MHS victory against College on Goldstones has set this weekend’s 194th game between the old rivals up nicely.
The fixture was first played in 1904 and to date MHS have won 97, Hilton 86 and there have been 10 draws. Scoreline’s have generally been close over the years with a total points difference of 181pts in MHS’s favour over the 193 games. House’s biggest win was 51-0 in 1910 (not sure what that would translate into with 5pt tries) and Hilton’s was 42-12 in 2013. In modern times House won 40-0 and 44-17 in 2007. The longest winning streak for either school has been 7 games.
Ja die Puma span lyk ook nie meer dieselfde as toe nie, eerlik dink ek ons sal hul hierdie keer nog verder wen. Maar kom ons wag maar.. sal maar moet sien hoe sterk is hul regtig wanneer hul teen Monnas speel op Bondedag!
@LAEVELDER: ek dink die BB span wat in Middelburg gespeel het en die een wat craven week toe gaan is redelik 2 verskillende spanne. Ek dink ongelukkig is moontlik die grootste wedstryd die jaar reeds op die eerste dag tussen WP en die BB.
Glo ook nie dis n upset nie (die Pumas het die Bulle ook getem).. die Pumas het nie n lekker CW verlede jaar gehad nie (nogal in Middelburg) maar in 2013 CW vir die Cheetahs en KZN gewen en goed opgeweeg teen WP al het hul die game verloor
@Kempie Pa: Ek stem heeltemal met Die Ken en BoishaaiPa saam, maar dis darem tog lekker as SWD vir WP wen. Maak nie saak of dit ‘n oefenwedstryd was nie.
@Kempie Pa: Ek dink jy moet eerder maar weer besin oor daardie stelling. Jy kan absoluut geen korrelasie tref tussen CW en Skole spanne van die WP nie. Daar is hoegenaamd nie dieselfde span dinamika of opset nie. Sukkel teen SWD?..Om met n punt te verloor in n oefenwedstryd sal ek ook nou nie juis sukkel noem nie!..Die SWD bestaan uit spelers van 2 skole wat gereeld saam speel..WP uit 6 of 7 verskillende skole..Ek wonder of St Johns/St Stithians/KES en Kearsney toernooie en Wildeklawer in die Kaap gespeel word, want dan mis ek hulle gereeld lyk dit my!…Die Paasfees toernooie is almal behalwe Kearsney in JHB en sover my kennis strek is dit in die Noordvaal!.Ons dring op niks aan nie..Die resultate is daar om te lees!…Ongelukkig het jy geen punt wat ondersteun kan word nie.
@Kempie Pa: As n ou Transvaler, moet ek se ek stem nie saam met jou nie. Die Kaapse spanne speel vanjaar beter rugby as daarbo en dit reflekteer reg in die rankings. Sekere politiek met die kies van CW spanne, die spel vd WP span teen SWD op daai dag, die feit dat SWD se manne almal amper elke naweek saamspeel, en nog ander elemente het ‘n gelei tot daardie telling. Moenie jouself laat fool deur een telling nie. Die Wynland 4 het 4 moerse 0/19A spanne vanjaar. Ek dink nie met minder wedstryde, later die seisoen, sou AHS, EGJ of Monnas beter gedoen het nie.
Dit is nogal vreemd as julle Kapenaars daarop aandring dat julle die beste skole rugby spanne het, gewoonlik 3 uit Top 5. Laas jaar het julle nie so goed gedoen op die Craven week soos die ranking aandui nie. Hier sukkel julle al weer teen SWD wat net 2 spanne in die Top 20 het.
Ek dink dit ondersteun my punt dat julle te veel lees in die voor seisoen wedstryde waar Noord Vaal spanne tipies 5 wedstryde (weg van die huis af) in 9 dae speel.
Thing is: you have so many excellent schools in easily accessible locations theses days, that you do not have to go to boarding school in many cases. No logical reason to split family if you do not have to! Ps: I attended board and boy-school
@Playa: You have plenty of good ones to choose from here in Western Cape that won’t break the bank..good government institutions.
@Grasshopper: I told my wife that I’ll pay all the fees and extras PLUS buy her a pair of shoes a month as long as my son boards at a boys’ school.I hope this will still stick when the time comes in 10 years’ time.
@GarsieOuer:
Om jou kind by Tuks stoei klub in te skryf is ‘n baie goeie besluit. Stoei is baie goed vir totale ontwikkeling van ‘n atleet en Tuks is een van die mees proffesionele klubs in die land.
@GreenBlooded: According to a well experienced almighty u14E team coach, it gets said each year that Gr8 gets easier, even in his days. It can’t be too bad though, my son hasn’t had any bruises or dreaded going back….
@Goldstones:
Come the end of the holidays, my lighty is like a fish out of water. He just want’s to get back to school, his mates and his routine. Can’t say it was like that in Gr8 though. Nathan’s must be getting soft……
8)
@Redblack White: funny things sons; mine has told me even if live next door to College he is not moving out of the BE, he loves it so much. Must be really good if you can say that in Form II (Gr8 ) already. Any boy who boarded, myself included, will tell you it is tough and you learn to get organised and tough quickly, but on the counter side it is the best camaraderie ever and arguably the best days of your life! Of course moms will never ever get this, and every goodbye, even in matric, still has mom hiding some tears.
@Grasshopper: True – and given a choice I would keep mine at home by me – in this specific case I have hinted to my son before that Gauteng might be on the cards and the simple response: I’ll miss you guys……..
@Redblack White: Boarding is not for all boys or parents for that matter. Some might say you only have them for 18 years, why send them away for 5 of those. Others will say boarding helps them grow up and understand life isn’t easy and things are handed on a platter….it’s tough. I can tell you the mothers would prefer the boys at home ;-)
@Goldstones: Maybe I should have clarified – if we had to move and if local schooling was the only option………
I can tell you my son has already said he would be straight into the BE – regardless of where the move is (College till I die) – so my comment was more from a parents perspective and out of respect for PBHS, left with a choice it would be a no brainer.
@Tang: I hear exactly what you are saying about the modernisation of the gym and facilities. A good, and talented, kid I know passed up on a position at PBHS next year because of it, a real pity. Probably the best Gauteng school but the powers that be need to move it forward. Surely the old boys need to weigh in because I am sure, like most model C schools, they contribute significantly to the running expenses of the school. Like Hopper says, a gym is not that expensive, surely this can be pushed by the parents and old boys very quickly?
@Redblack White: Is there a reason you would swap from MC to PBHS, or for that matter the other way, if there was a move from KZN to Gauteng or other way? I know I’m in the minority but my boys chose MC over PBHS and would never have it any other way. The eldest, now in varsity, still swears it was the best thing ever for him. Yes I know the N3 like the back of my hand! No disrespect to PBHS, they were and still are one of my highly regarded high schools but not the obvious choice because I live in Gauteng. If some schools just north and one further south of MC have so many Jhb boys, why not College? Maybe 4.5 hours drive and a weekend in the countryside is not everyone’s cup of tea…
@Meadows – You make a few valid points.
1)Teachers can be excellent rugby coaches – Jake White, Eddie Jones, Paul Anthony, etc.
2) There is a high risk of giving sports scholarships to Grade 7/ 8 boys.
I think the mantra Boys High needs to adopt is; “Success breeds success”.
There are few great case studies for Boys High to take a look at. Michael House is a classic example. If you are going to use teachers to coach, you must have specialists advising them and coaching them. This is a never-ending process.
I know there is not a single teacher or pupil at Boys High who plans for failure but the stakes with school boy rugby are extremely high and there is no time for slow experimentation. It is better to learn from schools who have evolved and then apply a model that is close to your ethos.
I am sure the Boys High director of rugby already has suggestions on how to build a sustainable winning rugby programme. I just hope the Boys High management will be progressive enough to adopt the recommendations.
@Tang: I think that a good coaching set up can go a long way.
I have not seen the benefit of handing out numerous scholarships for rugby players based on U13 performance by boys that are simply early developers and are often outstripped in their teenage years. Incidentally the entire coaching structure at MHS is comprised of teachers who I believe do a pretty good job with the 500 odd boys they have to work with.
@Die Ken: Die skole wat nie die squad systeem gebruik nie, ontneem spelers die kans om vir hul spanne rugby te speel. As daar 8 ekstra gebruik word in die A span, is daai plekke oop in die B span en so gaan dit deur tot in die laaste span. Ek is seker as die besluitnemers mooi gaan sit en dink hoe hulle sou voel indien hul seun een van daai seuns is wat opgeneem word om in die 1st team se squad te kom, dan sal hulle n ander deuntjie sing. Die feit dat die skole PRG wil boikot gaan oor politiek en die eie ek syndroom wat ons sport siek maak.
@rugbyfan: They went to the St Stithians festival this year where, unfortunately, they weren’t extended in any of their games. I suspect Helpmekaar were expected to provide more of a challenge than what transpired. The problem faced when drawing up these festival fixture lists is that it is difficult to judge the relative strength of schools at that stage of the season. Grey High were also at Saints and I think that they would have been a better fixture.
@Die Ken: Twee goed keer sommige skole…
1. Nie die groot poel spelers om so sisteem te maak werk nie.
2. Ooreenkoms tussen WP skole om nie squad sisteem te gebruik nie.
Kan my persoonlik min skeel of skole met squad of sonder speel..Grey speel al jare met so sisteem en daar is nog nooit gekla nie.
@PaarlBok: ek skud net my kop re die gesanik oor die squadstelsel – ons Boere darem. As die ABs ons terugtrek bd rucks dan kla ons dis onregverdig ens ens, maar niks keer ons om dieselfde te doen nie. In hierdie geval net so, hul kla en sanik oor die squad, maar niks keer hul om dieselfde te doen nie.
@Die Ken: Lyk my Gim het 16 spelers gehad teen Oakdale.
@Murrayfield: Garsfontein is die naaste top-liga skool…
@
Ek het my u/11 outjie by TUKS stoei ingeboek gisteraand. Bietjie daai bolyf sterk kry. Sy doelwit (wat hy vir homself gestel het) is om volgende jaar as u/12 vir Garsfontein se o/13 eerste te speel. Daarvoor sal hy moet werk…
So twee drie jaar terug het Kempies0/14 Waterkloof gewen (in die Beeld reeks) met so amper helfde van die Waterkloof span wat in die laerskool in Kempton Park was.
Ek weet ook van ‘n bussie wat Kempton parkers Helpmekaar toe ry en baie van hulle ook maar goeie rugby spelers (ook ander sportsoorte op beurs).
@Rugbyman:
Julle het nou net die spelers geadverteer, nou kom al die kopers julle planne in die wiele ry.
@Rugbyman: @Rugbyman: Ja Rugbyman en so kry Parkies net die krummels vir 2016 se o/14!!! Lekkerdag!
@Rugbyman:
Ja Laerskool kaalvoet rugby is awesome. Ek was gister in Nelspruit, met die Puma final tussen Laerskool Nelspruit & Laerskool Bergland (twee aartsvyande hier in die dorp)..Altwee spanne het 3 Craven week spelers. Bergland het verassend gewen 17-5 nadat hul vroeer in die liga verloor het teen Nellies. Was n uitstekekende game! Bergland is n klein skooltjie (minder as 700 leerlinge ek dink) en is seker die eerste keer in die geskiedenis dat hul Puma champs is! Onthou toe ek daar op skool was tussen 1978 en 84 .. het ons naby gekom.. maar elke keer in die finals verloor (dink teen Kriel en Klipfontein).. Bly om te verneem na hewige werwingsaksies deur top stads rugbyskole gaan die meeste outjies NHS toe volgende jaar.. so ons 0/14 behoort ook hulself te laat geld volgende jaar. Wat great is om te sien is hoe hul afrigters n klompie ordinary outjies kan vat en te verander in n extra ordinary span!
@Tang: Agree, I only have great memories of being hosted by PBHS in 1995 on athletics tour. I really got on with the boys there, down to earth and just genuine guys. There are many really good young coaches at the private schools, that can be enticed over to PBHS, it’s not only the money it’s about the numbers of kids involved and potentially playing top tier schools, my friend is an example. Coached 10 years at Westville, most Under15B and some A team, now coaching St David’s Under15A and doing really well with little resource. He is also coaching at club level, this is the kind of coach you guys need. Young and hungry. The gym is a no brainer and not a huge expense, R100k max. Get John Smit, Chiliboy, Brian Liebenberg etc involved, video clips etc…..
@GarsieOuer: Ja tygerpoort het n sterk span… die goeie nuus is dat van die 2 spanne wat in die finaal gespeel kom omtrent almal garsfontein hoërskool toe… garsies behoort dus volgende jaar n baie sterk o14 jaar te hê…
@Redblack White – I agree fully with your post.
I think there are three key factors that need to be addressed:
1) Scholarships
2) Coaches
3) Gym
I guarantee Boys High are behind all their major opponents in the above areas.
Boys High have the following:
1) No sports scholarships (the English speaking Bulls recruits are placed at Southdowns).
2) Coaches – teachers are the A team and first team coaches.
3) A gym that can only be described as belonging to the dark ages.
If you don’t learn from history, your are bound to repeat the same mistakes in the future. The definition of insanity – trying to do the same thing over and over but expecting a different outcome. The variables that you can control, control properly.
I think all your points are valid – Feeder schools, coaching, etc
We look forward to the trip down to PMB. Always a hard tough fixture. Our boys know that Maritzburg are hard but fair.
Hopefully I can delay a trip to Aus so I can be in PMB.
@Rugbyman: Laerskool Garsfontein u/9’s and u/13’s het hulle stadsbeker finale gewen. u/13’s het 7-3 gewen. Nie besef Tygerpoort is so sterk nie!
@Grasshopper – You couldn’t ask for a better school. If I had the choice over, I would send my boys back to PBHS. Generally speaking, the boys turn out to be excellent young adults.
I think we all agree that a weak rugby programme has a negative impact on the perception of the school. I don’t have factual evidence to support this but I would be willing to bet there is a causal link between rugby results (A teams and first teams) and the number of children you attract to the school. Boys High might point out that they have not shown a decline in the number of boys applying. It would be interesting to see how many of the boarding school applications have boys who have played rugby at representative level. I would be willing to bet money on a decline in the number of boarding applications where a boy has played u13 Craven week.
@Tang: Hi Tang – I feel your pain , we are all brothers from different mothers after all.
make no mistake, you have a great school there – ask any College parent where they would send their kid if they had the misfortune of having to disappear behind the boerewors curtain
You have a point though – sound coaching across all age groups will result in good teams across the board – Yes, it does help to have some superstars, but these guys are difficult to attract and it is a dogfight out there. College firsts have had a decent season – not great, but as a team they have potential and have sometimes let themselves down, nevertheless, they have had a decent season without necessarily having any superstars (as evidenced by the CW selections)
I think as a school PBHS should look at enlisting help from its old boys, I dont know, maybe they have some prominent ex-Boks lurking somewhere
Directional assistance – not saying they need to find a million dollar man.
Secondly, have a look at your traditional feeder schools – closer ties in trying to secure the up and coming rugger buggers – after all , this is not recruiting or poaching or buying, merely securing what would have been a natural choice in the time before pro-rugby and shop around season.
If it means starting with those few scholarships doesnt sound half as sleazy not so?
I know MC have lost out to quite a few good kids from traditional feeders right on their doorstep in recent years. Not even talking about boarders, these are day boys from right here in PMB. Hence my reason for saying that the starting point should be your feeder schools. Even the round ball proponents – youd be surprised at some of the raw talent that can be converted.
Anyways, good luck with this. we look forward to hosting your guys in the 3rd term – always a pleasure
@gimmie: PRG het hul bench gespeel in die o/19B games teen Gimmies en Boishaai. En soos ek verstaan, is daar altyd net 30 manne op die veld, behalwe as die reels onlangs verander het…
@gimmie: PRG het nie squad teen Gim gehad. Onthou , julle het mos Vrydag voor die game beswaar gemaak.
Teen Oakdale het julle verloor, maar ref het julle laat wen.
@Tang: I didn’t know that, good to have a chat to him to see if he would assist. PBHS are extremely strong in most of the major sports, swimming probably 3rd in SA, cricket up there but more importantly academics is top notch. If I’m still in Gauteng in 12 years from now my boy will go there. I just love the school. A friend of mine is the St David’s Under15A coach and he reckons PBHS have the players just lack the proper coaching and structures…
@JPS_10 – I had no idea that Boys High had dropped off so significantly in terms of CW contributions.
You are 100% right about the impact these players have. If the school is producing so few CW players, then young up and coming rugby players will think twice before coming to boys high.
Against Bennies, it was very clear. Bennies had a few real game changers in their backline (missed tackles certainly didn’t help). Bennies have brought in quite a few Zimbabwe CW players – they have some real game breakers in T Mujawo, M Manhambo and S Hlanguyo, etc.
@meadows: @McCulleys Workshop: I think what did effect the MH fixture list this year was they usually played 3 games at the Grey PE festival which was not held this year I know in 2014 they played 3 games there which was against Graeme/Queens/Grey PE which gave there fixture list a bit of a external mix to it.
Hopefully that is on again next year and they should be there.
@Grasshopper – I know who you are talking about.
Are you aware that there is another Boys High Old boy in the coaching set up at the Sharks. He was probably the most successful Boys High first team coach before he left for the Bulls and then moved on to the Sharks.
I know that many Boys High parents and teachers will think I am over reacting to the Bennies results. My view is that Boys High have to draw a line somewhere and find a way to improve at rugby. Other sports are in good shape.
I think the approach to rugby has to be different to other sports. In my view school boy rugby is the most professional of the school sports and you can’t ask the Boys High boys (in the A teams) to prepare and play like the B/C/ D/ E teams prepare and play – it is just not fair to them.
I am sure the new director of rugby will address these issues (I certainly hope he does).
There are a few key questions:
1) To Scholarship or not to Scholarship – will scholarships have a positive influence on Boys High rugby without any negative effects on the school.
2) Employ more professional coaches – kicking, defense, scrumming, etc
3) Build a proper gym that matches the rugby culture of the school (Danny Boy has a rugby ball in his one hand).
I can tell you that many PBHS old boys would welcome the former first team coach back to Boys High.
@Tang:
Tang the stats on PBHS’s contribution to the BB Cravenweek 0/18 side tells it all!!
From 2000 to 2009 – 29 Players
From 2010 to 2015 – 2 Players(The 2 players were in 2010)
Boys High needs a serious look at themselves!!!
@Tang: Agreed, I hope someone steps in to sort this. I also thought the Bennies results to be a surprise. The Sharks might need to get rid of a PBHS Old Boy shortly if their results continue to decline. Maybe PBHS should bring him in as a consultant or even Director of Rugby, you know who I’m talking about….
Oakdale is een van die beste spanne in SA. Gim het egter welverdient gewen. Verskeie Oakdale driee was teen die verloop van die spel en Gim het heelwat gebiedsvoordeel gehad (meer as 60% sien http://www.ruggas.co.za). Dit was egter n baie goeie wedstryd en albei spanne het puik vertoon.
Geluk aan Boishaai met puik oorwinning. Ek wonder of Paul Roos nie maar eerder volgende jaar met n groter squad wil speel nie. Hulle sukkel om met 23 teen 15 spelers die Paarlse skole te klop…
@Rugger fan: He injured it playing for the KZN B team in Vryheid if I’m correct. Some advice. He must have professional rehab and develop the other leg at the same time. Too many players recover from the one leg and then injure the other. Your son is a talented player and could have a decent future ahead of him.
@Rugbyman: Noudat die Leeus, Luiperds en Valke streke saamspeel, wat word van die ou Willem Visser Trofee?
@scrummie: ek weet laerskool garsfontein speel teen tygerpoort in die o/13 finaal en sover ek weet is die game vanmiddag 16:20 by hoërskool oos-moot se velde…
@scrummie: Sorry, het nie program nie. Rugbyman kan dalk help. Is dit Garsies teen Tygerpoort?
@CharlesZA: Jammer Charles. Ek praat van ‘n seun wat nog middle vanjaar losskakel daar gespeel het.
@Oakdale supporter: Ek moet sê, dit lyk duidelik baie verdag! Sal graag wil hoor wat die skeidsregter te sê het.
@Cappie: Dis presies die probleem. Die bal is voor die lyn verloor en dit is reg voor die skeidsregter wat die drie toeken.
Die ergste van als is dat niks sal verander nie. Gim het die game gewen en dit sal so bly staan! Ek is egter verbaas dat daar nog nie een Gimmie iets oor die game gesê het nie.
@PaarlBok: Op die fotos lyk dit of die bal nooit oor die doellyn was nie, maar het die nr 6 van Oakdale nie die bal terug geknie na hy oor die doellyn was nie? Die ou wat die drie druk is duidelik oor die doellyn. Die skydsregter is in die perfekte posisie om presies te sien wat gebeur het.
@Tang: Ja, daar sal inderdaad iets by PBH moet gebeur. Hulle het nog steeds 24+ spanne, maar die kwaliteit van rugby is besig om skipbreuk te lei.
@PaarlBok: Dankie!
@Cappie – Thank you. When Boys High win one A team fixture against St Benedicts (no disrespect to Bennies), alarm bells should be ringing at every level.
In my view this is an unmitigated disaster and one which needs immediate corrective action.
On another note. What do Affies get out of a fixture with Boys High (besides the tradition). Boys High struggle to win a single match against Affies.
I think there is a widely held and misguided opinion that results go in cycles. However, I would urge the management of Boys High not to become complacent and just accept this fate. Boys High have heaps of talent but it is not coached from u14 level up to open level. There is no incentive for any budding rugby player to come to Boys High. The last five to six years results have been mediocre at best and they are getting worse not getting better.
If Boys High only want to be an academic and cultural school, then stop arrranging fixtures against schools who take rugby seriously.
@Oakdale supporter: Gim se wendrie.
https://www.facebook.com/#!/BrakkiesSportFotos/posts/934463293266373?pnref=story
@Tang: Sjoe Tang, I share your pain with respect to PBH’s performance over the last few years. I really hope they can adapt and live on. We need a strong PBH. May a solid traditional relation between PBH and Affies not be affected as a result of the newest trend.
@Tang: Yep – knee unfortunately. Initial prognosis is 12 months out. We are off to a 2nd opinion tomorrow.
Praying for a speedy recovery of his ACL/MCL
@Rugger fan – I think it may be easy for college on their home turf.
I may be in Australia for the fixture so I might not be traveling down to PMB.
What happened to your son? Nothing serious I hope.
Hopefully I can delay the trip to Aus and then we can catch up at College. Don’t give me a hard time about the results though. Our tolerance level for losing is very low at the moment.
@ Djou – Het jy miskien die program vir more se laerskole finale ?, sorry ek vat nou n wille raai met hoop dat jy hom sal he
@Tang: Eish Tang – difficult loss. Seems like College will have one easy fixture in the third term them
Shout if you are coming down – unfortunately my son is not able to play the rest of the season – but that cold drink awaits you when you are here.
@beet – Bennies beat Boys 45-36 and not the other way around.
Only two things need to be said:
1) Well Done Bennies.
2) Boys High – adapt or die.
It just feels wrong.
The loquacious headmaster delivers another garrulous homily filled with platitudes about being a school that plays sport and not being a sports school.
The confused boys listen expectantly. Bruised bodies put on the line week after week. Maybe it is just better to play chess, join the Dixie band or the Pipe Band. At least then you don’t have to take responsibility for yet another set back and incur the wrath of the old boys and parents.
When will our headmaster realize that we are playing against teams who are infinitely more prepared than we are? Surely he will take note after this weekends setback. We know we are a “School who plays sport and not a sports school” but then why do we play Westville, Affies, KES, Maritzburg College? Are these schools sports schools? Perhaps they are just the same as we are but have realized that playing school boy rugby in South Africa is becoming more and more professional – they have evolved.
The boys wait. Hopefully today is the day our head, our leader realizes that we also need to evolve. Our environment has changed. We are playing against teams filled with boys on sports bursaries, We are playing against teams coached by professional coaches. To survive in this jungle we had better adapt.
It just feels wrong when week after week Boys High win one A team fixture. It just feels wrong when Boys High fail to adapt to the environment they are in. Adapting is not admitting failure, it is the foundation of evolving and surviving.
@Grootte: Wou se dit klink snaaks want ek weet hy het o15 WP krieket gespeel so kon nie o15 op Garsfontein wees.
@Djou Die losskakel is nie van Garsfontein. Sy pa is oorspronklik van Malmesbury en hy was op Laerskool Eversdal.
@Oakdale supporter: Ek het elders ook verneem die skeidsregter was nie op standaard nie en albei spanne is daarmee van ‘n regverdige wedstryd ontneem.
Ek dink die skeidsregterstelsel behoort te verander waar skole se eerstespanwedstryde nie as proeflopies/geleenthede vir ontwikkeling gebruik moet nie. Die top skeidsregters behoort na my mening deesdae ook die skolewedstryde te hanteer vanwee die groot belangstelling daarin.
Ja, PG se dryfmale is ‘n sterkpunt, maar ek was ook beindruk met hul agterspel.
Sterkte vorentoe, julle het ‘n stywe program wat voorlê.
@BoishaaiPa: Ja, Oakdale na interskole
op Riversdal gaan baie tough wees. Benewens die feite wat jy genoem het
is die manne van Oakdale n bulspan met n puik pak voorspelers.
Wou vroeer se voordat krag afgeskop het. Hoop dat die Paul Roos ouers en
ondersteuners nie te hard op die seuns is nie. Hulle is n uitstekende span
en dit bly n voorreg om teen so n trotse skool te kan meeding. Sterkte
met die res van die seisoen.
@Djou: Jy is heeltemal reg dat ‘n wedstryd 70 minute duur en ek wou nie gister se dit was nie ‘n drie nie, want dit sou na suur druiwe klink. Ek weet nie hoe om die link te plaas nie maar gaan kyk gerus na Brakkies Sport Fotos se Facebook blad. Daar is baie duidelike bewys dat dit nie ‘n drie was nie. Dis hartseer as die beter span van die dag so moet verloor. Een ding wat ek Gim moet krediet voor moet gee, hulle was Oakdale oor as dit kom by die dryfmaal vanaf lynstane. Dit is beslis hul wapen.
@CharlesZA: Hy was in Garsfontein. Jammer die keurders in die Kaap het hom nie kans gegee nie, want ek het lanklaas (op vroee ouderdom – o.14 en o.15) ‘n losskakel gesien wat soveel visie en goeie oordeelvermoe het. Dit is talent wat net met groot moeite aangeleer kan word.
@BoishaaiPa: Ek is nie ‘n negatiewe mens nie, maar wanneer ek ‘n punt uitwys gaan my nie keer nie, maak nie saak hoe afgesaag nie.
Terloops, ek is nie negatief teenoor Kaapse skole nie. Maar ek verdra nie windgatte nie want ek dink dit is ‘n negatiewe eienskap, daarmee is jy reg.
Ek het dieselfde punt al uitgewys teenoor baie bloggers. Wanneer ‘n wendrie gedruk word maak nie saak nie want ‘n wedstryd duur 70 minute, nie 69 minute nie. Hierdie is ‘n klassieke geval in die sielkunde. Mens voeg ietsie by om die pyn sagter te maak. Bv., eintlik het ons die hele wedstryd voorgeloop behalwe vir 1 minuut en dus die grootste deel van die wedstryd gewen. M.a.w. omdat die wendrie eers in die laaste minuut gedruk is, is dit nie so erg vergeleke met indien die wendrie 10m voor die einde gedruk is.
@BoishaaiPa: Ek hoop wedstyde teen HHH en Primrose word replace met games teen Bishops en Rondebosch. Behalwe vir die feit dat dit heeltemal mismatches is, het ons ook nou te veel spanne vir daardie skole en speel die laer spanne in elk geval week in en uit teen Prem A.
@Djou: Geen idee. Weet nie eers wanneer en of hulle onlangs kaap toe getrek het nie. Al wat em weet is dat hy mooi skop en lekker ball player is.
@Oakdale supporter: Na Interskole moet ons nog julle speel…ek sien nie uit na daai trippie nie!…Want ons gaan of op n high wees of op n low en geen span kan so ongebalanseerd Riversdal toe gaan nie!
@CharlesZA: Baie geluk met julle goeie wen…Boland is nie speletjies nie. Julle verdien n kans om n slag meer gereeld teen die Premier A skole te speel. Julle resultate regdeur die ouderdoms groepe regverdig dit. Julle is besig om dinge reg te doen en dit is altyd goed vir skolerugby.
@Djou: Net soos n wendrie maak dit ook nie regtig saak nie…Jou negatiewe sentiment jeens Kaapse skole raak redelik afgesaag.
@LAEVELDER: Ekskuus, het vergeet – jy glo nie om vele goed in results te lees nie, maar wel wat op die telbord staan. Nou wat is die verskil tussen die result en wat op die telbord staan?
@Oakdale supporter: ‘n Wedstryd duur mos 70 minute – dit maak mos nie saak of die wendrie in die eerste of laaste minuut gedruk is nie.
@CharlesZA: Waar was die losskakel op skool voor sy ouers getrek het Kaap toe?
@LAEVELDER: Sjoe, wat ‘n redenasie. So die Bulle is nou swakker omdat hul eerste keuse spelers wat of beseer of nie beskikbaar was vir die wedstryd nie nou wel in die span is – dit is waarop jou redenasie neerkom.
Maar geluk, die Pumas het gewen. Hoop jy is nou tevrede. Kan nie glo ‘n mens kan so aangaan nie.
Geluk aan Paarl Gim met julle wen vandag. Oakdale was baie ongelukkig om nie te wen maar dit was naby. 31-28 met Gim wat wendrie in laaste minuut druk.
Was bevoreg om langs die veld te staan en te sien hoe Stellenberg vir Landbou 21-17 wen. Span het regtig goed gespeel en die loskakel moet man of match wees met die wen drie wat hy gemaak het.
Onder 14 en 16 spanne ook gewen. Seker die beste dag se rugby vir ons skool
in n baie lang tyd of dalk ooit.
@Kempie Pa: sjoe… was seker spannend…
Kempies 22 – 22 Monnas.
@Vleis: The Wellington game was pretty tight on the scoreboard at the end, 24-21, but I think that they scored at the death to close the gap. They were a big, well drilled, side.
Here is a youtube link to the highlights of that game if you are interested. Lions players Ruan Combrinck (2) and Robbie de Bruyn (1) scored tries and Pat Lambie kicked everything. 2m Kings lock Cameron Lindsay dominated the lineouts.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bRGOrZrxLFw
Now this is an awesome story; http://www.glenwoodhighschool.co.za/old-boy-news-6
@meadows: I’m just stirring the pot boet, the blog was getting boring…
@Grasshopper: I am sure that if it were put to the boys they would prefer the system of a few years back where rugby continued in the 3rd term. The decision to change that was not one that I agreed with. That would have resulted in about 4 additional games.
The reality is that the school does not give a continental about either claiming a “big” scalp or aiming and, by implication, planning for an unbeaten season. The fact is that the last one was in 1910!
They simply do not have the depth to play annual inter-schools fixtures against the likes of Affies, Grey or Paul Roos. in good years they would be competitive in some of the A team games but I am sure that it would get messy from there on down as it tends to against the big government schools in Natal.
The only opportunity that they have to claim a “big’ scalp is the Easter festivals and to my knowledge they have never ducked anyone they have been asked to play at those tournaments. I can recall a MHS beating Affies at St Johns in around 2004 and then being well beaten by Paul Roos in their next game. Similarly, the U16’s have regularly attended the excellent Paarl Gym tournament where they have played the likes of the hosts, Paarl Boys and Grey College.
it is a pity that the Saints fixture list this year did provide a stiffer test but i suspect that the organisers thought that Helpmekaar would do that. Commentators on this site predicted a loss for House in that game and not the 50pt win that resulted. Incidentally the same Helpmekaar that claimed one of your “big” scalps, Waterkloof, a few weeks back.
@Djou:
Glo ook nie om vele goed te lees in results nie, kom ons lees maar net wat op die telbord gestaan het toe die eindfluitjie geblaas het.. die span met die meeste punte is die wenner en hoef nie n “claim” in te sit nie. Maar as dit jou sal laat beter voel kan ons maak of die game nooit plaas gevind het nie…
Onthou ook om 6 spelers te vervang in n span beteken nie altyd die span is nou sterker nie. Sterkte vir julle met Bondedag en Cravenweek! Hou die Noorde se naam hoog (veral teen WP)!!
Personally I would take a huge scalp like Affies, Monnas, Waterkloof, Paul Roos, Boishaai, Paarl Gim, Grey Bloem etc overran unbeaten season any day. Glenwood have a few of these over the past 5 years..
12 games over 4 to 5months is taking it easy to the max. Tons of prep & recovery time. 15 to 20 is average these days. Some play 25! For me about 18 is spot on, avg 1 per week. But if having an unbeaten season is important, best to give your team the best chance to achieve that.
@McCulleys Workshop: Yes, St John’s is out of town, but you only travel there every second year. [To be honest, you don’t need to be an actuary to work that out] Many schools (most even) have one guaranteed away fixture per annum for all the winter teams, or at least the A teams.
I don’t know of any school in the country that has only 12 games per annum, apart from MHS, but if that (or 12.5) floats your boat then no worries. Given how defensively you react whenever said topic is raised, I suspect that your boat has a few cracks.
No, I’m not an actuary…that’s far to racy and exciting for the likes of me.
@meadows: Last year was also very close at Grey against their ‘dream team’. Are you able to post the results of the 2008 season? I sincerely hope that you thumped Wellington.
I think that I watched the MHS v Hilton game at MHS in 2008….but in those days, I had no clue which school was good/great/etc. I stayed at a mate who lives close to the school and went down for the party, more than the rugby.
@Vleis: Thanks Vleis, I will pass on your well conceived ideas. Are you an actuary? I think St Johns is an out of town side, unless we have been playing the girls side down the road for the last 10 years! I personally think they should have played 12.5 games, that would have added spice to it all, and certainly aimed for better sides than College or Glenwood.
@Vleis: I agree that 12 is too few. I much preferred when rugby was played in the 3rd term.
By way of example the 2008 side played 19 games, 4 of which took place in the 3rd term – including Westville, Hilton and the touring Wellington College side that had just won the Daily Mail Cup at Twickenham. 3 games at the Grey festival including Grey and Middelburg and 3 in Vryheid including a great game against the Harmony Academy. That doesn’t include games played by a MHS XV (comprised of a few 1st Xv, 2nd and U16’s) that played at that years ISRF which clashed with the provincial weeks.
It was a pity that they didn’t play Grey at Saints. I think that Helpmekaar were expected to be tougher opposition than it turned out but perhaps that is a reflection of how good this side is given Helpies win over Waterkloof.
There have been some great games against Grey over the years – 2007 at KES and 2008 at Grey as well as at Grey again in 2012. The ’08 side’s only loss in 19 matches was to Grey in PE.
@meadows: I think that House’s fixture list is largely fine, but 12 is too little. They should add two more fixtures – one local one and one further out of town fixture. That way, they have one out of town fixture per annum. Unfortunately, they didn’t play Grey PE at Saints this year – to be honest, Saints made a proper mess of the final day fixtures.
@Vleis: I guess that it’s the nature of rugby in a 500+ boy private school. 2013 was possibly the weakest MHS side that I can recall, preceded by a good side in 2012, and followed by a decent side last year and another very good side this year. I suspect that next year will not be very strong. Lack of depth, even in good years, is a perpetual problem.
What is pleasing is that the coaching set up does seem to develop players over their time at the school if one looks at the improvement against many opponents from U14 through to the open age group. it is also a good reason for sticking to your traditional fixture list (including the St johns inter-schools) supplemented by attendance at one of the Easter festivals and/or the occasional tour rather than trying to develop an inter-provincial program against bigger opponents.
@meadows: Thanks – that’s interesting. I didn’t realise that Hilton’s biggest win was in 2013.
One of my son’s friends moved from House to St Alban’s in grade 11. He was unhappy to leave House, but that changed by the time his was in matric (2013) as House lost to Hilton twice (including said largest ever loss) but his new team beat Hilton that year.
@star: @meadows: I seem to remember a 4 year winning streak which would have been more than 6 games, although there may have been a few draws. That ended in 83.
@LAEVELDER: Nege van die 15 spelers teen Pumas het Cravenweekspan gehaal.
Dink nie daar kan enigiets in die oefenwedstryd gelees word nie, hoewel jy graag ‘n oorwinning wil “claim”. Punt is, dit was nie die werklike spanne wat kragte gemeet het nie.
Teen KZN was dit anders want dit was die werklike spanne wat gespeel het.
@Kempie Pa: Ek is nie so seker oor die gesukkel nie..so elke nou en dan sal jy n afjaar he..oor die algemeen gesien doen WP spanne altyd goed by die verskillende weke..Ek dink nie hulle sukkel nie as mens na die stats kyk nie….Regdeur die ouderdomsgroepe van 0/13 tot 0/18 speel en wen hulle gereeld die verskeie weke…Ek dink nie daar is n provinsie wat dieslfde record het as dit by al die versklilende weke kom nie..Van die 44 “finals” wat sedert 1971 gespeel is het WP in 21 daarvan gespeel..net mooi amper1 elke 2de jaar…Die naaste span aan hulle is OVS met 16 verskyings met Grey as hulle hoofbron van spelers..Klink nie vir my of WP te veel sukkel nie of hoe?
@BoishaaiPa:
Ek het meer na laas jaar se vertonings verwys as die glipsie laas week deur WP. Dit is net vreemd dat WP met soveel talent tot hulle beskikking so sukkel. Al die provinsies het dieselfde probleem om van skole oor te skakel na CW toe.
@star: Can’t confirm that 7 is correct but I got that from the school newsletter so I assumed that they had consulted the archive
According to the same source one of the fixtures in ’84 did not take place due to flu so that may have an impact on your calculation. Similarly one fixture was abandoned in 2010 due to thunderstorms which would have affected the 2007 – 2010 MHS streak.
@meadows: We have had plenty of family discussions on the length of the winning streak. I remember my younger brother playing in a Hilton team that stopped such a streak in 1985.( Although that would mean that Teichie would have lost in the games he played.) If I count back to when I played in 1982 then that is a minimum of 6 games. I am also pretty sure that I came in in the midst of a loosing streak so that 7 games does not seem right.
@ Red,Black White- I suppose you can’t give the game that your son is reffing on Saturday. I would not mind a gander.
@meadows: Thanks
Hilton’s win against Kearsney and the MHS victory against College on Goldstones has set this weekend’s 194th game between the old rivals up nicely.
The fixture was first played in 1904 and to date MHS have won 97, Hilton 86 and there have been 10 draws. Scoreline’s have generally been close over the years with a total points difference of 181pts in MHS’s favour over the 193 games. House’s biggest win was 51-0 in 1910 (not sure what that would translate into with 5pt tries) and Hilton’s was 42-12 in 2013. In modern times House won 40-0 and 44-17 in 2007. The longest winning streak for either school has been 7 games.
@pietretief:
Ja die Puma span lyk ook nie meer dieselfde as toe nie, eerlik dink ek ons sal hul hierdie keer nog verder wen. Maar kom ons wag maar.. sal maar moet sien hoe sterk is hul regtig wanneer hul teen Monnas speel op Bondedag!
Surely that must be Selborne thirds or at a push the seconds against Westbank.QC86?
@LAEVELDER: ek dink die BB span wat in Middelburg gespeel het en die een wat craven week toe gaan is redelik 2 verskillende spanne. Ek dink ongelukkig is moontlik die grootste wedstryd die jaar reeds op die eerste dag tussen WP en die BB.
@Die Ken:
Glo ook nie dis n upset nie (die Pumas het die Bulle ook getem).. die Pumas het nie n lekker CW verlede jaar gehad nie (nogal in Middelburg) maar in 2013 CW vir die Cheetahs en KZN gewen en goed opgeweeg teen WP al het hul die game verloor
@RUGBYMAD: ek het so gesien, maar dis nie ‘n upset nie, is dit!?
@Die Ken: DIE PUMAS HET VIR KZN OOK GEWEN IN N OEFEN WEDSTRYD MAANDAG.
Lyk na n paar epic games die naweek:
Gimmies met 11
Roos met 4
Monnas met 13
Hilton by 1
College by 4
@Oakdale supporter: dis lekker as enige span, WP of Die Bulle wen!!!!!
@PaarlBok: @BoishaaiPa: ek sien vreeslik baie uit na Saterdag
@Kempie Pa: Ek stem heeltemal met Die Ken en BoishaaiPa saam, maar dis darem tog lekker as SWD vir WP wen. Maak nie saak of dit ‘n oefenwedstryd was nie.
@BoishaaiPa: Is julle reg vir die MMM?
@Kempie Pa: Ek dink jy moet eerder maar weer besin oor daardie stelling. Jy kan absoluut geen korrelasie tref tussen CW en Skole spanne van die WP nie. Daar is hoegenaamd nie dieselfde span dinamika of opset nie. Sukkel teen SWD?..Om met n punt te verloor in n oefenwedstryd sal ek ook nou nie juis sukkel noem nie!..Die SWD bestaan uit spelers van 2 skole wat gereeld saam speel..WP uit 6 of 7 verskillende skole..Ek wonder of St Johns/St Stithians/KES en Kearsney toernooie en Wildeklawer in die Kaap gespeel word, want dan mis ek hulle gereeld lyk dit my!…Die Paasfees toernooie is almal behalwe Kearsney in JHB en sover my kennis strek is dit in die Noordvaal!.Ons dring op niks aan nie..Die resultate is daar om te lees!…Ongelukkig het jy geen punt wat ondersteun kan word nie.
@Kempie Pa: As n ou Transvaler, moet ek se ek stem nie saam met jou nie. Die Kaapse spanne speel vanjaar beter rugby as daarbo en dit reflekteer reg in die rankings. Sekere politiek met die kies van CW spanne, die spel vd WP span teen SWD op daai dag, die feit dat SWD se manne almal amper elke naweek saamspeel, en nog ander elemente het ‘n gelei tot daardie telling. Moenie jouself laat fool deur een telling nie. Die Wynland 4 het 4 moerse 0/19A spanne vanjaar. Ek dink nie met minder wedstryde, later die seisoen, sou AHS, EGJ of Monnas beter gedoen het nie.
Dit is nogal vreemd as julle Kapenaars daarop aandring dat julle die beste skole rugby spanne het, gewoonlik 3 uit Top 5. Laas jaar het julle nie so goed gedoen op die Craven week soos die ranking aandui nie. Hier sukkel julle al weer teen SWD wat net 2 spanne in die Top 20 het.
Ek dink dit ondersteun my punt dat julle te veel lees in die voor seisoen wedstryde waar Noord Vaal spanne tipies 5 wedstryde (weg van die huis af) in 9 dae speel.
Gaan ons n aparte een kry vir die Brugstraat Battle?