With the 2012 Kwazulu-Natal season done and dusted, it would be nice to get a feel for the players coming through from the under-15 ranks that are likely to represent their respective schools at under-16A level in 2013. Obviously it’s too far off to expect accuracy at this stage, so the aim is really just to obtain a list of contenders for starting berths and if possible get from contributors an idea of who they feel the standout performers were during this 2012 under-15 season.
Please post a comment below or email : beetb@telkomsa.net. Thank you.
Hey guys I’m new to this.
I have a guy in mind Queensburgh high school prop very strong and not affraid to take on big guys.
I believe he has all the potential to make the kzn squad.watch out for him his name is Sisa Sibiya
@RUGBYMAD:
Its further up on this blog. Pedantic posted his list
@nwood:
Yah had forgotten about Sibisi. He didnt have the best of games against DHS last year but i think he gre a lot as a rugby player and played well when i saw him this year.
Yip most definitely a good candidate.
@all
Its really sad when a rugby player leaves a school to go elsewhere and ends up not playing A team there. Happened to one boy whos at Glenwood now and i think hes really lost out.
Plays U15
@ Star : I also thought they were leaving but since they got rejected, its unfortunate but I think its also good. I rate both of them highly. Also what do you think of their hooker. Mthabela. @ NW Knight : I have to agree that your flyhalf is good, I think they call him Ento. He won the game for NW last year, but I think this year we kind of contained except for the 2 breaks, 1 where there was no pillar post, the other where he got tackled trying to step our wing D.Graham( good tackler and attacker). But otherwise a good candidate, excellent attack and good game.
@ Greenblooded- if the applications were turned down at NW then I think the reason for leaving could be linked. It is a shame though that potential rugby players could fall through the net.The union must look to put structures in place to prevent this possible loss to the system.
@Star: Most certainly not coming to NW – applications were turned down.
@star: Leaving Westville for Northwood? For what reason?
@ Griffon- S.Bell certainly has the size and speed. From a skills/positional perspective still needs to find his space.I thought Sabela and Mnguni were leaving Westville for NW. Has that now changed?
@nwood- If Sibisi played flyhalf against Westville for the last 2 years then he certainly is not a forgotten player. He broke the game open last year with one of the most wicked sidesteps I have ever seen.
One forgotten player would be N.Sibisi from Northwood played u13 KZN in Grades 6 nd 7 he also made da u16 North Durban side this year while at u15 plays in Flyhalf nd Centre nd Wing was actually being hounded by Westville this year
Just want to add 3 more Westville boys although some may not agree. S.Bell who played A and B at flank or eightman, very good runner with ball, and pretty big. He plays a Kankowski kind of game. The other 2 are W.Sabela played flank this year, in my opinion good ball carrier even though he’s not that big, got a good step(played wing for u13B KZN team), hard tackler on defence. The other S.Mnguni, played flyhalf this year for A and B, good distributing, goal kickings improved, good step and tactical kicking.
@yvette havenga: Interestingly enough … Havenga & Thusi were both on the extended list I sent to Beet
Thusi as a 6 though.
Thanks for clarification on Vorster .. must have mixed him up with Martin Vorster who I think has faded out of rugby for now.
@Pedantic: Andre Vorster is from Port Natal, not George Campbell.
Would like to add my son Rudi Havenga as hooker. Also played DRSU u15 IPT tournament for the last 3 years. Also Quincy Thusi as 8th man. He is quick on his feet and has also played DRSU IPT for the last 2 years. Both from George Campbell.
@CyndiAtRugby: I would love to see this list! Where can I go to view?
@Griffon: I think Smit is a loosie – doesn’t really jump so not effective at lock. His kicking is so impressive it’s hard to relieve him of that duty – he also works very hard on it, on tour he spent at least an hour a day on kicking practise alone.
Stoltz is interesting … grown a lot since last year and still looks a bit immature physically which would suggest he still has a lot of growing to come, certainly a player to watch out for. At IPT he was second choice tighthead but made a difference everytime he came onto the field with an excellent work rate – nice player with a great attitude.
@ Pedantic : I agree that Kevin Smit is a good player, but where would you play him. Lock or Loose froward, and I also think the Westville coaches should relieve him of goalkicking although he’s a good kicker. Do you know how S.Stolz played at the tournament
@ Pedantic : I agree that Kevin Smit is a good player, but where would you play him. Lock or Loose froward, and I also think the Westville coaches should relieve him of goalkicking although he’s a good kicker.
@CyndiAtRugby: The interesting thing is that all the boys in that original list that DO play club rugby were selected for the DRSU team … Dixon withdrew due to cricket trials and Nicholson was not available for the tour, else they would have been in the squad.
There were some standout players at the IPT but one wonders if their schools will give them the chances they deserve? For example, guys like Hosken, Wheeler & Gilbey who are not regular A team players at school – this is where club rugby comes into it’s own … fringe players are not labeled as such and are given chances on merit, most of the time they end up proving their critics wrong.
One name you can certainly add to that list of players to watch is Kevin Smit from Westville – nice balance of natural ability and dedication should see him develop well over the next few years.
@Pedantic:
I have to wonder whether this list would change post DRSU IPT? Obviously all the boys do not play club rugby, however, after looking at the Craven week team, DRSU is a good indication of talent.
@NW_Knight: Would be interesting to see them try and tell the two Trevors what to do, given that they are the two most vocal.
I agree – there needs to be a distinct and published set of rules. Then everyone is clear and no statements will be necessary when one school refuses to play another – of course the situation should never arise, but …
They should have. they have a seat on the DRSU an KZN High Schools sit on the KZNRU. Why have this if you have no authority?
@NW_Knight: Does the High Schools Committee have the authority to dictate to schools who they can recruit and who they can field in their teams?
I think that agreements between headmasters are a lot of rubbish. Why have a KZN High Schools committee that does nothing more than organize the fixture list and convene trials. They are the ones that should police the schools.
@Grasshopper: That they must not have failed a year is my opinion, not sure it is actually in the agreement.
Westville did not use the same investigator as the rest of the schools. They used their own PI who cleared their boys. Apparently the story with Buthulezi was that he was partly brought up by grandparents who registerd his birth 3 years differently to his parents. The Westville PI accepted the younger version of birth as the truth.
Ahh, it’s over for last year. No remarks column, the games with the overage kids (8 of them by all reports, some even said double that!!) are history and there is no remarks column. Get it right this year – but Beet is actually right. It calls for a centralisation and agreement of the process to check ages and agree the rules. No schools being allowed to mark their own homework and publish the results without the process being available for scrutiny.
And just so that it is out there, there is already lots of talk about over-age kids in the lower age groups, so watch that space (U16 next year) because it is not just the open age group.
@Gungets, then I wonder how Buthelezi at Westville got past the agreement. Also, about 3 boys at DHS whe were Under19 failed a year too.
@beet: Agree completely about the shadow. The commitment is there from College, the way they are screening their U14’s is as good as it gets. Sophisticated fraud, such as not registering your child for 3 years is always going to be an issue but anything suspicious or not verifyable will be turned away. Not sure how public it is going to be (as in formal statements etc) but it will be a formal part of admission procedure – as public as it needs to be???
On the Heradmasters agreement – the kid, if over 18, needs to have never failed a year at school either, or the kids wanting to make a name for themselves need only be dof?
@star: Hey, HEY, HEY!!! .. Easy does it cuz. :-) My son did not even play that day due to some steroid crazed behemoth kicking him in the head the week before. Spare a thought for the girl-child, rugby orphan that she is!!
@Star, no need to keep the peace, most of my mates are Westville Old Boys and I am used to the jibes and banter. In fact, I lived in Westville whilst at Glenwood and would always get abuse walking in the area in my Glenwood uniform. I would never make that sort of feeble excuse, I promise. Maybe a meet up for the KES vs Westville game at Westville in 2013, I hope Westville revenge this years loss…….it would be sweet for me…
@ Grassy- Not a problem. Just remember I have expensive drinking habits. We might need Beet to keep the peace though. We could invite Gungets but the last time I invited him for a drink was at the Westville/College game and he made some feeble excuse that he had to watch his daughter play hockey. Poor does not begin to descibe it.
@Grasshopper: Everything is subjective, just like the Headmaster’s agreement. I understood it to be about u19s. It was decided to get rid of post-matric players and that KZN rugby should only be for u18s but bona fide u19s could play.
So u18s don’t ever figure into this equation. Guys like Potgieter, van Aardt, Wright, Smith – all u18s.
As a result, u19s like Worral-Clare, Rencken, Ngidi are all fine to play as they are not post matrics and have been at their schools all along.
However if say Cameron Wright schooled at Westville this year and moved to Hilton in 2013, there would be a problem as Hilton, MHS and WBHS see the agreement. Partly to do with him being u19 and no longer fitting their description of a bona fide student who is just completing his studies. He now fits a definition of a rugby recruit.
But I can see your difficulty with it. In a case like Wright, its just 6 months difference to Marne’s case really??? Its tricky.
@Gungets Tuft: I want that school shadow to hang there until we have a public commitment from all schools to clean the system up not just now but forever going forward. Potential perpetrators must realise that KZN is not the place to try this stunt again.
There needs to be a minimum standard to follow and I also think there needs to be punishment for schools and/or officials who are negligent in meeting that standard.
@Beet and Star, I agree with you both. I work in auditing and Industry standards so am used to mediating between different parties and coming to an agreement. Surely ALL the Headmasters can meet in a board style meeting and sign an agreement and then PR it. That way the schools have a ‘constitution’ and set of rules that ALL must abide by. I mean what is the difference between the Marne movement and the Calvin Smith & Cameron Wright movement, just 1 year! Hilton refuse to play against Marne but have a Glenwood Old Boy in their ranks……double standards I say. I think movement in grade 8 & 9 is fine, but after that it looks like recruitment. Star, happy to meet in December when I’m back in SA, maybe Waxies and drinks on me……I probably know you anyway….
@beet: Don’t know what the other schools are going to do but the last I heard was that every Collehe Gr7 would have their age verified immediately. That then follows them for their school career. College are not that big in the recruitment field after Gr7 so the few that arrive will be easy to deal with. There has to be a will to do it though. I know this, there will be no mercy shown a school that plays over-age kids from now on. There was almost certainly more to it than met the eye this year, certainly more than the 2 that publicly got outed, but if it happens again – no excuses.
Personally looking forward to that shadow moving on from school rugby
@ Beet- You are 100% correct that Hilton and MHS could really abuse the placement process. I am a one year oldboy of Hilton and the return on investment is pretty good. They would have no problem in attracting potential candidates and both parties would prosper accordingly. The loser would be the traditional rugby rivalry and competition.
With regard to friction between the schools it seems that there is a lack of trust between the management of the various schools. That is why sticking to an agreement is so important as that is the only way you can get to close the gap. At the moment everyone seems to be doing their own thing and there is no higher level co-ordination or political will.
@star: What worries me about these issues like an u19 being recruited for rugby purposes and the over aged audit, is where’s the follow thru. Now that the schools have been thru these difficult processes, why not formalise the headmaster’s agreement and have a proper procedure drawn up for testing kids ages from Gr.7 or so onwards.
It seems like there is so much friction between the schools that it results in breakdowns in communication, lots of moaning behind closed doors and a willingness to rather sweep matters under the carpet than tackle them head on and/or resolve them for good.
@ Greenhopper- You state that there is no agreement. Then why did Kershaw not come out with a simple statement to that effect and be done with it. That would quickly restore the credibility of GW, put those dastardly Westville people in their place and more importantly protect the innocent in this mess that was Marne.A simple question indeed that warrants a simple answer. With regard to Westville knowing for months surely GW were also aware of a potential problem and would it not be for the potential transgressor to obtain some sort of clearance. Brinkmanship requires 2 parties and to conjecture that one party is a fault is pure folly. I am sure we will all meet up one day and have a good laugh but at this stage it is best to keep our heads down and follow through in the interests of the boys and the sport they love.
It’s interesting where this whole Marne not allowed to play episode will take KZN rugby.
My feeling is the Bulls CW win was built around the union’s hands on involvement in recruitment. They brought the boys in from the Boland, Limpopo, E/Rand and found places for them in Garsies, Centurion, wherever. Of these many have contracts with the Bulls for 2013.
At some point the Sharks look at that Bulls situation and do nothing. No jokes, they see the benefits. But where do they place these kids, if they recruit them. Surely after this year no KZN school will want those sort of headaches now.
Its also probably a good thing that Hilton and MHS opposed Marne playing. There were no 2 better schools to take advantage of the opportunity to bring in u19 matrics for just 1 year of study to bolster their 1st teams. Not saying they would have gone that route but HC and MHS have a good connection to Gauteng as it is + the chance for a boy to get subsidised schooling and then be able to call himself a old HC or MHS for life thereafter. Big attractions.
The way the Marne issue unfolded was interesting and invoked mixed feelings. But we still have to find out what the long term effect are.
@Greenhopper, I agree with you about imports in general. I don’t like them either and it should be stopped or regulated. So a kid needs to meet the following criteria to play 1st team;
1) Under 19
2) Never failed a year, or if failed can only play club rugby
3) Has been at the school and registered for at least 3 years
4) Must be at the school for academic reasons (registered at schools and studying a full subject package)
5) No home schooled kids allowed
Simple!!
A Glenwood boy must have earned the right of passage and learnt the schools ethos, morals and tradition. A boy playing in a green jersey must have earned it!
@Greenhopper: Teacher??? .. How did I give that impression. Nothing further from the truth – education and I are not friends, hence me driving tow-trucks…
@Grasshopper: it was the “timing” by Westville that disengenious more than the “agreement” Westville knew months before of Marne and it was a case of disrupting the team to gain advantage
@star:i don’t think Hall actually noted “an agreement” in his public comments, leads one to believe maybe he was positioning himself and not the “agreement” and insinuating that “an agreement” existed when it might actually not, rumor mill has it that there is no such agreement , and a very very senior coach at Glenwood and Master noted to me personally that no such agreement exists , so they could comment as it didn’t exist
and till one is produced and released we can all consider that one doesn’t actually exist, the only school making noise about it was Westville, no other school came out in support or admission of such agreement, makes you think
@star: well i know of an u16 a GW boy that played on the Saturday and was at Hilton BE on the Sunday
@Grasshopper: we have been through this, whilst i support your facts , i CANT support the fact that we had , have and will have imports playing at the School, it lessens the worth of the Jersey , these boys move down and “use” the school for their needs and what about the boys that started as “new boys” and have done their bit for the school, sorry a bit of a slap in the face, IF the boy had moved down because Dad had been transferred then I support the cause , but when boys actively move because they want to further their own ambitions then what are we saying ? and then to say they are only boys , sorry thy are professional and should be judged as such,
to TOP it all , he wasn’t that good any way , and I think the schools after seeing him play , weren’t to worried, I think the writing was pretty much on the wall last year when he was only viewed as 8th or so choice Player in his position , I read this on a blog some where
@Gungets Tuft: something tells me your are ateacher lol
@star: what was or would think was “right”
@CyndiAtRugby: would be interesting to see which GW 1st team players have played Club or even A team players over the Last few years as Sean and the School are very against this
@Star, until the ‘headmasters agreement’ is published for all to see then all of these ‘standards/rules/spirit’ is hearsay. We are all guessing that it was agreed that no player could represent a school if not there for a year. Westville decided to disrupt Glenwood and take their early season opportunity to win at home. The records will state a home win for Westville, but it’d sad that a good school like Westville has to resort to disruption tactics and spin to get a win. The loss of Marne on the day was not just a physical abscence but a severe disruption to the team mentally because of the underhandedness of the situation. Trevor Hall could have dissipated the whole ugly scenario if he had contacted Trevor Kershaw earlier in the year and said we are not willing to play against Marne because it’s against the ‘agreement’ and Kershaw would then have had time to plan around this and communicate it properly to the school and parents. Again you avoid the fact that Westville themselves had imported players, maybe brought in earlier but still imports. Also, Westville played with a kid who had failed a year and Under 19. In my eyes that kid should not be playing and should play club rugby. This should also go into the ‘agreement’….
@ Gungets-The quality reference was a bit tongue in cheek as I am an old boy of 2 of the schools and have a strong interest in the other. Apologies for my misdirected attempt at humor. I do think that certain schools/old boys did take a certain position later on. Have you read Trevors Hall’s position which was put on the public domain? To date Kershaw(and no other principal has done the same) and so everything said by most people is at best heresay.Grassy comments on Kershaw’s position. Surely it is up to him to come forward and take a courageous stand. Until he does yes Westville do have the moral high ground. This is really no longer up for debate. To talk about age is disengenious as that was not the issue at all , as Westville and other schools had U 19 players. There is the spirit and letter of the agreement and Westville looked to the spirit and was the only school open about it.
@ AB- I just responded to a comment by Grassy who implied that Westville manipualted a situation and corrected him that MHS had also taken the same position. I am not sure how that equates to bad taste. You refer to MHS bringing players in. My brother was probably the first in 1979 However there again was a lot of heresay and I don’t believe any agreement in place. I will say that I am quite perturbed by Hilton’s current policy re the buying of players. I believe last year there was a boy in full Westville uniform seen at Hilton. The response was emphatic that any underhanded dealings will not be tolerated. You see it is not just about Marne. Basic principles have to be set in place or there will be anarchy.
Star: Your post re Marne Coetzee is perhaps in bad taste? MHS, the school you call quality, started all of this many years ago and even went as far as bringing in Grey Bloem players for a post matric year. To say Westville and MHS are quality because they refused to play a boy who was younger than some of the players in the Westville side is strange. I see problems next year as well as we know how old certain players are and also because they were stolen by Westville from College in U16. Check the cleanliness of the schools you call quality.
@Star, Marne was younger than a couple of Westville boys, so what is the difference? He had been at Glenwood since the middle of 2011 for genuine family movement. The key reason he moved was because the Beeld Trophy that Waterkloof plays in does not allow Under19 participation, so he would not have been able to play for most of their season. His family is originally from KZN so decided to move to Durban and move Marne. It just so happens to be he played SA Schools in 2011 and that the Sharks Academy might have gained from the movement. Do you see him playing Sharks Under19 now, so I don’t believe there were any contracts, maybe some verbal agreements. Anyway, Marne had not failed and is genuinely in matric due to being kept back a year as a kid for development reasons. I think he had a small disability. That said, I believe the headmasters agreement says Under19’s can play but must be agreed before the game if so. I don’t think there is any clause about how long the kid had to be at the school. Westville decided to cause trouble and not agree to Marne playing the day before the game, this is the issue Glenwood supporters had. Why wait until the last minute when they knew all along he was at Glenwood and would play. Trevor Hall was just trying to get one over Trevor Kershaw. Trevor Kershaw reluctantly agreed as he wanted the full set of fixtures to take place. What give Westville the right to hold another headmaster and school to ransom? Glenwood could easily have said we won’t play against Under19’s who have failed a year, so Buthelezi would not have been able to play. Glenwood did the right thing playing Marne as he was a fully eligible Under19 player who had been at the school long enough to warrant inclusion. It was not like he was there a week……..that would be a different story. Anyway, Westville spun the situation to make them look all high and mighty, without looking at their own team. I see Westville are sweeping a very overaged kids under the carpet to escape public vilification like Glenwood got with Tom. It seems Glenwood is the scapegoat here…
Beet has set up the SuperBru comp – check out his posting on the front page of the Blog. Lets see just how good we all are.
Remember, when it comes to prediction, my sole purpose in the competition is to make everyone else look above average!!
@star: That’s a little disengenious boet – the assumption that the schools that did decide to allow Marne to play are .. 1) not quality schools and .. 2) opportunistic … 3) not courageous enough to take a stance
I spoke to Tony Jordan at College the same week that Westville refused to play and even then the Northwood stance was that he was not over-age, had not failed a year and that his family had moved, so they would not refuse. In fact his comment was “we have boys older than him, so what’s the difference”
College was involved in the very early meeting that the headmasters had about the issue and agreement was reached back then.
It was a nice little dig though, not going to work, most of the visitors to this site are able to decide on opportunism and courage for themselves.
@ Grassy- You will find that MHS also did not play against Marne as these are the quality schools in KZN that are prepared to man up and stick to an agreement( they were also GWs early opponents and so did not have the oportunity to see what would happen and so take an opportunistic position later on.) In hindsight I think that GW would have been better off if that had done what was right upfront.
@Greenhopper:
Many of the 1st team boys have played club rugby for years and A team guys still play Club rugby or at least practice with them as soon as the school season is finished. I’m looking more at the cumulative effect over a period of years. Speaking to one of the GW 1st team Dads – he said that his son had not had more than a 2 week break over the past 4 years of school. He had played more games than the average Sharks player. Needless to say, he missed a few key games due to injury.
I have heard that UCT who are doing a study on this, but haven’t been able to get details.
@NW_Knight: Ok, all good, just your statement “It doesn’t matter now anyway, as the agreements been broken.” worried me. I think it is a good agreement and that all the heads should stick to it, unless it is definitely proved that there were good reasons for the move, like families being transferred etc. Of course the family’s movements after the boy leaves matric will be interesting.
Of course every time we put an “unless/if” next to the agreement we weaken it’s resolve …
@Gungets: No, I was merely stating what the agreement was and the fact that GW disregarded it. Nothing to do with NW – as I remember, NW agreed to play with Marne in the side.
@Horsey: Time will tell
@pedantic
Was referring to this years u16s who had 5 KZN players when they were u15. In P.H, T.S,T.V,J.R and J.H.
I don’t think KZN U13 players are all going to make good rugga players but do think that they are the ones who play the best rugga at U14 and U15 level.
@greenhopper
Its absurd to think NW and DHS will have it right by next. Year but realistically DHS will do so when it turns 150 in 2016.
NW_Knight, Marne joined Glenwood in grade 11 around June/July 2011. I was not aware of any headmaster rule stating it had to be a year for boys joining, sounds made up to me to fit with Westville’s argument. I see only Westville and Hilton did not agree to play with Marne in the side, the rest were man enough to accept he was eligible to play because he was Under19…
@NW_Knight: Are you saying that Northwood no longer regards the Headmasters Agreement as binding?
Can’t speak on behalf of schools but my guess is it would go down like a lead balloon if any school started a wholesale import of players. I see that you said that other schools have a lot more money than Northwood, yet my sources tell me the opposite, that there is a nice little cash pile waiting to be dropped under the right circumstances. These right circumstances might have occurred
@Greenhopper: “money spent wisely” means just that – very little money and making sure you pick wisely and across age groups. Every school in the top 8 gives scholarships, some jut have a lot more money. As far as the “Gr10 story”, the agreement (which GW disregarded) was that a boy who is U19 had to have been at the school the previous year ie. you cannot bring an U19 from another province in to play rugby for your school. No one is saying that is the case with NW (but I’m sure rumors abound). It doesn’t matter now anyway, as the agreements been broken.
But maybe you’re right. NW vs GW might not be a strength on strength affair – we should stagger ad let our 2nd’s play your 1st’s.
@All Black: So you obviously went against the Lions … SARU just went against them too – Lions out of Super Rugby in 2013 – Kings are in!
@Gungets Tuft: Good idea. Last week, for the 1st time ever, I got zero points. This after winning both my pools in the Super 15. Could get 0 again this weekend as relying on upsets to get me back up and running.
@Gungets Tuft: beet heed the mans call
@Greenhopper: No man, not that sort of vested interest – I meant the vested interest I have when I have my predictions hinging on the game. If you play Superbru you will know what I mean. @$^@#$ – I even found myself hoping the Bulls would win during one match this year. Had to shower 14 times to feel clean … :-)
I watch schoolboy rugby, generally all sport, simply for enjoyment. I suppose it’s about what you enjoy – I don’t enjoy predictions. Everyone to their own.
Beet – why not start a Superbru pool here. Everyone that needs to has an alias, or can get one. Do it for the “Rugby Championships” or whatever they call the TriNations now – then everyone can haal uit en wys .. you have all day to get it set up … :-)
@Gungets Tuft: you sound so suspicious of ‘vested interests” who is to say I have any vested interests??? , having watched the game, I have a “gut feeling” it has worked for me before on more occasion then not , I predicted that Westville would beat GW at the season start and the week leading up to that game on the 365 blog , this before any games really started, I believed that GW where weak in two areas, Fly half and Locks, this I said last year , and noted then that these would be the Achilles heals of the school during this season, I think fundamentally I have been proven right ,
I think Hilton, simply don’t have the work ethos amongst the boys, simply don’t , why ? Numerous reasons, simply they don’t have the same desire as the boys from Westville College and GW,
One has to pay more attention to simply the stars in the teams, but a combination of u16 and the 2nd and 3rd team players remaining , a good mixture of experience in opens and youthful exuberance, not all u16 can make the automatic jump to opens and 2nd or 1st team, this you will see lots of next year. My assumption might not be based on having seen each and every game but more on the games against GW, yes , maybe not the best of overviews and players possibly being injured , bad reffing or an off day , BUT on the whole I believe this is what we will see next year
Hey at least I am brave enough to put it out there lol
@Greenhopper: Damn – my wife is right, I am not human :-)
Seriously – I hate predicting. I don’t even think about it. I watch matches without that sort of “vested interest” – much lower stress levels. Advise kids I coach (not rugby) not to look for victory, just to look for the perfect performance which may, or may not, be good enough.
@Gungets Tuft: nice thought , however we all still like to predict , its human
@CyndiAtRugby: Most of the 1st team boys don’t play club, its boys that wish to improve that really play club , I am supposing here, Most schools don’t like the A team players doing Club because they are on scholarships bursaries etc ,
I certainly think that Club players are more savy and more sustainable as players . So I certainly don’t burnout in 1st team is a problem,
I certainly think that preseason starting so soon in October is , a cause, as come December the boys don’t do what the coaches give them , for me Preseason should start at Academy week, prior to 1st term and ramp up , , yes an maybe a few less games over Easter, maybe more of conditioning and warm up games, to prevent injuries that niggle the whole season through
GW problem this year has been other issues off the field and not the proper attention paid form the top onto the players on the field, I stated earlier in the year that the bringing of u20 Sharks game plans to school, it was later noted that this was to stop and combined with imports this didn’t mix and work well.
I know you know and all of us know, it’s been discussed plenty times, that selection was wrong and that many players in the 2nds and 3rd that should have been in the makeup , right down to 4th this whole bunch of 60 should and could have made 1st and 2nd team , you had players out of position and all sorts going on, but what you can say is that 3rds and 2nds had a better season the 1st team, unbeaten by kzn school sides, 3trds only loosing against affies where 2nds won,
I love predictions. Always work out so well. No pack drill, but Glenwood and Hilton were predicting huge things this year which did not pan out that well. Each team had their moments which showed why people had rated them, but in general predictions are a mugs game. It might just be better to punch yourself repeatedly in the face, at least it is nice when you stop.
My prediction – the top KNZ schools will finish somewhere between 1 and 8, each boy is going to run out with victory on his mind and give it all for his school. Just the way it should be – and that is the only prediction that has 100% chance of being right.
@NW_Knight: no i think they will remain dominate , I don’t see Northwood or DHS improving , I see you say “new names” well this will be interesting because unless the boys where there in Grade 10 they should be excluded, as was news this year , I see comments that “money spent wisely at Northwood” this would suggest that Northwood have bought a team, and not really developed and unskilled a team, it show that they are following the same approach as GW and not rewarding the players there of years with the just rewards and faith.
The only way Northwood or DHS can improve that drastically over a period of 1 year , with the results an players they have this year will be if the imported players .
@NW_Knight: This blog needs a like button.
I have often voiced concern about “burnout” in rugby which could be a reason for the GW 1sts not achieving what they should have. I have noticed that all the A teams at GW, Westville and other schools are starting to send their players to additonal tournaments during Easter and even earlier. How much can their growing bodies do before problems set in? Many of these boys only have 2 1/2 months off if they play school and club. In amongst all of this rugby they also have a full academic programme and other school activities. It would be interesting to see if there are any stats on this. Is this maybe the cause of U16 being considered the ‘injury year’?
I agree with @Grassy. It will be 3rd or 4th for GW. And everyone commenting about who has the best team on paper – Rugby’s played on grass. Like I said earlier, there will be names bandied about next year that no-one even heard of this year and some of the “big” names will fade.
Gosh, only 5 months to go!!!
@Grasshopper: Your words are poetic , wear the green jersey they have earned, this has to be remembered by the Coaches as well, this for me is where it started with that attitude and will , like 2000
@Grasshopper: exactly my point , the 2011 team had the same number majority where gr11, again this year best on papaer and we struggled to hold and where under pressure
hence the mix of u16 will mirky the waters here
@Pedantic:I happen to like Salt
, I know everyone are fans of the Du brothers , i think that they have happened to perform this year simply due to the fact that they matured quicker than others, but this will change next year , an example of this could possibly have been Swart , I don’t draw comparisons, but it’s just my humble opinion , from my perspective I have seen some that could possibly be just as good,
I know you have huge experience in selections and teams, so your points are very valid and carry more weight than mine
@Greenhopper: College won the return game against Glenwood in 2000 28-16. Watched that game.
@Greenhopper, let’s not get ahead of ourselves here. Remember the pressure Old Boys and parents put on the Glenwood boys with expectations this, including myself. Glenwood should be happy with 3rd or 4th in 2013, because Kearsney and Westville will have the best sides on paper. Glenwood will have a very young side with only 3 or 4 boys with 1st team experience. If we can get our fixture list righ and not try and play every top 10 side, then I think 2013 could be a good season. Let’s hope we can stay in the headlines for good reasons….attractive, skillful and running rugby….I don’t care if we lose a few, as long as the boys are having fun, playing hard and have pride for the green jersey they have earned…
@star: Kearsney are part of the mentioned gents agreement also – this year they had a couple of applications from VERY good players in Under 16 that were in final GK trials – I know the one was accepted with zero scholarship / bursary and as a result declined and not sure what happened with the other, but he also didn’t join the school.
When I asked about it, I was told about the agreement between the schools.
@Greenhopper: Huh, Hopper? Not sure I understand the inclusion of Clifton and Port Natal? Into top 4 or as regular opposition? GC will be playing College next year, from what I hear.
With regard to Kearsney, I think they will be strong as long as the Du Preez brothers are fit. They make a huge difference to that team. So often we see a side that promises so much due to players returning and the next thing they get injured. Malherbe, Daniel Kriel, Muller at College.
@Greenhopper: I think it’s a bit early to be making predictions like that – what you are saying is quite possible but pretty improbable.
You usually under-estimate Kearsney and get your predictions wrong where they are concerned – this year in particular you predicted all of GW, MC, Saints and Westville to beat them, so we’ll take it with a pinch of salt ;)
@ Pedantic- I think you are so right about getting the Grade 8 intake right in terms of potential and balance and not necessarily about the big names. I think the DHS and Westville U14As are a good example of this policy. It will be interesting to see how they develop next year. I was also under the impression that there was an agreement amongst the govt schools that it was open season till grade 8 and then they would honor the subsequent positions.
@Grasshopper: Was. He has retired.
Star: Westville have a record of getting players from other schools so they cannot complain when the same happens to them. This years 1st team at Westville had a host of players who did not start in Grade 8. I will watch the U16 games next year against Westville, at College, with interest. Westville went on a buying spree in 2010 to bolster their U16’s. This years current 1st team. DHS and College were the big losers. That U16 team lost 1 game, to College at Westville. They beat Glenwood at Glenwood. If Westville are making such a difference then how can this team that lost 1 game in 2010 as U16’s suddenly lose their way? Same coach by the way. Your comments on this years U15’s are noted and we must evaluate on a home and away basis.
@Pedantic: I don’t think that Kearsney will perform, as expected , yes they will be in the top 4 , But it will be College and GW for the next 5 years , Westville will bubble under next year and i suspect that Westville will take KC, MHS will slip and possibly be beaten by Northwood, I predict the following for next year
1. GW no 1 , unbeaten by Natal Sides
2. PMB College, 2nd only loss to GW
3. Westville
4. Kearsney/Hilton
5. MHS/Northwood/DHS/GC
I would like to see possible return matches between the Top 4 , with inclusion of Port Natal and maybe Clifton
I think that predictions based here now is based on this year and that we have all not looked at the inclusion of the u16 into the u18 opens next year and this mix will assist College and GW and work against others
@Greenhopper, I played against that 2000 side in the warm-up game against Varsity. I was playing Varisty Under21 that year. The Glenwood side that year was immense, they ran us ragged in the game. Yes, we shunted them in the scrums, but that is obvious considering we were 2 or 3 years older than the boys. Some of those guys are good mates of mine now, Shaun Manning and Robbie Harris to name a few. The only thing a spotted in the lack of maths skills in the article, played 37, won 35, lost 2, drawn 1, makes 38 games in my mind….typo methinks..
@Grasshopper: thing to remember is that not all Craven week boys should be an automatic choice of inclusion in a school, no proper assessment was done and look where it left GW this year, with a MAJOR HANGOVER
@Greenhopper: Ok .. you got me ;) I have no idea what you’re referring to there ?
@Greenhopper: Yep – Under 15 they suffered a single loss – to Glenwood – no disgrace there.
@Grasshopper: agreed, what needs to be looked at is the parents, good indicator, the old saying , look at your girlsfriends mother , to see what she will look like later 8)
@NW_Knight: never , Northwood and DHS , simply have slipped to far
@Grasshopper: Very good point there – get the Gr 8 intake right with a decent balance. A school doesn’t need several U13 Craven Week players to excel later on – there is so much talent out there that doesn’t make CW but has the potential to grow if nurtured correctly.
I think Northwood got this right in their 2011 intake – no big names, but a strong team of potentially talented players to work with – I reckon their current U15’s are 2nd or 3rd in the province this year.
With Gr8 in mind – that’s where scholarships should stop, but how is that going to be regulated ?
@ All Black- With regard to improvement I can talk with some authority about the Westville U15s who last year comfortably lost both the A and B matches to College. This year the B’s dominated(twice) and the As were unlucky to draw. You say it is easy if you bring in players. The age group had 2 new players- a Westville boy that came back from Kearsney and a hooker from Northern Natal that had originally been offered a spot. Hardly a huge poaching exercise( and in fact they will be losing 3 players this year so a net loss of one). I hope that I have added enough information to support the fact that Westville has been relatively successful in improving performances. I am also glad that you brought up Dean Box and Cameron as Westville also loses players and these are usually the cream.
@Pedantic: hi it didnt help them as u14 and u15 the GW beat them both years, i suspect you are going to see a similar result next year
it’s been said here all along , and i am surprised that the likes of Pedantic and NW Night seem to be building the A team and forgetting the balance of the sides . Lots has been said about Teams rather than individuals, and i am a believer that Teams are better than a group of talented individuals
Next Year will see GW again go unbeaten in Natal, why , because they have learnt from this year , and also this year hero’s aren’t automatically next years
Look how GW started a Decade ago, by the Players input
37 played, 35 won, 2 lost, 1 drawn
The 2000 Rugby season at Glenwood started way back in December 1999. A group of approximately 35 dedicated and enthusiastic boys gave up 3 days a week of their holidays to put in some serious training in the hope of representing the Green Machine. The early training sessions comprised of a 2 day clinic, which was attended by top professionals in the fields of nutrition, sports injuries, psychology, refereeing and coaching.
Top coaches from the Natal Rugby Union attended the early training, and gave the boys their professional views and thoughts which the boys found very interesting.
The season started with some early friendlies against Kloof, Durban Varsity and internal trials. The exciting talent at the Green Machine’s disposal was realised at this early stage.
The ‘real’ season started on the 18 March, up at the Voortrekker Festival, where Glenwood played the main game against Voortrekker. The result – Glenwood 24 Voortrekker 0.
A squad of 20 boys then travelled up to Johannesburg to compete in the St Stithians Festival from 18 to 25 April. This is one of South Africa’s most prestigious schools rugby festivals, which is attended by top rugby schools from around South Africa. The Green Machine played 3 games in 5 days and returned undefeated. A sign of tremendous fitness and dedication. Glenwood overcame a spirited Peterhouse of Zimbabwe, who showed great defence, 17-0, beat Jeppe, playing great 15 man rugby, 45-11 and then had a titanic struggle on the final day of the tournament, against Bishops of Cape Town, who Glenwood had never beaten in their 90 year history. Glenwood played hard, with guts and desire to win their final game 19-11. This placed them as one of only two teams, along with Grey High, to be undefeated at the festival.
The season so far has produced some memorable wins, with victory over Maritzburg College (24-18) Michaelhouse (19-14), Pretoria Boys (26-9) and Kearsney (14-7). With Glenwood recording their 15th straight victory, and enjoying a rating of 3rd in the country at present (at the time of this article going to print), all the hard work seems to be paying off. Under the dedicated leadership of coach Tony Pinheiro and assistant Johan Koch, Glenwood is targetin g an unbeaten season (a feat which was last achieved in 1965).
Thulani Nteta Kicks Off Against Pretoria Boys’
The final game of the “home” season is against our traditional arch rivals DHS on our Old Boys’ Day on 12 August 2000. This is also the official opening of our new Mike Turrell Pavilion development. We expect to be hosting the largest crowd ever on the day which is to be televised on SABC’s Tops port.
The season ends with an overseas tour to Scotland and England at the end of September. The success of this tour brings the tally to 37 played, 35 won, 2 lost, 1 drawn.
@All Black, is that because the College Headmaster is a Glenwood Old Boy
No closed door stuff at College.
@beet: agreed , it proven that not all boys given sport Busaries for Rugtby or any sport that is, are the ones that excell at u18 level
@All Black, I’m sure there are plenty of offers to Glenwood boys, especially playing on the issues of this year to bolster their case. Are you fed up of being replaced by ‘foreign’ players? Do you think you will play first team when the coach brings in players at grade 11 level? Look Glenwood had an average season and the coach does not make all the games, do you want this? We have ‘blah’ ex Sharks player as coach, come here they will get you into the KZN structures…blah blah blah. Maybe College are the only ones with clean hands, but we don’t know what happens behind closed doors…..anywhere. It’s not good and needs to stop soon…
@Grasshopper: I think Glenwood have learnt. Watch your backs though. There are people in glass houses offering to your boys as we speak. I can promise you that it is not College. Wonder how ,many of the other KZN schools can make that promise with confidence? Just saying.
and Horsefly, DHS added half the Eastern Cape to your U16’s a few years ago, including Payi and Buthelezi who are both of the same vintage. I see Northwood are also buying in new talent at U16 level so they cant shout too loud about how they have improved their talent either. Makes me laugh when I see comments about how schools have helped improve their players and teams and yet when our boys take the field against them at 1s team level they recognize less than half the players. Just saying.
@All Black, you can add Calvin Smith to the Hilton purchases. Hopefully Glenwood learnt a hard lesson this year, that accepting the SA schools prop and Valke fullback was more of a disruption than an improvement. I can see why they did, who would say no to two players of Craven Week quality. Sometimes people make emotional quick decisions without applying the ’15 minute’ rule. Think about all the repercussions before making a decision. People make mistakes, the key is to learn from them. Get the grade 8 intake right and there should be no need to bolster ranks later on, unless there is natural movement. I remember a few Dale College kids arriving at Glenwood because their parents moved to Durban for work. It’s a tough one to regulate though, people have the freedom of choice. The issue comes in when kids are coerced to move due to promises and added benefits…
Hmm interesting comments. Any side improves if you add players over the years. Westville bought a host of College boys in their U16 year as well as 4 others from DHS etc. Of course they are going to improve. MHS and Hilton also add players ala Dean Box, Cameron Wright, etc. Unfortunately Glenwood also fell into this trap but doubt if they will do it again. Gentlemen, dont talk about how schools have improved players and are the best etc without adding the information that is important. One thing College can do is look every other school in the eye and say we have not poached or added talent but back the boys we started with in 2nd form.
@All, no one can predict what will happen to kids over the 5 years at high school. They go through some serious physical and psychological changes in puberty and beyond. Just as an example, I was 5foot4 in standard 6 and about 60kg, by matric I was 6foot3 and 95kg, huge growth. In standard 5, I was a wing and by matric a lock/flank. Kids who are physically more advanced in grade 7 usually make KZN schools and by matric the rest have caught up. Granted rugby is not all about size, so if a kid has the skills then they should still do well. This development does not stop at school and only really settles about 2 years out of school when boys reach their adult size. Hence, many ‘heroes’ at school level not making it in open rugby. Schools are ‘buying’ skills and talent at grade 7/8 level and hope the physical growth comes with it..
Connor Allen is going to GW. Kayser to Kearsney (seems you get a big bursary on pedigree). Kayser is definitely talented, but remains to be seen what happens in years to come. He will be wing or FB for Kearsney in 2016 – because he will have sufficient talent (and speed) to carry him through in a smaller school.
I think there was a lot of talent passed over at U13 trials this year and I guarantee that next year we will all be talking about a lot of boys that aren’t o the radar now. I also think that by 2015, comments like Horsey’s “Glenwood and College would be those schools” may end up being “Northwood and DHS…”
@ Horsefly- You mention College and GW if you want improvement as a rugby player. However it is Westville that currently leads thev way. The current Grade 11s beat both GW and College away at U16 when they had been beaten by over 30 points at U14. The current U16 have had there best year and the U15 are acknowledged as the most improved side. But then again MHS had only one U13B player at U14 level but 6 CW week players 5 yeas later.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: I guess you’re referring to the 2011 U16’s ?
Keep in mind that 3 of those 5 KZN players were playing 1st XV (Du Preez’s and Reece-Edwards) – all 3 of them being selected for Craven Week & Grant Khomo.
Having said that, the U16A still had a good season winning 11 of their 13 matches including a good win over Glenwood – would you consider that average keeping in mind 3 of the key players were in 1sts ?
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Aren’t you now falling into the trap of believing that every top u13A player should automatically become an u18 success story when in fact there is a lot of evidence over the year to suggest that only a low % of these u13 kids are the standouts at u18 level.
@Grasshopper:
I’m sure he’s ggoing to Glenwood but there’s already loads of backline talent going there!! I actually see one or two of the KZN boys playin 14B next year such is the talent.
@Pedantic:
Just saying Kearsney is not the place you would send your son if you wanted him to improve as a rugby player. Glenwood and College would be those schools
If you look at Kearsney U16 , last year they had 5 KZN U13A boys( more than other schools) but produced the most average of performances and results..
Don’t get me wrong KC is good school but not for an aspiring rugby player.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Your comment begs the question – are your concerns for the development of players or for the results of your own school & ego ?
I think the 3 SA Schools players proves you wrong – this year at least
@Grasshopper: brogan Allen is happy at GW, and John is as staunch an old boy as I have ever seen. There will be no way John would send Connor would go anywhere other than GW…it’s good to see! Good school. Done so well in all areas.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Don’t be a prick Horsefly!
@pedantic
Sjoe! Kearsney with 3 KZN players that I know of so far for next year!! I’m not concerned though since Kearsney always get KZN talent but almost never use it like they should!!!
@Grasshopper: send him around school, i think the lighty is there already
Hopefully John Allan sends his lightie to Glenwood and does not get enticed by a private school bursary….
@beet: And hopefully Muir’s protege in a few years time also
@Grasshopper: A bit of humour pointing more to the social stance of the individual at his workplace. Nothing to do with his school involve. His boy is at GM for the record. All the other coaches kids at KC.
@Beet & Pedantic, are those jibes as I am aware Straueli has some involved at Glenwood. Funny, the Kearnsey coach and manager are the Craven Week coach and manager so also should have some relationship with the Sharks set-up…..
@beet: Good question! Maybe he’s not part of the ‘in crowd” @ the Sharks setup ;)
@Pedantic: How did Straueli’s son not end up at Kearsney???
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Deon Kayser’s son on his way to Kearsney as far as I know
@nw knight
And I’m sure thhe Kayser boy who made KZN U13 will be going to Northwood. Got pace that one!
@Greenblooded: A number of boys suddenly applying, but all seem to have problems with their current school. None have been accepted to date (and it’s unlikely they will). The U16 prop from Westville wouldn’t make 1st’s next year. The U15 boys would be a nice addition to a good team, but not a necessity.
Next year will be a telling one!! New blood from top down and scholarship money spent wisely
@All Black: Hahhhaa .. those parents have had the hounds of hell barking at their souls for months now, trying to get them to change their minds – not to Grassy’s patch, somewhere else. It has now turned into a Cold War, with no speaks from their peers, as well as other subtle little undermining. Not going to work, the Moms have lift clubs set up, have lunches together. Allies vs Communists :-)
@Gungets Tuft: I see people fishing for information so they can try and change kids minds. Glad you saw through it Gungets.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Naaaa, time will out. Suprised that you didn’t know that SS was at College. There were 5 in 2011 – can mail you those…
@Gungets Tuft:
Hey you could always email me them@ horseflyno.1@gmail.com
Would like to know
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Yeah, think we have a DPHS prop in Gr8 this year as well. Seems like quite a few DPHS kids heading to the Burru next year too. Had some names but I am sure that will all come out next year.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: He’s a good cricketer and more than passable hockey player (Durban Central B) as well. Gareth was keeper at DPHS. Has a great eye, great balance – won the school Cross Country every year but about 2 as well.
@Gungets Tuft:
Seems he’s an all rounder. DHS did an article on him on DPHS Patter and said that he’s consistently getting an A average and has recently been chosen for KZN U15 cricket squad.
@Gungets Tuft:
This is the first time I have heard that S.Swanepoel went to College, been asking around with no answers , glad to hear that. Also, seems College almost always seems to have front row talent from DPHS.
@the greens
Any chance Staples could plaay lock for KZN? He’s done it before.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Smaak Gareth by the way. Not sure if there are any weaknesses in his game but they will be more than made up for with his rugby brain. He watches and learns from rugby more than any other lightie I know.
@HORSEFLY NO.1: Well, since we are not picking teams here we will see soon enough. All just opinions, and as they say in the classics, opnions are like #rseholes – everyone has one.
This year has certainly shown that individual stars don’t make teams, so we will all have to wait till next March/April to see how it all pans out. A few surprises still on the way before then will keep life interesting.
@beet: Well said Sir. Beware to those who underestimate this kid. As you rightly say – it’s all about heart, passion and how much you are willing to commit to get to the top of this game. I have only worked with this boy briefly, not nearly as much as Pedantic has, and can assure you that he will go a long way. He is very committed and works very hard at his game. Combine this with superb skills and great athletic ability and you have a champion. Under-estimate him at your peril!!
@gungets
Its 2 years that the same thing has happened. Febana is very good in lineouts, very fast,strong and has a wicked step. Also, he and Simpson stuck out in a losing battle vs Glenwood causing trouble from every possible direction.
@Pedantic: Staples really doesn’t have to grow an inch more if he’s already 1.93m. There’s no written law that he has to be a lock or the tallest player or even the strongest player on the park to be the most successful. He has to rather focus on skills, speed and strength improvement. Obviously there is also heart – a player can only get so far if he doesn’t have it within him to cope with the physical aspects of the wonderful game.
@star: Very impressive highlights clip – what a player!
Also agree that Nicholson looking more like a potential hooker or fetcher but I’m pretty sure the other 2 # 8’s will have similair highlight reels to your link in 3 years time
I still maintain that Staples is a huge talent, he doesn’t only rely on his size – I’ve worked with him for several years at club & provincial level and rate his skill set highly. He is also deceptively fast.
@Gungets Tuft: I don’t know many of the College boys, but in their game vs Kearsney the forwards totally dominated, the 2, 6 & 8 all had huge work rates. I guess we’ve found a #2
@HORSEFLY NO.1: The DHS match was early in the season. Sam has improved beyond all recognition. I would go so far as to say that his lineout work was one of the diffferences between the Dixons game and the game at Snows. Took a lot of sting out of the big Glenwood forwards who fed on scraps.
@GreenBlooded: At the end of the 2010 year there was a hellova lot of negativity around Northwood. My lightie had a look and it was his second choice. He was given such a hard time at school that I had to go to the Head and intervene – the only time I did so in 7 years of primary school. 3 boys who had decided to go to Northwood eventually bailed and went to DHS, 2 of whom have already moved on from there too. If those perceptions are being turned around – outstanding.
As mentioned Gareth Simpson (9) DHS, he is a very good scrummie! Haven’t seen one quite as good. Also Aphiwe Febana (2,3) DHS, he’s from EC. He’s a good player and overshadowed that College hooker in every way including throwing, he even scored a try to top it off. Also as far as DHS boys go, our 8th man has a chance, I see him at 7 with another being fullback Dillon Bryan being probably the most solid tackler in u15.
JJ Peters could also make it if he plays rugby again and takes it seriously. Last year he was one of the best if not th best no.5 in his age group.
@ NW Knight : I heard that the 3 boys due to leave were originally offered at u13 but chose Westville, so I’m guessing unhappiness with certain things has led to them want a departure. I think B.Kitchings got an outside chance of making it, I like the quick style of play, but he runs to upright and vision isn’t the greatest, but his pass is quick and strong and his kicks are good. As for flyhalf another person we’ve forgotten is Dexten Rossouw, I’v seen him lately and he’s getting bulk and height
@Gungets Tuft: His line out throwing against Glenwood was a stand out. Very accurate and has good feel. Something that is a major problem in SBR.
@Griffon – whats up with all these boys leaving to go to Northwood? Last I heard it was a ‘community school’ that does not do ‘imports’. Some of their supporters have been very vocal on this topic so it would be most hypocritical were they to suddenly start buying players from other schools. But they must have spent a fortune on their new coach so I guess the next logical step would be to get some decent players…………NW_Knight – can you elaborate?
I see there quite a few no 8s being touted. Please refer to link (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vvF6JyYqgc0) to see what the classic No 8 looks like. I am not sure about Nicholson at 8. Also Shange(Westville) offers lots of options in the backline. What I look for boys at this stage are attitude(heart), and instinct/skills set. The No 8 in the link always had them.
I’m with Pedantic on his list, but would add Mottram from Northwood – small, but can play varied positions. I think Staples is going to run out of size ie. everyone else will catch up to him. I don’t believe that he has the skill to make up for lack of size when the others catch up next year.
Dixon, on the other hand, has plenty of skill and should be fine. as far as 9’s go, Simpson is streets ahead – especially as he offers the kicking option.
@beet: sorry just responded to a section of Cyndi’s post
@ Beet : Iv hardly watched the u15 age group this year so i can only comment on potential Westville players who could make it. I think the prop due to leave to northwood is a potential candidate. I also although hes got the potential their captain( K. Nicholson) should move to flank. Their centre M.Shange is also could and is versatile being able to cover every positin in the backs besides scrum half. T.Strydom is also very exciting and has the potential with his good attack and good defense. Their wings are both good with one whos a SA sprinter and the other with excellent defense> Their fullback M.Couch although good is to one dimensional and predictable
@Pedantic: Put in Sam Swanepoel (College) at #2. Bulking up well, was excellent in the lineouts towards the end of the year, solid worker in the loose. Has a really good coach close to home as well.
@GreenBlooded: Another thing I like about him is his leadership qualities – he can change the team dynamic almost single handedly – very special gift.
Big problem again … he just hasn’t grown!
@Pedantic: Yup – but he’s the type of player that could do a decent job in almost any position except maybe lock. The little work I did with him was at flank and he was devastating. Personally I think he is wasted in the front row but perhaps there is no-one else suitable and they have decent players in the other positions.
@Greenhopper: Now that’s off topic ;)
@Greenhopper: You forgot to mention any players
@GreenBlooded: Sad thing about James is that he had some sort of neck/back injury and as a result couldn’t play front row – ended up playing centre in the C’s ??
@CyndiAtRugby:i think it has lots to do with the Coach, and his style, for me it would be a case of Webber or Toppy ,
I would prefer to see Toppy and Webber as 1st Team Coaches for next Year , very astute Coaches, Simpson maybe or bring the u14a Coach up to u16 , he knows these boys.
I don’t think Dudas has the relevant experience or qualifications yet , more of a Sean “yes man” and it showed a bit this year , whilst his team certainly got the results it was more because they were good players , Rumor was last week, 2nds played the 1st and were beating them, they then brought on the thirds’ and same thing , a parent was telling me there was very unhappy 1st team management on Dixons last week when this was going on .
GW needs to restructure, and adapt. It’s not to say Attila is a bad coach , he could just be better, Start him with the u14 a , new group, get him to grow each year with them and in 4 years he will have the credentials to be the 1st team coach, put him through coaching courses and you can see he will develop. But next year Webber and Simpson/Toppy. Need to take the reins ,
Dahmas, should join Dudas with the new u14 and grow, define a strategy and work with it as that being the goal , The u14 coach knows the boys coming into u16 , I rate him, he can produce good results with the team, 4th Team coach to go to u15 a , also very good
Just my view
“
A list to get started with … welcome discussion with regards to positions as there are several players here who could easily shift to a different position.
College
Matt Kriel (10)
DHS
Gareth Simpson (9)
Westville
Keagan Nicholson (6, 7, 8)
Tagen Strydom (15, 12)
Gelofte
Dexton Rossouw (10,12)
George Campbell
Andre Vorster (11,15)
Glenwood
Brandon Staples (8)
Ruan van Rensburg (13,14)
MHS
Matt Wiseman (8)
Kearsney
Brendon Vorster (9)
Tristan Dixon (8,12)
Northwood
N Mthembu (1)
N Fincham (3,5)
@GreenBlooded: Of course – the Glenwood boys have already been mentioned else my list would have been a lot longer ;)
Keagan Nicholson of Westville – No 8 and Captain of U15A.
Tristan Dixon of Kearsney – Also No 8
James Smith of Michaelhouse – serious injury kept him out for most of this season but a quality player nonetheless
My son, of course
A large prop with a lot of passion for the game.
I guess Brandon Staples must be mentioned although he is losing the dominance due to size. He is still a big talented player but because of his reputation is often ‘shut down’ before he can really do anything.
Mukendi (wing) is an amazing player, with lots of speed and agility.
Handre Viktor (flank or 8th man)and Jayden (can’t remember surname) are spending a few months as exchange students in England. It will be interesting to see what happens with their rugby.
I’m interested to see what happens with Colin next year – Colin has had to take a year off rugby due to a knee operation … he is looking strong but not sure what the ‘year off’ will have done to his performance.
Murray (centre) is one of those quiet players that stabilises the team and helps them focus. He also has superb ball handing skills.
IMHO Glenwood U15A has many brilliant individual players but they do not have many team players. This is something that I hope Glenwood will be looking at in all age groups.
I have no idea. Cyndi will definitely know from a Glenwood perspective!
I will open the bidding with :
Matt Kriel – College #10. Good vision, great boot. Great genes (younger boet of Dan and Jesse)
Ntuthuko Kunene – Northwood prop.