There have been a number of bizarre developments at St Charles College recently in respect of one of its 1st XI players (or ex-players as the case may be).The one-time captain of the 1st XI was dropped by the coach for what appeared to be a run of poor form. He was not only dropped as captain but from the XI altogether. This triggered an unfortunate series of events.
The father of this scholar, whose identity has been withheld for legal reasons, instituted an urgent application in the Kwazulu-Natal High Court for an urgent order reinstating his son to the 1st XI. That application has been opposed by the school who have yet to file answering papers.
The father went further and instituted a damages claim for R2.1 million against the 1st XI coach, Dave Karlsen, claiming that the scholar had suffered damages to his dignity and reputation. That appears to be interesting given the natural loss of reputation that the scholar would have suffered from his run of poor form where he scored 0, 0, 2, 0, 0 and 4 in his last six innings prior to him being dropped.
In a recent bizarre turn of events, the head of cricket, Bruce Roberts (who some may remember from his Transvaal “Mean Machine” days in the 1980s and early 1990s) has been dismissed for communicating with this scholar’s father. Roberts is challenging his dismissal in the CCMA as being unfair.
It seems as if the school is trying to resolve the matter with the parent. I certainly hope that day has not arrived where a parent can bully a school into selecting his/her son by the threat of legal proceedings. That would be a sorry day indeed.
@Woltrui: Ou Woljol, hier noem ons ‘n ding nog meer reguit as dit, waneer dit nodig is. Waardeer maar die diskresie! Dis maar skaars! Nie eers ‘n HGH regter is veilig nie!
@BoishaaiPa: I think he’s confusing you with Predator who made the comment ” Verbeel ek my of is die level van rugby op ‘n ander vlak in die res van die land as in KZN. Dit
reflekteer in die Grant Khomo, Akademie en die CW as ek die uitslae korrek interpreteer. Enige rede?”
@Jordaan: Waar het ek iets oor KZN gese?..Voel jy skuldig?..If the shoe fits wear it!…
@BoishaaiPa: Wat kak praat jy oor KZN??
@kcob: You know where to stick your finger!!
As an ex rugby player who has been watching the Craven Week train I find it hard to believe that the 1st team train while the reserves have to stand and watch and don’t take part in the the training session. How do the reserves know what the game plan is if fhey are excluded?
@Woltrui: Ons gee net die feite van die saak !
@Koos Roos: @BuffelsCM:
Jissie julle Visvoete kan varksig raak so vroeg in die oggend!
Bly Ploegie is nie hier om dit te beleef.
@Koos Roos: I guess old Hutch did the explaining afterwards when having a drink (or more) with the rest of the commentators !
@Anonymous: It was very funny and showed a very human side of a golfing Great. Thouht it was only and my friends who got upset when hitting a bad shot. @Buffel. Yes that was even more funny. Hutchie refusing to explain.
@Anonymous: @Koos Roos: If I recall correctly Dennis Hutchinson was part of the commentary crew. The others asked him but he didn’t want to explain lol !!
@Koos Roos:
Classic bit of television that was, with the international commentators asking what a doos was.
@kcob: Is that like when Ernie said: You pulled it you doos? Or more serious. If so, no need for abuse here guys!
Verbeel ek my of is die level van rugby op ‘n ander vlak in die res van die land as in KZN. Dit reflekteer in die Grant Khomo, Akademie en die CW as ek die uitslae korrek interpreteer. Enige rede?
Ek is so bly ons is in die Wes-Kaap waar ons mekaar verduur, respekteer en goeie opposisie is elke jaar …imagine as een skool domineer vir n paar jaar lank!….Dit gebeur nie sommer hier nie!…Elke skool word gedurig terug aarde toe gebring!….
Ek is so bly ons is in die Wes-Kaap waar ons mekaar verduur, respekteer en goeie opposisie is elke jaar nie…imagine as een skool domineer vir n paar jaar lank!….Dit gebeur nie sommer hier nie!…Elke skool word gedurig terug aarde toe gebring!….
@WBHS Griffon: You’re a doos! That simple!
@Playa: Let us rather stick to the facts then no one can be misunderstood.
@Deon: No I did not say that.I have not participated in any Afrikaner debate. I think you have mistaken me for Tjoppa.
@Tjoppa: No Tjoppie, that is not a justification, it is an explanation/speculation of what they could have seen as racism.And if you read further, you will see that I said even if that is the case, it is no standpoint to cry “racism”.Do yourself a favour and look up “justification”.Accuse me of speculation, then that is fair.I used that to make a point, and not to start a new story.Different to what you did in the previous matter.If my point was misunderstood, then I apologise.
@Tjoppa, nee, jammer, dis my werk om seker te maak my klient betaal betaal so min als moontlik belasting. Dis anyway belasting betaalbaar in België. Die opgawes moet presies 6 maande na afsterwe ingedien wees, en ek het gisteraand aan die slaap geraak. So, ek moet vandag eers die inligting by die notaris (die f….. stelsel van notarisse in België!!!!!!) kry, wat dit weer indien by die Belgiese regering. Jammer-geen gelde betaalbaar in SA om jou pensioen te stu, maar wel in België agv hul vreemde stelsel van “nalatenschapbelasting”. Mooi dag, praat vanaand miskien.
@Deon: Al wat ek dan kan se is dankie vir jou belasting geld wat ons ou pensioentjie bietjie leefbaarder maak.
At tjoppa and bog. I was not serious at all about your comments, only pertinent that we stand together. Guess who was one of the founders and I think principles of Paul Roos, dr Andrew Murray Jnr, son of GCB’s Andrew Murray. Almost all our first rectors were British, and we were called Victoria College.I just want to make sure we avoid racial/language issues. I am almost always tongue in the cheek, and needed to make admiration for all rugby schools and commuities, and their pupils clear and evident. Nightie night. I have to submit in Brussels tomorrow and ek is sat gewerk. Love/hate you bastards.
@Greenwood: Greenwood, with respect, that’s one thing that Westville have always had is the best team spirit, even though we may not have had the biggest forward packs in the past, out spirit always shines through and that’s why we leading the way as the top all round school in KZN.
You guys have made great strides in the last 10 years or so, especially in rugby, but it really burns you that Westville has overall, has outperformed you in most departments.
I know it’s a tough one to try and swallow and explains all the animosity from you guys that we don’t get from any other school. Learn from Westville rather than being anti all the time.
@BOG: Except for the hatred some of the Bloggers display towards a certain school. Completely unwarranted was it not for a certain Blogger’s attitude towards the other inferior schools in this wonderful country of theirs.
@Deon: You will soon learn not to take everything so serious here. I can continue with the argument of what a “Christian” is- one who claims to be one, mostly out of tradition and habit or according to the Word. SA is no more Christian than Europe even though many will be surprised -certainly very far from the 70% claims. And guess who was GCBs first principal? Dr Andrew Murray, the most published Christian author internationally. His books are still being re-published today- 160 years after his death
@Deon: Jissie ou Deon wat het jy gesondig dat Mammie jou so op jou senuwees het. Onthou 99% van alles wat hier gese word maar tong in die kies. Dus onspan die boude, hang die ballas en lag vir ‘n slag. Dit is nogal bevrydend.
@Everyone. The attempt of many people, also lately on this site, to distinguish between different groups of Afrikaners is typical South African rhetoric. Us Afrikaners tend to be provincialists, and like to take (mostly good natured) jibes at each other, referring to each other as Blikore, Vaalpense etc, but within each and every Afrikaner community all different “types” exist. No specific Afrikaner community can be stereotyped. I know Bloem very well, and although I love to joke with these folks, often out of jealousy, I respect them and all the schools I have come to know, including and probably especially GCB highly. The Vrystaters are fantastic people, and the Free State has produced some brilliant free thinkers. I also love the Vaalies, although I cannot help but joke about the Afrikaans pronunciation in especially the Menlo Park area, who do not own standhuise (beach houses) by the ocean, but “stronthoyse” which loosely translates to “sh.thouses”. In the Cape we also have some terms and pronunciations other people joke about. However, us South Africans do not have the liberty to focus on differences, we should focus on similarities. The similarity between us all is our love for rugby, especially schoolboy rugby. None of us own rugby. It is one of our national sports and should bind us together. I do not believe that one language group or race plays rugby better than the other. As a last thought, @Playa, I think your brain is a bit tight, stating: “It is a fact that there are more Afrikaans Christian Church Groups per person compared to any other nation/folk in the world” If it is a fact, and therefore scientifically determined, please state your source. Utter bs. I have lived and studied in Europe a long time, and although it is a largely secular society, I am sure the Christian Groups per Christian person is no less than among Afrikaners, although I do not have scientific evidence for this. Therefore I do not state it as fact. Europe’s Protestant Reformation, the Edict of Nantes, and the Edict of Fontainebleau and all the Church Groups originating from this makes the conflict between our church groups look mediocre. So,please, I would love to evaluate your source, although none of this fascist talk does not belong on this blog. We love schoolboy rugby.
@rugbyfan: It is to be noted that the Afrikaners as a unite group never existed and never will. It is a fact that there are more Afrikaans Christian Church Groups per person compared to any other nation/volk in the world. The only common thing is the language.
@Playa: And I quote – “But just as a point in case, maybe where they are coming from is that maybe there is a white kid in the team, who has performed just as dismally, but managed to retain his place in the team.It happens.I doubt very much that the racism accusation has anything to do with anyone’s racist utterances, but maybe they feel (a) certain other white player(s) were treated ” unquote. This statement from a man who insisted on a previous matter that we can only act on facts?
@Tjoppa: LOL! Kindly quote where I said this was justified.
@BOG: It is strange how people split the Afrikaans people as this and that. Well all I can say being a soutie who went to Grey Bloem there was nothing wrong with the Afrikaans boys at school with us and yes we as the English only made up about 25/30% of the school but we were never made to be anything but part of the GCB family out by our Afrikaans comrades at GCB I will say that when I went to the army I did see another group whether they came from the Transvaal or not were self centrered and arrogant and believed that all people of the English variety were the enemy and I can tell you they were not from Bloem.
Still remember to this day how the one boy with us in the army would tell me how he hated the English and after I told him so did I as a Scottish person he never mentioned it again. I think people are rather short sight when it comes to this not all people who speak English are from England.
So not all Afrikaans people are ” Ducthman” There is a big difference.
@Greenwood: As a person who had an English (speaking) mother of German descent and an Afrikaans father and then on to Grey where there are boys- Afrikaans, English, Portuguese, Greek, Jewish, “Black” (Sotho, Tswana, Zulu, Xhosa). A prominent Jewish person once said that Bloem was the only city in SA which did not have a Jewish club for the simple reason that they were fully assimilated with the community at large. What Pinky is trying to tell you, is that the more “exclusive and narrow minded” Afrikaners are found beyond the Vaal river. They are the lot who surrendered to the British in 1902 at Vereeniging and to this day, still burdened by their collective consciences, which of course, makes them , almost without exception, irrational. And there are two perfect examples right here.
Griffin – with respect – I’m sure it was last year – you guys went and collected a Gelofte player (Who was still Schooling at Gelofte)) & who was playing in a Rugby Tournment in Potch and brought him back and chucked him into your first team – This Bullshite is why us Greenies have a negative tendency towards Westville -so don’t come with this hypocritical Cr..p Glenwood have a “gees” that you guys don’t and never will have
@Greenwood: What a load of BS, Glenwood is a “rainbow nation” – lose the sentimental nonsense, the fact is that Glenwood will take anyone who will improve their rugby!
@Greenwood: Greenwood now I do not care if I “p..s” a certain blogger off. Living in Bloemfontein only exposed you to the people we as Afrikaners call “agterblyers”. You need to cross into the Transvaal of old to experience the true Afrikaner. A very big difference in the two cultures.
Tjoppa
you are right about the Afrikaners at Glenwood – there is no doubt that this is one of the reasons why the schools’ rugby has improved. Go to any game at the school and you will hear much Afrikaans being spoken – I have heard people say that Glenwood is a dual medium School – I personally have a deep respect for the Afrikaaners – having lived in Bloem for a year and I must comment that Glenwood is truly an example of the Rainbow nation and its great to see the brotherhood that exists between all the boys- Black , white & Asians and coloured and in saying that the Black and coloured players at GWD are awesome and have made a big impact on the quality of rugby at the school – same as you I don’t want to P…S bloggers off with my comments here too
Greenblooded Nose Stud Case
Funny you should bring this up
I was going to pass comments on this issue but was not sure if it was a good idea – didn’t want
bloggers to pass accusations of racial comments
In the nose stud case what amazed me was that even after the girl left school the mother still persisted in getting a ruling which came thru over a year later – talk about persistence !
@BOG: Ter versagting van ou Tjoppa. Hy het gese hy gaan maar inkruip. Was seker maar moeg.
@Tjoppa: Die “inhoud” van jou kommentaar bevestig dat jy te laat gaan slaap het. Was dit die nagsuster se “af’ aand? When the cat is away, the mice will play ?
@Koos Roos: Klink vir my baie soos die events bygewoon by die Potch Dam.
@Tjoppa: Het vanmiddag die vroue 7’s gekyk. Mengsel van rugby/modderstoei/nat t-hemp gewees. My fyn enetjie sal nie daar regkom nie, veral nie in daai tipe weer nie! Meer Castertjie se scene.
@Anonymous: That is the first step to become a real Afrikaner.
@Koos Roos: She does not play rugby? What a disgrace. Does she not care what the neighbours would say? Some families would reward this kind of behaviour with cement ballet shoes.
Can I plead permanent insanity
@Tjoppa: Any of those sports, except ballet. It’s bloody dangerous! My daughter broke a toe the other day.
@Tjoppa: Ha ha
@Koos Roos: Koos as uncle Bog always says we must not forget the lesson of history. And I am sure the true inhabitants of KZN will acknowledge that their rugby only improved with the sudden influx of Afrikaans people. This trend can also be seen in Glenwood becoming a recent powerhouse of KZN rugby, by importing young Afrikaners to their teams. I would never be, as you put it “pissed off” if called clueless regarding cricket, hockey and/or ballet, as I am. Must further only state I do no wish to acquire knowledge of the said “sporting codes”. As the Afrikaner has a saying “Elke vlieg op sy eie drol”. Therefore I do not wish to “piss” anybody off just stating facts.
@Koos Roos: We tried hard to give the game to the Lions, but thank goodness Halfpenny missed and gave the convicts the victory.
@Tjoppa: Tjoppie youre going to piss people from KZN off. But yes, it sometimes looks as if the refs took that one for themselves.
@Anonymous: Do not worry coaching rugby while being English and from KZN you can plead temporary insanity or just ignorance of the laws. But Koos if I am correct ignorance of the law would not apply here. That is the defense allocated to the referees.
@Anonymous: I see what coaches do for the boys at PRG. I do not wish something like this on any coach. I think they deserve far more credit than the sometimes, unfair critic they get.
@McCulleys Workshop: or institute your own action for pain and suffering.
@Anonymous: make sure you put your wife, whistle and shooting stick in trust, that should stymie the mothers.
@Tjoppa: Tjoppie, don’t worry. I’ll defend you to your last cent! No serious, whoever took this case on, is either stupid or as we say in afrikaans ” ‘n aardsoptimus”.
I hope you are right Koos it’s just a bit distressing as i really enjoy coaching. I don’t profess to know everything but i try my best and give it a go to the best of my ability. I feel desperately sorry for DK who has had this whole mess landing on his head. I wouldnt be taking it well at all.
@Koos Roos: Koos nothing against your profession, something had to be found for the pirates of the modern era, but I think there must be a law guarding the misuse of the legal system, and there we can only point fingers to the prokurowers who will defend and prosecute anything if the money is right.
@Anonymous: Lets let the case take its course. Like I said before. Don’t think they will succeed, for the reasons you mention.
The real concern, speculatively, if this father wins his case. What does that mean for the future of school sport how many school-teacher coaches can afford 2bar every time they drop a boy of another race. That is assuming the alleged racism is false. Though why would a racist coach choose a player of another colour as his captain in the first place. Schools will have to take out liability insurance if they want to have any coaches at all, because the only school coach with a salary rumoured to be adequate to cover these damages has just been promoted to the big leagues.
@GreenBlooded: the tragedy of this is – careful what kids you take into your school…
@GreenBlooded: Big difference between something that can be brought under some kind of umbrella like religion. To be captain of a cricket team, different story. Don’t think the court is going to assist him. But then, strange things have happened.
I wonder how far he intends taking this? Once his pride is on the table you may find he will go all the way. It reminds me of the ‘nose-stud’ case at Durban Girls High some years ago where despite signing the school code of dress, this Hindu girl and her mother took the school to court, losing all the way to the Constitutional Court who eventually upheld her case and ordered the school to pay ALL COSTS!!!
http://wwrn.org/articles/26479/?&place=africa§ion=hinduism
@Koos Roos: No we have a Indian dad crying racism, according to Playa, that justifies their behaviour. Rather he sticks to facts. Bleddy Agent.
HIMSELF I mean.
@Rugger fan: Come on guys, we simply have a father making a fool of homself and his kid. No need to bring anything else into it.
@Tjoppa: Lets rather blame it on the English for bringing people from the homeland and colonies to SA.
Come on blame it on Apartheid and get over it.
So sad. I wonder if the boy in question was invited to KZN trials and what the selectors said there? Any idea if he (or any of his team mates) had a crack at the teams?
And also to think that this is all after the fact. In the 4th term (cricket season) I’m sure he’ll be concentrating on exams – so will not play many games any way?
If he’d just been quiet – the 1st team capt can remain on his CV – as he WAS captain and that remains. This really seems like a storm in a tea cup – after the fact.
@McCulleys Workshop: I agree with you, i said I wonder if there will be damage. A dramatic event like this must have some effect on the team. I served on a School council for many years , and believe me it does have an effect on the coach and teachers. The schools don’t want media exposure of any kind that involves negative parents or issues for that matter. It is almost every time blown out of proportion in the media. I’m waiting in anticipation to see what the parent will do if they loose the case. The way parents react when their kids are dropped from 1st teams all over SA leave much to be desired. Is this because they feel that they will not have an opportunity for contracts with the unions,…or it damages there social status,… I think that the incidents are getting worse year on year,..only my opinion
@Predator: How did you arrive at this conclusion? There is possibly the converse situation, that the school will be exonerated and their exemplary reputation upheld, that the Parent will lose with costs, and the boys will get on with the game realizing that the pupil concerned and his parent acted unbecomingly. It would not surprise me if the pupil leaves, it seems as if there is an irreparable breakdown of the relationship. If you are so aggrieved and feel the need to take action to the extreme that he has, why on earth retain your child at the school?
I wonder what damage this will do to the overall normal operation and image of this school. The father exposed his son to verbal torture that will affect him emotionally in future. Do you pick him for the squad again? Will this affect the performance of the rest of the squad? Will the coach be motivated enough to coach under all this controversy? A racially motivated action /reason from an educated adult that has no idea of the damage that was done,…. a good example of somebody with knowledge but no wisdom!!!
@beet: Also bear in mind that there way be a confidentiality clause in his employment contract. Labour courts take these seriously. I fear we don’t have enough info to realy venture proper opinion.
@beet: I think McCulley may be close. Not a labour law man myself, but I also think that where a matter is sub-judice, it is not desirable for an employee of the school to communicate with plaintiff or applicant. But that amount of damages! For a schoolkid. Wonder how they calculated the quantum?
@beet: from what I’m led to believe, there was an express and clear instruction that no party was to communicate with the plaintiff, (parent), but the headmaster, as the school was entering into mediation discussions and didn’t want its position compromised in any way. Against this backdrop the head of cricket elected to correspond with the plaintiff by email. Unless there is a lot more to it than meets the eye, I would think the employee could be in trouble.
@Koos Roos: What do you make of the Head of Cricket being dismissed for communicating with the parent. He must have gone against instruction from the school but does this merit firing especially with SA’s labour laws the way they are. Surely the school will be parting with some money on that one or not necessarily??? What do you think?
I DOUBT IF THIS BOY AND FATHER WILL GET FAR! OUR COURTS DO MAKE STRANGE FINDINGS FROM TIME TO TIME, BUT THIS IS INSANE. WHAT I FIND EVEN MORE STRANGE IS THAT AN APPLICANT MUST AMONGST OTHER THINGS PROVE A RIGHT WAS INFRINGED. FAIL TO SEE SUCH A RIGHT WHERE A COACH IS ENTRUSTED WITH A SELECTION OPTION. MY PREDICTION. A HUGE COST ORDER AGAINST APPLICANT.
@Predator: Yeah this stinks. I dont see how the coach could have suddenly become a racist the day he dropped him.
The father’s stance is just shocking. I know my dad would have probably klapped me across the face if I had gone crying “racism” after bein dropped from a team.
@Playa: Your comment hit a deserving “SIX” runs. If the coach had racial issues, then he would not be captain. Another person that blames his or his sons inability on racial crap. If a top rank Springbok player gets dropped for bad performance ,..then what makes this boy so special !!!. A sad day for school sport in SA
Ridiculous is all I have to say. For things to come to this…absolutely ridiculous.
@All
For the record, I do not at all support the supposed behaviour of this kid and his father.If there is oul play of any kind, I think there are better ways to handle such things.But just as a point in case, maybe where they are coming from is that maybe there is a white kid in the team, who has performed just as dismally, but managed to retain his place in the team.It happens.I doubt very much that the racism accusation has anything to do with anyone’s racist utterances, but maybe they feel (a) certain other white player(s) were treated differently.Otherwise, why would he refuse to be dropped to another team, which would means he stays under the same “racist” coach if he had been racially abused?
Nonetheless, this is a ridiculous.We cannot play the race card everytime we are handed a raw deal.In this case, his own performance warrants dropping.This is a shame.
If this family is connected to the Guptas or Schaik’s then the school and the coach have problems, but on a more serious note if a schoolboy refuses to step down he has serious emotional problems ( inherated from the father ) that will not stand him good for the future. Note to BOY: change school and province,…note to FATHER: get a life and change profession you fool!!
Well, according the reports in the media, the son was asked to relinquish the captaincy, due to poor performance and he refused, he was dropped to the 2nd side to regain form, and he decided to withdraw himself from the second side. The family are citing racism as the schools reason for dropping him. If any of the above is correct, why would you feel sorry for ‘the lad’? It takes a special family to have the gaul to attempt a move like this. There is no doubt that there will be hearsay affidavits about the coaches racial utterances. Maybe I’m wrong, but I can’t think of many schools with a budding Hashim Amla, that would want to drop him because he is an Indian. Most Catholic schools in South Africa have had an open policy of education for all, for years, and many have been outspoken on the subject of racism.
Lets say this goes to Court – surely a magistrate or a Judge will consider any issue put before them to be “within reason” – or “a reasonable issue ” This borders on being a joke – looking at
the kids performance at the crease surely the coach has to take some action if any sportsman
is not performing and likewise if form returns the boy would be reinstated to the team
– had the coach continued to field an under performing boy – the coach would have got the chop
@Deon: I doubt that he will ever attend one
At this young man’s 50th matric reunion this farce will still be remembered. Thank you dad.
I read in the paper that his father is a lawyer and is claiming the coach was being racist??
I hope this is resolved amicably – parents being able to sue schools for their kids being dropped – imagine the ramifications for schools going forward!
Insane. This kid’s cricket career is over. His father has ruined it in more ways than one. No one will want to touch him going forward. Talk about character building
i feel sorry for the youngster involved he is the real loser here. Can you imagine how his days at school must be when everyone knows whats going on. Crazy would hope someone wise is counselling the father/lawyer/advocate.
People are now losing their jobs and the ability to provide for their families over a selection decision in a school team? I actually feel sorry for the youngster.