Private school “Zulus” to play at u18 Dubai Sevens

A team of 12 promising under-17 players from various top private schools around KZN will play under the name of Zulu 7 at the Emirates Airline Dubai Rugby Sevens from 04-06 December 2014. FINAL RESULT : ZULU 7 loses to FRANCE in final.

There are a few other South African teams participating in the 16-team under-18 international tournament, with high schools HTS Middelburg and Voortrekker (Bethlehem) being the easiest team names to recognise.

Defending champions France are back. They won last year’s tournament in convincing fashion.

For the full schedule : click here

ZULU 7 TEAM

Name School Regular Position
1 Ruben Vosloo Clifton Flank
2 Tristan Kock Crawford La Lucia Wing
3 Matthew Dahl Hilton Scrumhalf
4 Brendan Vorster Kearsney Scrumhalf
5 Tristan Dixon Kearsney Lock
6 Victor Foster Michaelhouse Fullback
7 Frank Goble Michaelhouse Wing
8 Bader Pretorius Michaelhouse Flyhalf
9 Malulo Sadiki Michaelhouse No.8
10 Jordan Sinsink Clee Michaelhouse Lock
11 Luke Tomlinson Michaelhouse Centre
12 Matt Wiseman Michaelhouse Hooker

TABLES

Pool P W L D PF PA PD TF Pts Rk
Pool A
France 3 3 0 0 98 7 91 16 9 1
Zulu’7 3 2 1 0 69 24 45 11 7 2
Bethlehem Voortrekker 3 1 2 0 20 96 -76 4 5 3
BYE 3 0 3 0 0 60 -60 0 3 4
Pool B
Eagles Invitational 3 3 0 0 68 41 27 12 9 1
Mauritian Barbarians U18 3 2 1 0 69 38 31 11 7 2
The Centurion Invitational VII 3 1 2 0 45 59 -14 6 5 3
Brussels Seven Development 3 0 3 0 39 83 -44 7 3 4
Pool C
SA Gemsbokke 3 3 0 0 107 17 90 17 9 1
Moscow Schools Rep Team 3 2 1 0 60 46 14 10 7 2
School Dinamo 3 1 2 0 34 50 -16 6 5 3
Hunter Valley Grammar 3 0 3 0 12 100 -88 2 3 4
Pool D
HTS Middleburg 3 3 0 0 76 5 71 12 9 1
RA Gold Coast 3 2 1 0 62 38 24 10 7 2
Moscow Region 3 1 2 0 21 53 -32 3 5 3
Doverie 3 0 3 0 24 87 -63 4 3 4

KNOCKOUT

QUARTERFINALS SEMIFINALS FINAL WINNERS
France 38 France 12 France 29
Mauritian Barbarians U18 0
HTS Middelburg 36 HTS Middelburg 7
Moscow Schools Rep Team 5
FRANCE
SA Gemsbokke 26 SA Gemsbokke 15
The Rugby Academy Gold Coast 10
Zulu’7 31 Zulu’7 24 Zulu’7 5
Eagles Invitational 5

157 Comments

  1. I would like to see a 15’s ISR team selected every year with a possible tour overseas

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  2. 7 House boys. I wonder if this will be any indication of the strength of the 15 man team. A backline that includes Voster, Goble, Pretorius and Tomlinson looks quite exciting. I just feel looking at their schedule that the team won’t be challenged much ( and the fact that they are not playing Westville on the local front does not help their cause and is a real shame)

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  3. u17 Private Schools XV just off the top of my head

    1 Andrew Peverelle HC
    2 Matt Wiseman MHS
    3 Lee-Marvin Mazibuko MHS
    4 Tristan Dixon KC
    5 Jordan Sinsink-Clee MHS
    6 – 8 Etienne Marx HC / Ruben Vosloo CC / Mulalo Sadiki MHS / Sebastian Desvaux de Marigny HC
    9 Matt Dahl HC
    10 Bader Pretorius MHS
    11 Darren McGee HC
    12 Daniel Loftus HC
    13 James Tedder KC
    14 Liam Furniss MHS
    15 Victor Foster MHS

    Sorry I don’t know the St Charles boys well enough but hear they have a good prop in the mix.

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  4. And for the fun of it a quick pick Govt school XV

    1 Jordan Els Westville
    2 Aphiwe Febana DHS
    3 Khutha Mchunu Glenwood
    4 Fudge Qoma Westville
    5 Nama Xaba Glenwood
    6 Kevin Smit Glenwood
    7 Mthokozisi Ntuli DHS
    8 Marco Palvie Glenwood
    9 Gareth Simpson DHS
    10 Matt Kriel Maritzburg College
    11 Xolisa Guma Maritzburg College
    12 Donovan Du Randt Glenwood
    13 Ruan van Rensburg Glenwood
    14 Ilunga Mukendi Glenwood
    15 Jayden Morgan Glenwood

    I can think of a few u16s who will up right there as well.

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  5. @beet: One would need to Find a place for Pau . I have a feeling he will come into his own in 2015. Also Luke Van Vuuren of KC as a loose forward.

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  6. @beet: With HC and MHS having 6 & 7 respectively it looks like a tough 2015 for Kearsney :mrgreen:

    A pity Tristan Kock from Crawford LL doesn’t get a chance to play 1st tier rugby – he would certainly challenge for one of those wing positions.

    The one pvt school player to watch out for in 2015 is KC’s Mitchell Nesbit – finished off 2014 on a high and was impressive throughout the 7’s season.

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  7. @beet: The thing that stands out for me here is that the only 2 Westville players in your quick pick are the two boys imported from Hudson Park.

    Was this a particularly bad intake for Westville ?

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  8. @Buffel: Yeah apart from Pau, I can think of Dillon Bryan of DHS, Kudzai Munangi of College and Luke Tomlinson of MHS also looking to make an impression.

    Pau has the physical presence and experience. He’s shown promise at times this season. His success might be determined by his teamwork and vision, two things that sometimes go hand in hand.

    Van Vuuren is a bit of an unknown quantity at this stage. There will be some decent compo amongst the loosies in 2015. Maybe a bit easier to start the season as an outsider rather than the player expected to deliver big? Kelton Thunder of MC and Keagan Sparks of NW possibly 2 other u17s expected by their supporters to impress next year

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  9. Would have to back the private schools team in that match.

    @Beet, Do you know who the coaches of the Zulus are?

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  10. @beet: St Charles got some real quality for next year and would also throw Clifton’s Evans (lock); Erskine (no.8) and Goedeke (no.9) into the selection mix :-D

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  11. @Pedantic: @Pedantic: Perhaps I was a bit harsh on both KC and Wvl.

    Good to hear that Nesbitt star is on the rise.

    For what it’s worth I think the Wvl hooker and wing both u16 this year will be strong challengers for KZN honours in 2015 plus WBHS are responsible for a 3rd player on my list catching the eye.

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  12. @Tarpeys: Yeah I also think the private school XV would be favourites to win against the Govt school XV based on the teams picked.

    I think Ryno Combrinck is one of the coaches. Not sure who else is traveling with the team.

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  13. Mildly off the subject How about a local 15’s game at the end of next year between a mixed Private Schools 15 Vs a mixed Govt schools game…

    A combined House , Hilton , Kearsney , St Charles & Clifton sounds like a mean combination ?

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  14. @beet: Lucky you aren’t a Craven Week selector – you’d have a lynch mob after you….. :mrgreen:

    Didn’t we compile a list of up and coming U16 players 2 years back? Would be interesting to see how all those names have fared. I’d also throw the name Sam Swanepoel (MC) into the mix at hooker for the Govt Schools.

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  15. @GreenBlooded: I’d love to see the CW Selectors silly season picks. One thing you’d be able to bet your bottom dollar on is their choices consisting of a disproportionately large number of representatives from their own schools.

    The battle for a hooker berth will possibly be the hottest contested of all possies. I’ve even seen a youngster at Porties who has impressed me much – Koos Kruger. Beast Mthembu of Northwood is another player who gives a 110% each and every time. Add the highly rated Hendrik Prinsloo of Westville to Swanepoel who many rate as a possible KZN first choice and my two in Febana and Wiseman and its gonna come down to whoever brings their triple A game in 2015 to stay ahead of the chasing pack for selection.

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  16. @beet: Yes – Prinsloo is only U17 next year but surely has what it takes to mix it with the U18 counterparts. Known this guy since about U11 – physical as you can possibly get but will need to work on his throwing which lets him down. Not familiar with the others but will be keeping an eye out.

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  17. I bet Glenwood retreads a flank at hooker and that player will compete for selection, they always do…..

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  18. @beet: I rate Febana very highly and would place him ahead of Mthembu and Prinsloo (who I think would benefit from another year – he already has a provincial contract).

    I also think that Ntuli (DHS) has to be in the mix in a big way. DHS will definitely be the team to watch this year (providing the coaching is up to scratch). they have some really good players in Simpson, Febana, Ntuli and Ndabendaba.

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  19. Not sure why the private’s would be favourites, the gov schools are the only ones who really test themselves vs the best like Affies, Grey Bloem, Monnas etc….for experience I would pick the gov schools side everytime…

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  20. @Pedantic: Thanks for that! Lots of talk about Nicholson in that thread – I trust he is still in the mix? Had a quiet season this year – can’t say I heard much on him?

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  21. @Grasshopper: in most seasons Govt Schools would probably be favourites. For 2015 though the Privates are able to put together quite a handy starting line-up.

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  22. @beet: I think the Glenwood back 3 are going to be pretty good, plenty pace. They now just need a pack to supply the ball. Any thoughts on the monster Under15 lock Van der Mescht? He will be Under16 next year and probably close to 2m by then…..maybe KZN’s first really big lock by matric..

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  23. @Grasshopper: I’m not sure about first big lock. Alistair Hargreaves, Cameron Lindsay and Mike Rhodes were all around 2m at CW. Rhodes is probably a little under but certainly heavier than the other two but certainly no Paul Willemse’s at 2m and 130kg+ at CW.

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  24. @Pedantic: Thanks for the link. A real blast from the past. I forgot how vocal I was back then. Definitely have calmed down over the years :mrgreen: . You also mentioned that Kevin Smit would be one to watch over the next 2 years and so seem to be on the money with that prediction(although I don’t think you envisaged the current move at play.) I think Westville might move Muller to 8th man which means that a lock position will have to be filled. Better get the home fires burning :lol:

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  25. @star: It’s a pity Kevin’s name is being bandied about for the wrong reasons – he is a seriously good player!

    Another “unknown” named in that post was the Westville wing Wheeler – he must surely be looking at either the 13 or 14 jersey for Ville in 2015?

    Something common I noticed about the names in that post that seemed to have faded off the radar – girlfriends! :mrgreen:

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  26. @Grasshopper: I’ve watched JJvdM play a few times and he is impressive. Bash rugby is big in SA and the obvious tendency for any big kid is to tuck the ball and run over opponents which tends to stunt their skills development a bit. With KZN boys generally being smaller than most other regions in SA, I imagine a big player is probably more susceptible too this however this youngster it really seems like he is working on his skills. He looks for space and he looks to distribute from what I’ve seen. He also has decent pace for a big player. The future looks bright for him.

    If he keeps that pace there is no reason why he shouldn’t stay at no.8 for the rest of his school career. No.8 at SBR still offers the best opportunity for a player to make an impression on the SBR field IMO. And many scouts/recruiters tend to judge players more on what they bring to the party as attacking players rather than their defensive capabilities.

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  27. @Pedantic: It looks like Wheeler might get the nod at 13 for the 2015 season.

    The reason KS is news is because he is a seriously good player. An avg player probably would not have drawn any attention at all.

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  28. @Pedantic: I thought Wheeler was in his final year this year? He must be a certainty on the wing for Ville. Another one of those players who’s work ethic has brought him through – worked very hard on his game and reaped the rewards.

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  29. @beet: Also notice you have Dixon at lock? I would have thought he might make the move to the back row in 2015 where is ample ball skills and physical presence at the breakdown could be better exploited?

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  30. @beet: Am I correct on assuming that this is an ‘invitation side’ made up of boys asked if they would be available ( and if their parents would be prepared to pay for their sons to go on the tour ) ?

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  31. @GreenBlooded: Yes Dixon another very good example of a player who’s impact could be maximised as no.8 or even as a flank. Schramm was same for Kearsney. Played lock for a while and then moved to no.8

    I was forced into best fit in my team Pvt Sch selection above. Sadiki could be the lock as well I guess. I stuck with their latest played in position where possible.

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  32. @Far Meadows: I really don’t anything about the Sevens team selection process. This might have been mentioned to me in passing but it did not stick.

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  33. Eish, off topic, but I saw a Kearsney mini bus in our estate in Tinley Manor now. Does that pick up day boys everyday? That is one serious trip to get to school or does it just pick up & drop off boarders? Kearsney looking far and wide….

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  34. @oldschool: Don’t you touch me on my tow-truck … I karrent afford the drive there, let alone to live there.

    @Grasshopper: Possibly matric exam arrangements. Same happens at College, matric boarders go home between exams where possible, there are just lots of lift clubs going.

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  35. @Gungets Tuft: We desperately need some proper schools up in Ballito, not these Curro’s, Ashton’s and Trinityhouses….proper single sex schools with traditional values and ethos. Why can’t one of the big 8 start a satellite school up here…….

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  36. @Grasshopper: Eeeisch, your choice of words. Curro, Ashton etc are proper schools, in fact many people would say they were proper schools in more ways than the traditional boys schools. Perhaps not our choice but they serve a great purpose nonetheless, and they will come into their own, sports wise (which is what I assume yuo mean) soon enough. Crawford La Lucia are making strides with swimming and hockey (with a poaching effort that would make the traditionals weep), and are ripping the guts out of the girls schools in Durban North. Promises of literally “we will subsidise the full amount of the XXXXXXXX school fees and bursary”. Its dire …

    I actually don’t know that the traditional “single sex” school would do that well on the North coast, not for a while yet. I reckon the population is too small and the private school mindset part of the culture …

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  37. Clearly no quotas in this sevens team. Interesting to see the reaction of the overseas teams who are expecting to play against Zulus :lol:

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  38. @star: Been to a few Westville pre season runs and it looks like there are circa 6 to 7 u16a players that are in the reckoning for a possible spot in the match 15. You also have last years lock from Hudson park occupying the number 8 slot. Known as “Fudge” to the boys. Good option! Strong, mobile and I think fits the “link” mould very nicely. I think Westville is in for some interesting times in the coming months. Some positions are locked down, but with KS in the Glenwood fold now, I think a few surprises might be on the cards. The youngster up from u16 are looking very strong and are up for the challenge.

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  39. @Rhino_67: I have always been a huge fan of this current U16 team. But we must not forget that the 2nd team was most probably the best in KZN this year and a lot of them are back. 4 of the tight 5 alone and 4 or 5 in the backline. With regard to the youngsters I have only one certainty in the backline( Tony). As follows
    SH Kitching
    FH Van Rooyen
    Centers- Wheeler/Strydom/Shange
    Wings- Tony/Mhlamvu
    FB- Ball
    In the pack I think with Els/Prinsloo or Lee/Stoltz you have probably the most formidable front row in KZN. Prinsloo has X- factor written all over him but he will not have it all his own way. Lee has proven himself at this level in a dominant 2nd team pack and I think would have had a few appearances for the Ist team. I do think that Fudge is the ideal lock to support this great front row and so if he is to play at 8 then his replacement has a lot to live up to. The other U16 I would have is JP who is a great ball carrier and would compliment Fudge and Nicholson well. A few of the cricketers are yet to make an appearance at the preseason runs . There is nothing like a bit of competition and depth which will be required given our schedule next year.

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  40. @star: Potential there for a formidable tight 5 and I have to agree Fudge should be in the 2nd row to bolster that, there is so much depth in the back row position and those U16 loosies have also been impressive.

    That midfield is going to be a handful both in attack and defence.

    Is Shaun Bell still in the mix? He went very close to GK selection in 2013, also Matt Couch ?

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  41. @star: i think quietly there is a great spirit growing in this years westville potential 1st team . Most of these players have played together since grade 8 as well as playing club . Physically boys have matured and grown and i think that if the backline combinations are sorted early , their is a huge potential that with their size and ability , they will be very strong this year. Shane b looks to be at 15 .

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  42. @star: I think that the MHS 2nds might disagree with you on who was the best 2nd XV this season .

    They played 15
    Won 12
    Drew 1 ( vs Piet Retief 1sts )
    Lost 2 ( vs Glenwood 24-22 & Affies 30-18 )

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  43. @GreenBlooded: Boulle is being touted as a possible flyhalf, but I am not sure that that is where he sees himself. The boys have December to bulk a bit more and early next year will tell us a lot more.
    Hoskins has unfortunately been out of the equation for a while but this could be as a result of his involvement with Waterpolo?
    @Pedantic – I am sure they are looking hard at JP Pelser in the locking postion, with Muller as his most likely partner and he certainly is a strong youngster – with potentially 3 years in Westville’s 1st 15. The U16 loosies have been working really hard and all are really solid units now. Both Grant and Heyneke are in the mix.Exciting times for Westville I hope.

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  44. @Pedantic: I think it was you that brought up the girlfriend issue :mrgreen: I would like to think that Couch will be in the set-up next year. I actually joked with Bell about a comeback as he is looking strong. A question of priorities I guess. There has been talk about Els and Prinsloo but not much about Stoltz who is actually the incumbent tighthead from the 2013 GK team. ( and it is not as though he has gone backwards in terms of physical development).
    @ Far Meadows- Westville only lost 1 game and that was by a point or 2 to you guys away on Meadows. I have great respect for your 2nd team ( and 3rd team) for 2 years now as they have given us as hard a time as any. More is the pity that we will not be playing each other next year .

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  45. @Rhino_67: Boulle is a complete natural and will fit into any backline position with ease. Hosken has traditionally been a 9, but he was put into the 10 berth in the DRSU team a year or 2 back and it was a revelation! Great distribution, great at reading the game and choosing the options. If I were to pick a weakness for him at 10 it would probably be his boot. There is also Dakota Pienaar – who I’ve known since he was a nuggety 9 year old. Also a natural talent who may come into the mix next season. Nature has been cruel to him – his natural talent and massive heart has not been matched by a decent sized chassis – the boy just hasn’t grown. Actually the more I think about it – 2015 and 2016 are going to be good years for Ville.

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  46. @star: Prinsloo can also cover the back row positions but I guess there are too many options already for those berths? Another back row player that just sprung to mind – Alex Weldon??

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  47. Can any Glenwood blogger post a potential team for 2015. I will have a stab but am not close enough to know the details…

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  48. 1. Blessing Thole (prop)
    2. Dagon Horack (prop)
    3. Christopher Klopper (prop)
    4. Jason Gilby (hooker)
    5. Tristan Stewart (hooker)
    6. Rudi Cohen (hooker)
    7. Handdre Viktor (lock)
    8. K Blose (lock)
    9. N. Xaba (lock)
    10. Marco Palvie (no8)
    11. Jordan Du Preez (scrumhalf)
    12. Murray Hand (10)
    13. Ruan Van Rensburg (12)
    14. Donovan Du Randt (13)
    15. Jayden Morgan (15)
    16. Ilunga Mukendi (14)
    17. Colin Brunsdon (12)
    18. Calvin Greenslade (12)
    19. Charlie Severs (9)
    20. Jerome Bossr (10)

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  49. @GreenBlooded: Prinsloo’s biggest area that needs attention is his workrate – not enouigh hard graft in the less glamorous areas of the park. I watched him the whole of last year and he ceratinly is a strong boy but tends to stand around and pick his opportunities too much of the time. Can be an individual player but as the year progressed, that did improve.

    Alex Wheldon is still in the mix, but more likely for 2016 at lock. A great lineout jumper who with a good conditioning program can address many of his perceived shortcomings in my eyes.

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  50. @Rhino_67: That’s odd – in the club rugby season he is like a Duracell Bunny in terms of work rate. But now that you mention it, the only school match I saw him in this season was against Kearsney where he did seem a bit lethargic. Perhaps he prepares differently for school matches? :wink:

    Again – and to my mind, the only problem I have with him is his throwing which is erratic at best. Weldon – eesh. A better lineout man you will not find, and gives it horns in general play. Another of my junior proteges – known him since U7 or U8 I think. Glad he is doing so well……..

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  51. @Grasshopper: You forgot K Smit.
    @ GB- you seem to have a greater personal connection to the Westville players than any other school. Maybe a bit of support in 2015 will be warranted. :lol:
    @ GT- I actually thought it was very strange that a boy without a first team cap is the captain.( you surely have to do your time irrespective of highly regarded you are) Wagner the w/k would be a fine choice for me.

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  52. Who will be the best sportsman allrounder in KZN open age group next season – cricket/rugby?

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  53. @star: Coached junior rugby at Hillcrest Villagers since about 2004/2005 and many of the boys I’ve coached over the years have ended up at Westville. I’ve supported them as players and followed their progress ever since – as I have with all the boys I’ve coached.

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  54. @beet: If we are talking Rugby / Cricket doubles then I guess Bossr (GW) and Dixon (KC) are the ones that jump out first. Must be a few Waterpolo and Hockey guys in the mix too…….

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  55. @Grasshopper: He is Westville boy that has moved to GW for grade 12. He has a good chance at CW( 1OOkg fetcher) and is probably one of the finest goal kickers in KZN.

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  56. @beet: Jean De Wet from College plays First 11 and ran out a few times from the bench for the First 15 as well this year. Could well be the firsts #10 this year.

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  57. @Gungets Tuft: Think we need to classify this to compare apples with apples:

    1. Cricket / Rugby
    2. Cricket / Hockey
    3. Waterpolo / Rugby
    4. Waterpolo / Hockey

    Seems all 3 nominations so far are in category 1……

    Category 4 just seems odd.

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  58. In Category 2 ( cricket / hockey ) , Cameron Macaskill from MHS played SA Schools hockey this year and was a regular in the 1X1 cricket side , he will be back in 2015.

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  59. @beet: James Tedder – Played 1st XI since Grade 9 and played full season 1st XV & 1st 7’s.

    Maybe you should add academics to the mix for a real all rounder.

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  60. What about soccer and the full house ie Cricket ,rugby and soccer( all the major sports)? Surely that will be the real contender.

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  61. @star: Soccer…… :evil: :evil: In my day – that was a game that was played by kids in primary school. When you got to high school you played the proper sport – rugby. Soccer wasn’t even an option. If I had my way it would still be like that…….. :mrgreen:

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  62. @GreenBlooded: De Wet – Cricket and Rugby

    Small – Hockey / Cricket – there will probably be a few more this year.
    Forrest might also be a Cat 2.

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  63. @GreenBlooded: I always thought a full house would beat a double :mrgreen: In all seriousness when Westville played Kearsney soccer 30 teams were put out which equates to 660 boys playing. (A lot more than rugby and cricket and almost double hockey.) Numbers equals competition and therefore credit has to be given to the World game irrespective of our personal stance :oops:

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  64. Andile P must be the last proper double, not too sure who was before him in KZN….

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  65. @GreenBlooded: me too, soccer is for clubs, leave it there. I remember is standard 5 champing at the bit to play rugga at high school, got bored of being the goalkeeper….haha!

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  66. @Gungets Tuft: I thought it was him. Every decade or so you get a freak! AB de Villiers is one, Jonty Rhodes, Errol Stewart, Madsens, Greg Nicol etc etc

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  67. @star: Problem I have with soccer in schools – there are no decent role models for the kids to look up to. Without re-quoting the old cliche about hooligans and gentlemen – the top tier soccer players in the world have to be the worst possible examples to the youth. Grossly overpaid low class rubbish – the vast majority of them. Diego Maradonna!! Seriously??? But for the ability to kick a round ball better than the average person – what would these okes be in life? Tow truck drivers (sorry GT 8-O ) or rubbish collectors. Luis Suarez!! You’ve got to be kidding me!! Is that what we want our boys to aspire to? If you can’t beat ’em, eat ’em??? How can these okes hold a candle to the likes of John Smit, Jean de Villiers, John Eales, Richie McCaw. Yes I know this is generalising, but for every decent human in the round ball game, I’ll show you 500 louts. If I had to ever see a school-boy pull his shirt over his head and run around like a lunatic after scoring a goal, or rush the referee after a bad call I think it would make me de-clutch and just give up. Wayne Rooney?? Eric Cantona?? Nee man…..

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  68. @GreenBlooded: Yussus man, cut me, think I don’t bleed ??

    But the contrarian in me looked for the exception that might test the rule, and came up empty of role models. Rugby has it’s fair shame of scum balls but there are more than enough solid citizens to make your case.

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  69. Glenwood Old Boys Dylan Sheppherd & Ryan Botha are not bad examples of football players, but not in the same ilk as the rugga guys…

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  70. @Grasshopper: Sorry for the late reply – some adjustments to your line up:
    Horack is no longer at Glenwood
    Hand is in matric this year
    Greenslade can no longer play rugby after a major knee injury last year

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  71. @Grasshopper: Must add Bryce Tullis to the current list of all rounders. 1st Cricket and Hockey, Head Boy and will probably get 7 A’s for Matric. In line for Dux but has some stern competition there.

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  72. Heard via the grapevine, Kaide Pardey is off to Kearsney! Huge scalp there for Kearsney and loss for Westville & Glenwood. Massive talent there…

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  73. @Grasshopper:
    Even though this sounds remarkably similar to the case debated a few weeks back, I am going to assume that this is for the 2016 intake or that your sources are blowing smoke. You see, we were assured a few weeks back that Kearsney do not do 11th hour recruiting of rugby players. We were told in no uncertain terms that Kearsney scholarships are done and dusted by APRIL/MAY and it is now the END OF NOVEMBER.

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  74. @Grasshopper: An excellent acquisition – looks to be an all rounder with a lot of scope for the future.

    From what I hear, the 2015 intake will be a good one … as usual :mrgreen:

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  75. @Pedantic: Yes, and in all honesty what parent would say no to a bursary at Kearsney, none! So it’s a no brainer for the kid and his parents. A huge loss to Glenwood seeing that his father Leighton made Natal Schools in 1992 and his uncle Barrett made SA Academy in 1995, both props. Barrett still holds a few shot-put and discus records at Glenwood. They were physically way ahead of their peers and it seems Kaide is too.

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  76. @Grasshopper: He’s built like a #8 and plays like one but is very effective at tighthead also … apple doesn’t fall too far from the tree.

    I think the decision was between Westville & KC, not sure why they weren’t looking at GW.

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  77. @Pedantic: Leighton was my prefect I had to skivvy for, I was petrified of him. Absolute giant of a schoolboy, probably around 125kg back in 1992. He played with the late Paul de Bruyn from DHS in that Natal Schools front row and Paul was even larger!

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  78. @Greenwood: read above. His family all went to Glenwood and he attends Westville Senior Primary, so a natural move would be to either of these schools but heading up the hill…

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  79. @Pedantic:

    “Our” earlier debate? Don’t see one post from me there. Anyway – it must have been the best kept secret. As I stated before – I heard about it during a 4th term cricket match at KSP.

    No arguments this time though – it’s definitely not April or May. The humidity tells me that. If the 2013 boy was 11th hour, then I guess this case is 11th hour 50th minute. I’ll leave 10 minutes grace in case any further rugger players get recruited between now and the first school day of 2016. :mrgreen: :roll:

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  80. @Grasshopper: besides his obvious rugby talent , he is also a great kid to have in a team , he knuckles down and gets stuck in , kearsney are very chuffed to have got him and I am lead to believe that the folks and the boy are chuffed that he is coming ….so smiles all around !!

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  81. @oldschool: Yes, glad all are happy. Just a pity a long tradition of being in the green has ended. The reality of modern SA is that parents ultimately want their sons and daughters in private schools writing IEB exams and if they can get in with their sporting talent then good on them. This is how the private’s compete in sport with small numbers, they have their pick of the elite. Kaide’s bio; http://highwaymail.co.za/171754/kaide-is-an-unstoppable-force-2/

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  82. @oldschool: Just to add, I bet Kearsney have the first say on the KZN Primary Schools players in all sports, then MHS, Hilton and lastly the Gov schools get the ‘scraps’ so to speak. No wonder Gov schools are looking in places like Pretoria for talent as the pools there are far bigger and usually the talent is even better than in KZN. Gov Schools have it very tough, I don’t blame them recruiting at grade 8, go for it for the survival of the school.

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  83. @Grasshopper: IMO that’s a big misconception.

    Take a look at the 2010 KZN U13 CW team (the age group that will be playing 1sts next year).

    Also illustrates how many go missing along the way …

    WG Bekker Jeandre ??
    WG Dlomo Zibusiso ??
    UB Mcoyi Lungi ??
    FL Mnyandu Thandi ??
    LK Sithole Sanele ??
    PR Thomas Joshua ??
    FH van Wyk Schalk ??
    UB Madonda N College
    HK Swanepoel Sam College
    #8 Staples Brandon College / Glenwood
    FB Moletshe Lwazi DHS
    UB Ngwenya Mzizi DHS
    LK Peters JJ DHS
    CT Brunsdon Colin Glenwood
    LK Xaba Kwenama Glenwood
    HK Rust Daniel Grey Bloem
    SH Dahl Matt Hiton
    FL Wiseman Matt MHS
    HK Mthembu Beast Northwood
    SH Khalishwayo Siya Piet Retief
    PR Erasmus Franco Port Natal
    CT Rossouw Dexton Westville / Gelofte

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  84. @Pedantic: Yep, but look at the Kearsney intake in the past 3 years, mostly KZN schools players. DHS got quite a few too.

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  85. @Grasshopper: {shrug} .. perhaps ou Umbiloburger is close enough to the school to drop names of the U14A and U14B teams here so we can see who played U13 representative rugby. I suspect it a big number and will refute the irresistable pull of the private schools.

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  86. @Gungets Tuft: Oh yes, even met with a senior rep at Glenwood so they could state their case. To be honest he was very fair and open to my grievances. I emailed him back afterwards but not heard back since. I think they were just trying to quieten me up a little, ain’t going to work if they continue to do dodgy things.

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  87. @Grasshopper: I’m not sure about Kearsney but I think that you are wrong about the privates getting the pick of the primary schools provincial reps. My info is anecdotal and probably a bit dated but my recollection of a few years back was that they were all being offerred scholarships by Glenwood. MHS only award a couple of partial sports scholarships a year and they are not (unless things have changed). I can’t remember a year when there were more than a couple of U13 provincial reps at U14 level. What is more interesting, and a part of the rationale for not dishing out rugby scholarships bsed on U13 achievements, is how often the U14 stars don’t feature by the time they get to U18. The vast majority of boys going to MHS (and Hilton) come out of traditional feeder schools like Cordwalles and Clifton Notties as well as the JHB prep schools like the Ridge and Pridwin.

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  88. @Pedantic: Its is quite interesting that Fullback: Lwazi Moetletshe was in the U13 Craven Week side in 2010, yet he was playing DHS u16A in 2014 and to make matters worse, he represented DRSU Duikers @u15 level this year. The question begs around the “over aged” players again.

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  89. @Rhino_67: He played two years of U13 CW and then GK this year, so one would guess he is U16 in 2014, but he is in fact Under 15.

    It does seem strange:

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  90. @meadows: well 4 or more if the best sportsman from the Bluff in my primary school years ended up at Kearsney, they certainly were not paying for it. MHS & Hilton are different, old school cash. Also with unlimited cash comes unlimited coaching, training, gear and nutrition, those kids automatically have a slight advantage. What they might not have is the mongrel in them, something that a harder life can bring. Obviously this is a generalization and doesn’t apply to all, many kids get academic scholarships from lesser schools. Point is if there is a bursary given out by a private school it is usually for the cream….also many bursaries are hidden back handers, unanimous payments etc….

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  91. @Grasshopper: Wouldn’t you say that applies to a lot of government schools as well nowadays?
    …unlimited funding, backhand funders, getting the cream…etc…definitely not a phenomenon exclusive to the privates.

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  92. @Playa: Yep they are, but let’s ask you what you would take, 100% bursary to Kearsney or 120% bursary to Glenwood?

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  93. I don’t think there is a school anywhere in the world who’s new intake is under as much scrutiny as those on the corner of Nicholson and McDonald Rd.

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  94. @Grasshopper: I’m not sure how you evaluate who the cream will turn out to be at U13.

    A guy like Pat Lambie arrived at MHS as more of a cricketer than a rugby player when he was U14 in 2004 – a year incidentally when Glenwood were able to field an U14 side made up almost entirely of U13 provincial players and probably inflicted heavy defeats on most of their local opposition (MHS had one U13 CW rep that year in Awande Khumalo) including MHS who I know copped a big hiding. At the time what was most noticeable was the size discrepancy.

    What is more interesting to me is how that gap narrowed over the following five years to the extent that in their matric year in 2008 they played to a 24 all draw and both groups provided 6 players to the KZN Craven Week side.

    Glenwood had an outstanding side that year so it can certainly be argued that their recruitment in 2004 paid dividends although I have no idea if the group was supplemented along the way. Obviously there would have been a few U17’s in the open group in 2008 as well.

    Irrelevant as it may be to performance at school level it is significant that the “later developers” in that MHS group mostly kicked on into senior rugby. Pat Lambie, Ruan Combrinck, Robert de Bruyn, Pat Howard and Cameron Lindsay have all played at least senior Currie Cup. Others like Louis Albertse played Vodacom Cup and is now playing in France. Reef Nakin played U19-21 at the Sharks and a few have played Varsity Cup (Tatham, Strachan). MHS’s sole U13 CW recruit did play both Grant Khomo and Craven Week but didn’t progress beyond Varsity rugby post school.

    Of the Glenwood side I’m aware that Frans Kleynhans has played senior rugby as I think has JR Jenkinson at the Leopards. I stand corrected but others, including SA Schools rep Sean Malton (who was an outstanding schoolboy player) haven’t progressed out of the U19-21 ranks.

    I realise that this example is anecdotal and may well be an anomaly but to my mind it illustrates that U13 rugby performance is not a reliable predictor of future ability and illustrates the flaw in a system that requires selection from U16 on to be on the pro recruiters radar.

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  95. @meadows: I think Malton now plies his trade at a second division English club – maybe Nottingham??? He’s a great example that kids are not even made at u18 level, as hookers in his age group who achieved far less at SBR level have outperformed him since leaving school.

    Nevertheless his school achievements were outstanding and take nothing away from him – he was definitely one of the best in his age group once upon a time.

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  96. @beet: Agreed – U18 is only the start. The problem I have is that unless you are firmly in the frame at that stage your prospects of playing senior rugby are negligible. Varsity Cup is well intentioned as a concept but seems to have become more of a competition for younger professionals who are already in the system than a vehicle to unearth late developers. I know that they have tightened up on the qualification criteria but all that seems to have done is make sure that the varsity’s that have good relationships with the franchises secure the services of eligible youngsters who would rather play Varsity Cup than Vodacom Cup. Much bigger crowds, better coverage and no quotas.

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  97. @GreenBlooded:@Grasshopper: WRT Glenwood it is obvious that there is a place in the market for a school rugby academy in terms of demand to meet the supply BUT I can’t help but believe that this will eventually price them out of the KZN market IF their local rivals are not prepared to follow. Then again it really does not make sense for all schools in a region to have rugby academies – you only need one per region.

    It seems like one of Glenwood’s 2015 fixtures will be an A&B team only trip down to Port Elizabeth. This might be a sign of things to come. Fewer teams, more travel to find suitable rivals. It’s not really the path any traditional boys school wants to follow and Glenwood very much still is a traditional boys school but at this stage it looks inevitable.

    Ideally KZN needs to work towards retaining a strong competitive local league which offers opportunities for all rugby players – that is still the best arrangement. The last thing you want is a 2nd XV capable of beating the 1sts of what used to be top derby rival. Achieving balance between schools is easier said than done though. Schools see rugby as a means to achieving a bigger goal, which is to continue to be recognised as a first class all round institution. With that much competition around to stay ahead, the last thing any one school really wants to do is give a rival a break by recognising and supporting a framework of spreading the love by seeing the value of a keeping the playing fields even – the natural instinct of those running schools is do all in their power to be better than the rest.

    What the Glenwood rugby academy threatens to do is turn KZN into a Free State like module, where you have one super powerful rugby school that attracts the best rugby players and dominates nationally while people struggling to remember the names of next 5-6 best rugby schools in the region, who would all struggle to keep up the powerhouse’s 2nd XV.

    The Glenwood headmaster has a plan and seems very sure of where he wants to take Glenwood as far as rugby is concerned. He constantly comes across as being the strongest of the leaders in KZN. Many other heads seem a lot less sure of where they feel rugby fits into the big picture. It’s really up to all these other heads now to decide on an extreme course of action. I honestly think that not doing anything to change the way SBR operates in KZN is the most extreme decision they can make. It will no doubt in my mind lead to the creation of a Grey Bloem type powerhouse rugby school.

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  98. @beet: well it seems that is exactly what TK wants, to compete with Grey Bloem in all sports. He said loud and clear he wants Glenwood to produce Boks, Proteas, Rhodes scholars etc as he believes the only way to survive is to be the best. However by taking this route means he has had to do some dodgy deals in the process and take the flak. Hopefully he has a master plan that doesn’t leave Glenwood with no opposition!

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  99. @beet: The view below is general, and not an effort at picking on Glenwood.

    The trouble is Grey Bloem didn’t have to go around snatching players from all over the place, and from their rivals, which is what is happening now. Why not plug in the funds used to buy schoolboys into coaching and development…something not lacking at Glenwood for example, as they have a top notch academy. The good kids will want to go there. Another thing GW isn’t short of.

    TK has a plan for sure, and we have been told countless times that he is not stupid. Smart people, when under pressure tend to use short term solutions for long term goals. Grey Bloem was not always the top dog in SBR, they went through a process that even today, they are still an attractive place to be for young, aspiring sportsmen.

    Nothing wrong with wanting to be the best and putting things in place to get there. Never mind the fact that it pi$$es off traditional rivals, and that it is deemed unfair practice by some quarters…it is the sustainability of it that should worry Glenwood (and other schools following a similar route) supporters. Then again I am not in the know, maybe there is a contingency plan in place that will take care of sustainability.

    I once made reference to the Southern Methodist University (SMU) Mustangs scandal that blew up in the 80s. I don’t have a crystal ball, but there is something very similar about this method. And that programme wasn’t run by stupid people either.

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  100. @Playa: that is why I have expressed my concern many times, it’s going to only end up messy. Sometimes you need to take a breather, consider what has happened, review things and potentially go in a different direction. I don’t think Glenwood have done this yet…why? I don’t know….

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  101. @Playa: I guess the key difference is in the approach to enforcement of transgressions in College football. SMU was about illegal payments in a strictly amateur sport, notwithstanding the highly professional coaching set ups, playing to bigger crowds than the NFL, tv coverage and prize money.

    SMU were effectively banned for a few years if memory serves and their football program destroyed. They have never made it back to the lofty heights they enjoyed back then. i understand that SARFU have a prohibition on schoolboys being contracted. I’m sure it is happening and schools are complicit.
    The only question is whether anyone in authority here would have the balls to enforce the appropriate sanctions if illicit payments were being made remembering that in the SMU example funds were being paid by outside benefactors. SMU’s crime was that they knew about and were complicit.

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  102. @meadows: You are very correct. In fact one would say that what is happening in SBR is not even a transgression because there is no enforcement against anything. Bar of course, the contracting of schoolboys. Even that can be debated…remember the Bulls-WP fight over Handre Pollard?

    We are already seeing the payments (illegal???), tv coverage, crowds bigger than most Vodacom Cup/Currie Cup games, prize money (FNB Classic clashes)…now we have a handful of schools who are taking these professional traits a notch higher. SMU were banding the rules at first,but still within them, then greed and ambition of a few benefactors (alumni/old boys) let things go too far. Sound familiar to what is going on with *name of school(s) here*?

    The death penalty imposed on SMU was enforced by the authorities. The death penalty that will be imposed on these schools will be by other schools. We are already seeing that happening.

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  103. @meadows: @Playa: It sort of touches on the direction I would like to see things moving in. No one wants to see fixtures cancelled or hear about the unhappiness that exists behind the scenes because this school is doing that. A set of rules for all to follow that have the best interests of SBR at heart would be great. That offers a school the opportunity to be the best they can or want to be within limitations.

    It’s not easy though. SA has some unique political/social/economic circumstances suggesting to me that if the bar is not set high enough, it could result in failure down the line.

    I spoke to a Durban rugby club official a few years back about spreading the talent around so that the league remained competitive. He said that although it sounded like a good idea when it was in practice it did not work well. It benefited the lazy clubs who did not deserve to be successful based on their approach while his club who had worked hard to acquire good sponsors and run a feasible operation were adversely impacted.

    I know a school like Glenwood feels its their proactive approach that has made the school a success and to honest in the early 1990’s if you had to nominate a Durban Metro school that were most likely to fall off the pace come the 2010’s, Glenwood might have been a consideration. Yet here they are today thriving.

    It’s really up to the other KZN schools now to either push for new rules and I’m talking specific to imports and rugby academies which are the bones of contention or to accept that in order for Glenwood to achieve its goal of matching GCB, the gap between themselves and local rivals will have to grow. The latter is possibly acceptable if it does not impact on the quality of players other local schools attract but should be a worry, the best local players who once saw other local schools as an equal opportunity, start to feel that they need to get into Glenwood and as a result the standard of rugby amongst the other schools declines.

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  104. @beet: @Playa: There have been attempts, it seems, through some of the forums available to regulate contentious issues with some modest success. If the body of headmasters agree collectively on a set of regulations then it is within their power to collectively enforce contraventions – cancel the fixture with an offender.

    I don’t believe that many schools can have issues with others choosing to improve the standards of their sports programs – quality coaching, conditioning and even aggressive recruitment and scouting at Grade 8 are IMO acceptable. The contentious issues are “poaching” after grade 10, turning a blind eye to or even encouraging steriod abuse, overage players etc.

    How difficult can it be to regulate that? If those activities are deemed unacceptable and the rules are then broken by any school then the school should be sanctioned just as SMU were. Cancel the fixtures and the effect on any transgressor will be the same.

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  105. @beet: @meadows: I am not a fan of ‘spreading the talent’. We are not a communist country after all…or we believe we aren’t. That said, recruitment is not a new phenomenon. It has been happening for decades.

    To be the best is what every school (should) strive for. But I cannot agree with a plan of becoming the best by weakening your competitor. That to me is tantamount to plagiarism. A manager that aspires to be a director, cannot present his employees’ work as his own in order to get the accolade. Sure, if the work presented is good enough to get him there, he will get there, but you and I will know that he doesn’t deserve it. By all means try and get to GCB’s level, and if that means being ahead of your local rivals, so be it. But to deliberately weaken others to gain, spits in the face of your achievement.

    I followed the rise of Glenwood in the early 2000s with interest, and admittedly a certain sense of pride in seeing a school whose rugby was considered to be in the doldrums pick itself up so much. In a way it gave me hope for Dale rugby which was falling apart at the same time. Lead the pack by all means, but if your only way of leading the pack is by weakening the other 19 teams in the top 20, I cannot respect you.

    Meadows – If I am not mistaken, the KZN HM agreement was an attempt at regulating such recruitment, by discouraging recruitment after grade 10. Now we have a situation of rule bending with recruitment of boys in June of their grade 10 year. This is technically legal in terms of the agreement, but maybe ‘morally illegal’ in some people’s view. In my view, a collective body needs to govern this…something like a SA HM agreement, and with broader sanctions. Penalties as stiff as a death penalty for a season for being bust with overage players or players who use steroids.

    Agreements between the participating schools to:
    1. Not poach from rivals – locally and nationally
    2. An interest to move must be communicated by the parents first to the school. This is standard even when a kid moves for other non-sport reasons. No obligation to say where they’re going. A HM, upon receiving an application, needs to contact the HM of the other school to avoid misunderstandings. (Kids in Grade 10 up)
    3. No school can approach any kid on a bursary or scholarship regardless of grade. If it is the parent’s decision to approach a school, evidence should be presented to the school losing out, and all monies spent on the kid must be fully re-imbursed with interest.

    Appropriate punishment to be prescribed for failing to comply with the different regulations.

    Of course, there will be smart a$$es who will find loopholes, and those can be dealt with until such point where a binding constitution can be drafted.

    As you said it can’t be difficult to regulate this. There is just a lack of balls to do so.

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  106. After Friday night – I see the Zulus are through to the Semi finals – 3 of the 4 teams in the semis are S African – only the French U18 not home grown.

    Good luck Tristan

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  107. Sad luck 0 went down to France in the finals. Any feedback on performances yet Pedantic?

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  108. @Rugger fan: No real feedback on individuals but we can be assured that MHS will once again be a force to be reckoned with in 2015 – the boys who went on this tour have sublime skills – every year their boys seem to peak at the right time!

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