Westville coached by Old Boy and former KZN Craven Week star Njabulo Zulu moved, up their preseason preparations with an impressive 34-12 win against Glenwood. With time on their side, things are looking positive in the Griffins camp ahead of the eagerly anticipated home field regular season opener against Michaelhouse. Expect a big crowd for that match!
| DATE | VENUE | WESTVILLE RESULTS | ||||
| 01Jun13 | Westville | WON | Westville | 21 | 17 | Michaelhouse |
| 26Apr14 | Michaelhouse | LOST | Westville | 32 | 34 | Michaelhouse |
| 04Jun16 | Westville | WON | Westville | 20 | 3 | Michaelhouse |
| 18Mar17 | Michaelhouse | LOST | Westville | 18 | 24 | Michaelhouse |
| 17Mar18 | Westville | WON | Westville | 31 | 20 | Michaelhouse |
| 27Apr19 | Michaelhouse | LOST | Westville | 20 | 31 | Michaelhouse |
| 15May21 | Westville | WON | Westville | 17 | 10 | Michaelhouse |
| 04Jun22 | Westville | LOST | Westville | 21 | 31 | Michaelhouse |
| 10Jun23 | Michaelhouse | LOST | Westville | 22 | 36 | Michaelhouse |
Glenwood headed into 2024 with much lower expectations of success. It could be a difficult year ahead. There will be a lot of work this week for coach Derek Heiberg and his assistants to get the team ready for the neutral field battle against Welkom Gymnasium in Bethlehem. Welkom Gim come off a bit of let down effort in the 52-5 defeat to Grey College, so will also be looking for huge improvements. The Kovies Liga 2023 champions are however battle-hardened with two proper matches under belt and will be favourites to beat Glenwood in that encounter. In 2023 Glenwood beat Welkom Gim 17-16 at the Absa Wildeklawer tournament in Kimberley.
| TEAM | WESTVILLE | TEAM | GLENWOOD | ||
| 1 | Akhona Maseko | 1 | Lonwabo Nkaltshana | ||
| 2 | Ross Calvert | 2 | Martin Jr van Wyngaardt | ||
| 3 | Ezra Fleuriot | 3 | Kean Joseph | ||
| 4 | Rhys Mitchell | 4 | Tylo Madaat | ||
| 5 | Seth Gwyn | 5 | Kuhle Hadebe | ||
| 6 | Chris Cloete | 6 | Connor Barrows | ||
| 7 | Wandile Simelane | 7 | Yannick Mwamba | ||
| 8 | Oliver Gcina | 8 | Jordan Hargreaves | ||
| 9 | Ryan Pistor | 9 | Lian Lochnar | ||
| 10 | Unathi Mlotshwa | 10 | Kungawo Ncamazane | ||
| 11 | Jadrian Afrikaner | 11 | Lizwe Mtetwa | ||
| 12 | Blake Allbon | 12 | Sisiphiwo Dwayi | ||
| 13 | Michael Satade | 13 | Timothy Visagie | ||
| 14 | Evan Moolman | 14 | Thamsanqa Ngubane | ||
| 15 | Zekethelo Siyaya | 15 | Leo Weber | ||
| 16 | Langelihle Mncwango | 16 | Juan Viljoen | ||
| 17 | Jeshua Ferrera | 17 | |||
| 18 | Bandlie Mncwango | 18 | |||
| 19 | Henco Van Rensburh | 19 | |||
| 20 | David Humphries | 20 | |||
| 21 | Liam Simpkins | 21 | |||
| 22 | Jadewill Koopman | 22 | |||
| 23 | Sean McLoughlin | 23 | |||
| 24 | Karabo Mamiane | 24 | |||
| Coach | NJABULO ZULU | Coach | DEREK HEIBERG |
@KatzRugga (Comment #96)
I think Clifton has developed to a point where they have the potential to pull off an upset every so often, like their win over Kearsney a few years ago. But still some time needed for them to be competing weekly at Tier 1 level in my opinion. Continued exposure to tier 1 rugby will help.
@KatzRugga (Comment #96)
Not sure, the area around Clifton isn’t great and KZN is also not in a good state, most of SA are moving to Hermanus ;-)….
KZN TIER 1 SCHOOLS
Clifton. Is this a new phase and era where Clifton could become an established tier 1 rugby school?
Clifton has its own primary school. Last year their 1 and 2nd team beat DPHS. At the same time Clifton opened their boarding facilities.
How many primary school kids did they retain as a core? And where will this take their rugby program in years to come.
Good news for KZN rugby I would say
@beet (Comment #93)
Will Tony do that though.. Anything to beat Glenwood, he was like that when he was at Glenwood too, anything to beat DHS.
@beet (Comment #93)
That’s good to hear. It’s simple, no transfers without each Heads approval, open, clear and transparent. Teddy moving to DHS is a massive blow. It’s like losing Frans Malherbe or Kitshoff for the Boks. The schools are so close geographically and in terms of type of parent etc
@Grasshopper (Comment #87)
He is no longer the hold up but where I think he can help matters along is to come to an agreement with Pierre at Glenwood that the two schools will not entertain transfer requests by respective players to move from one school to the other and date the agreement with an expiry date for renewal so that if need be future heads are forced to abide by it.
@Ystervark (Comment #91)
Thanks, just checked and they’re in the same team. Will keep an eye out for him!
@Wyvern (Comment #90)
He’s played a couple for them (Espoirs u23) at the wing and one game at 13 I think.
@Pamos (Comment #83)
What team is he playing for at Racing? I follow the KC 8th man from 2022/23 (Shingi Manyarara) who starts at 8 for Racing’s u20s (I think) and haven’t seen Zuki’s name there recently.
2 things:
1. DPHS remains a strong rugby prep school, but the move up the North Coast by many families is diluting that. Umhlali (School in Salt Rock) rugby is on the rise as a result and going forward will be worth watching closely. Watch their results vs DPHS this year – it should already show the shift.
2. While all high schools fight to get the best talent into their schools – the idea of a high school like DHS already contracting and housing 12/13 year old boys and putting them through their final years of primary school seems a bit too much for me personally.
Isn’t this also what led to the DHS-Glenwood breakdown? Boys being funded by DHS already to attend a primary school nearby with the understanding to then enrol at DHs, and come the 1st day of school they were not there, but instead had gone to Glenwood?
@ForeverHorseFly (Comment #86)
Laying out the facts! Very valid, haha we are all part of the problem.
@ForeverHorseFly (Comment #86)
Please tell Pinheiro that! DHS and Glenwood need to end the silly feud and play against each other as it should be. The Grasshoppers will get a snot-klap from the Horseflies, but its’ swings and roundabouts. For a decade DHS didn’t have a chance. You letting a good opportunity go by whilst Glenwood is at a low, the Hoppers will be back. U13 level recruiting has been there from the start, that is fine. It’s the post grade 10 free for all that is a problem…
@Pamos (Comment #78)
Why should that be frightening though? High schools recruiting u13 boys to attend their high school for grade 8 is exactly what all high schools should be doing anyway.
Again this entire debate stems from everyone’s love of rugby and their own high school’s rugby fortunes. I doubt anyone here can tell me how many academic/cricket/waterpolo etc bursaries are given by any KZN school or from what primary schools those kids came from for u13 but they will know exactly who goes where for rugby and from what primary school because that’s where their own interest is.
Kids move and change schools outside of rugby for a whole host of reasons whether good or bad that we never hear of and its never analyzed as much (or at all) so maybe our own obsession with rugby is what’s fueling this entire ecosystem. We all have a vested interest and with it comes what high school rugby is today. That we can all take time out of our day to comment and debate like this on high school rugby also kind of proves this point.
@Ystervark (Comment #82)
He would be lucky to get €16k, which is peanuts in Paris, pocket money. Siya will look after him. I would have converted him to a hooker, perfect for that in the Britz mould…
@Rainier (Comment #80)
Classic! hahaha…..yes hundreds of EC/Border kids across all the KZN schools ;-). In a good year DPHS would hold its own against any primary side
@Ystervark (Comment #82)
Reports are that Zuki signed a three year contract, being at a club like Racing, if he does not making it there another smaller club would give him a contract. Many ex players have gone to france playing in Pro D1 and D2 instead of staying in South Africa.
@Pamos (Comment #81)
Another myth about players moving to France straight out of school is that they get huge contracts. The average Espoir contract is about 16k Euro a year. Not going to go very far living in Paris on that.
Allmost all of the kids who went over at the end of 2019 ended up back in SA very quickly. After going from SA schoolboy hype to playing u23 rugby in front of 5 people in the mud…soul destroying stuff.
@Ystervark (Comment #79)
Oh apologies. But luckily he is making more money than most of us now.. haha. So all in all it was a good choice.
@Grasshopper (Comment #69)
Well, obviously at high school they play against the majority of their /13 team mates.
@Pamos (Comment #76)
He never played a single match for the 3rd team. Was between 1st and 2nd team. Same as he was at Glenwood.
He left because he was brainwashed by certain people that he is an 8 and not a wing.
@beet (Comment #74)
It is a hunting ground out there. I do not know if you have been to the under 13 DPHS festival? The amount of high schools out there talking to parents and the boys is freightening.. All the top high schools are there.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #72)
Hmm, I do not think that is Penzance doing. I have a feeling that boy is staying at DHS hostel and has a scholarship that DHS will pay for junior school. That is why Penzance is so strong. Atleast 4 or 5 boys in that Penzance u13 team are already staying at DHS.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #45)
I don’t know. Zuki was playing 2nd and 3rd team at Grey, that is why he left. I do not think that if he kept playing 2nds and 3rds he would’ve been where he is right now.
@beet (Comment #74)
To be fair both EC & KZN are kak places to live, these kids are just looking for a lifeline out of poverty. They must take what they can. Hendrickse brothers a case in point. SA isn’t an easy place to survive, survival of the fittest
@RuggaFreak (Comment #64)
I’m beginning to understand why four different KZN high schools will host u13 school rugby festivals this year. My guess is the offers made to the EC junior schools to partake must amount to very good cost saving / value.
The beauty of it is that QC and Westville are both quality sides and they will clash at Grey fest so we shall see.
@ForeverHorseFly (Comment #70)
Penzance already poached a Dale Junior star player at u12 level even
@ForeverHorseFly (Comment #70)
These outside of KZN Okes have no clue. KZN are never walkovers
DPHS didn’t have a strong team last year, in fact, Penzance Primary and Westville Senior Primary were the strongest teams and Penzance was undefeated locally. Penzance had 7 players in the u13 Craven week team, Westville 4 and DPHS only had 1 player. KZN also beat Border 24-3 at the u13 Craven week.
@Rainier (Comment #68)
Your point being what, DPHS lost to the two strongest Primary schools in SA by 60 when rugby is not the main sport at primary school in KZN. Selborne don’t pump any KZN schools at high school, in fact I’m usually quite confident of a win when KZN sides play Selborne, Queens or Dale. DPHS, Glenwood Prep & others have a decent rugby programme
@Grasshopper (Comment #67)
There is also a 60-10 loss to Grey Bloem and they won most of their matches against local schools. Kinda proves my point.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #64)
65-5, that is pretty good considering they don’t lose often, see their results on the Cape Tour, close win vs Wynberg and close loses to Rondebosch & SACS; chrome-extension://efaidnbmnnnibpcajpcglclefindmkaj/https://www.dphs.co.za/wp-content/uploads/bsk-pdf-manager/2023/07/Rugby-School-Results-28-July-2023.pdf
@beet (Comment #63)
Yeah, still young enough to make a proper mark BUT needs to be fitter and will probably play for France now. The Sharks really do need some other locks outside of Eben who plays a handful of games a year..
@RuggaFreak (Comment #64)
Obviously doesn’t translate to High School then ;-)
@Grasshopper (Comment #60)
Selborne beat Merchiston 82-0 and Durban Prep 65-0. I unfortunately can’t find Dale Junior results but they too posted huge scores if I recall correctly. I can’t paste this Mycomlink.co.za link but if you google how Selborne Primary did at DPHS festival you should find it
@Grasshopper (Comment #61)
Size aside, he was one of the most talented schoolboy players I have seen on a rugby field. Even as a Sharks u19 player he had an amazing skillset.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #57)
This has happened through the ages. In the 90’s Guy Mumford at Westville was about 175cm and 90kg at u13 and could run 100m in 11secs, he ran rings around all of KZN. He sprinted and hurdles for KZN u13, by matric he was the same size and an average flank, didn’t make representative sides. He was also too short for the Open hurdles so ran a few relays. Boys caught up and surpassed him. He went on to play USA rugby at centre I think…..
@beet (Comment #59)
Agreed and JJ van der Mescht is a classic example of a kid with massive talent (excuse the pun) but relied on his size too long. He had pace, hands, ball skills, height, weight….everything. He didn’t have a work ethic and now is in Paris probably at 150kg and lumbering around the field….hoping he wakes up soon…
@RuggaFreak (Comment #56)
Facts and links please. DPHS feeds DHS, Michaelhouse, Clifton, Kearsney & Hilton, so must be OK. Same with Highbury & Glenwood Prep etc. I doubt it was cricket scores. KZN U13 usually win half their games. Unless there is a serious age issue in EC/Border.
@Ystervark (Comment #53)
I have met a few people who work in pro rugby and specialise in scouting and contracting school leavers for the big unions’ junior HP programmes.
All of them all point to character as being a main ingredient for success after school.
Based on your experience and relative to your feedback, do you believe its possible as a mentor/coach/manager/parent to change a youngster’s character from one that is unmotivated to do the hard work involved to make it as a pro into someone who has that self-determination / self-disciple to succeed? Or from your experience is this a decision a player has to arrive at on his own? And what are the chances that a young player makes a 180 turn if he’s on the self-destruct track?
@RuggaFreak (Comment #57)
He was at Breidbach, then Dale Junior. Might have also been at somewhere before Breidbach too.
@Rainier (Comment #51)
@Ystervark (Comment #53)
WOW!Thank you for these details. I remember seeing a picture of Zuki playing for the Grey 15A team and was shocked at the size of him, seems like he had an early grow spurt as he probably was 1.73m as a 15 year old which is tall. Age mates passed him height wise, and I too don’t see how he could be an 8th man with that height, he is low on body fat and all muscle hence just weighing 91kg. Is Zuki a Dale Junior product? Very reckless of him to dropout with no matric. This will not end well unfortunately. Zuki peaked early and we’ve seen many like him, I hope I’m wrong.
@Rainier (Comment #51)
Dale Junior and Selborne Primary toured KZN and put cricket scores on the Durban Schools,huge gap in terms of quality
@Ystervark (Comment #53)
Wow that was very interesting to hear the details of the story. Like you say very sadly could leave him on a road to nowhere. Also shows how boys develop. He was probably a similar size in Grade 8 and 9 to Matric, which is why he was so devastating a ball carrier in the junior age groups. By Matric and beyond the boys have grown and now he can’t just run over players anymore. He is still really powerful and explosive, but without the right work ethic and dedication to a position be may end up nowhere. Sad
@Ystervark (Comment #53)
That old saying ,hard work always beats talent if talent does not work hard seems to apply here….Cheslin Kolbe being an excellent example of talent working extremely hard
The Zuki Tom Saga encapsulates everything that is wrong with modern school boy rugby – agents, social media, win at all costs.
As per one of the previous comments asking how he ended up at Grey from Northwood – he had friends in the Grey PE u14 side and contacted the u14 coach at the time asking if there was an opportunity to come back to the Eastern Cape as he was not happy in KZN.
He came to Grey and performed well in a very good junior side, which is where the hype he started to receive from NextGen etc started. He signed with his first agent at the beginning of his u16 year.
During this time a lot of people with a lot of experience in rugby were asking questions regarding PED’s as well age age verification. The videos and photos of him in the gym as a 14 and 15 year old are very suspicious to say the least.
At the end of 2021 the coaching staff assessed where he was as a player. Zuki, depite all the muscles you see is actually not that big. He is an exceptional ball carrier, but does not like other aspects of the game. That coupled with his height (around 173cm – not a line out jumper) led the coaching staff to believe that his ball carrying talents would be better utilised with him in the backs.
Zuki himself understood the thinking, and seemed quite keen at first. He even had 1 on 1 mentorship with Mzwandile Stick who game him drills he could do on his own and was constantly asking for feedback on his development. But another problem was emerging – he didn’t like training. He had been hyped up into such a superstar on social media he thought he could just chill on the sidelines with “a niggle”, but be available to play on the weekend. Which sounds very similar to what would happen at Glenwood.
So Zuki started the 2022 season with it explained to him clearly that he would play a couple of 2nd team games on the wing first to get more game time in the position before being exposed there at 1st team level. He started the season well, scoring a try a game in his new position. Then after 1 sub par performance against KES he told the coaching staff he refused to play wing anymore.
Which was fine, but he thought he would walk into the first team the next week as a loose forward without knowing any of the plays or line out calls. So he was not happy because he had to work his way back up as a loose forward. He was named to start against Maritzburg College on the Monday at Saints fest. He pulled out “sick”. He was on his way to Durban a few days later.
Schoolboy rugby circles are very small – people talk. Zuki was “offered” by his 2nd agent (who he signed with while still under mandate with the first) to at least 4 other schools before Glenwood took him.
Once at Glenwood he played most of his rugby for the 2nd team and didn’t walk into the KZN Craven Week side like he thought he would.
Then all of a sudden he’s plucked from nowhere to play in the u18 international series for SA A. But big whispers were happening behind the scenes. “How did he get in?”…A source veeeeery close to the SA Schools/u18 set up had told me before the time that certain members of the selection panel were pushing for him so hard that it almost certainly looked like a bribe or something had been paid.
Come matric year at Glenwood – same story. In the team, out the team, 2nd team, injured. Side show after side show. Dropped out of school. No matric.
Now people are saying how he was “scouted” by Racing. While I don’t have conclusive proof am 99% certain that Zuki was an add on with Kolisi’s deal. Zuki is best friends with Siya’s brother after all and had spent a lot of time with the family. Today he was even announced as signing with RocNation (agency number 3). They clearly know what they are doing in rugby, just look at whats happening in Durban.
So off Zuki goes to France – signed as a loose forward. Day 1 rocked up: 173cm 91kg. Sorry bud, you’re a wing now!!!
I really hope it works out for him because it is not his fault what has happened. He has had poisonous people in his ear from a young age looking for their own personal gain while not looking after Zuki’s best interests. Through this he has also not learned how to stay and fight for his place – will just up and leave at the drop of a hat if things don’t go his way. But if rugby doesn’t work out for him then what? Who will look after him? Or will he end up back in King Williams Town in 2 years with not even a matric to his name. Time will tell…
#PALMA43
I think that moat of us can agree that this seemingly pro era of High School rugby comes at a cost both for the schools, local communities, parents and young boys being ‘traded’ by their parents with their best intentions at heart. I dare say that it has gone too far. Personally and many oldboys from various schools I know would happily forefit a few wins to see the ‘son off’ or ‘cousin too’ someone that’s either a old boy or locally based. It overspill to the debate about age…. as it stands there more exposure in a post matric vs. Trying Your luck as a 19-20 year old in Kimberly for a year. It’s gone too far
Hope Selborne and all other EC schools finds a way forward. EC definitely needs a functional Curry Cup team for starter
@Grasshopper (Comment #50)
That is just not true. My limited exposure to KZN primary schools rugby is that your top teams will get clobbered by teams like Grey Primary, Worchester Primary, Garsfontein Primary and Kenmare. As well as a host of WC and Southern Cape schools.
@Rainier (Comment #48)
Maybe that is true BUT our rugby playing primary schools are pretty strong, DPHS, Highbury, Westville, Glenwood Prep, Merchiston, Penzance etc could all hold their own vs any other prep in the country. Soccer is the core sport at primary school though in gov schools. We have talent in KZN, just most start rugby later un U14….so have catching up to do….
@RuggaFreak (Comment #47)
He barely played at Glenwood, trying to keep himself injury free for the trial at Racing. When he did play he wasn’t as impactful as before, could be he wasn’t as big as before OR holding back. Him being at Glenwood was a holding strategy, close to Sharks and big wig administrators. Our most infamous EC/Border recruit was Siyabonga Tom, what a mess that was and Payi at DHS…..
I respect the rugby traditions at the KZN schools, but the rugby culture in the PD communities is just not even close to being comparable.
If you travel through rural communities/townships in the Eastern, Southern and Western Cape the youngsters are playing rugby in the afternoons at home. I have never seen this in any of the other provinces and I have worked extensively in all of them.
It opens up a much wider talent pool and it is a fact of life that some of this talent will end up in traditional rugby schools.
@beet (Comment #46)
Exactly. Don’t think it had anything to do with Glenwood
@RuggaFreak (Comment #45)
Even more importantly, Zuki has a close bond with Siya Kolisi who is also at Racing.
@Pamos (Comment #40)
I have to disagree in him moving to Glebwood gave him exposure to move to France. Zuki was the NextGen player of the year while he was at Grey I suspect that’s when he was scouted by Racing and they knew about his relationship with Kolisi. Zuki at Glenwood was not that good for me
@Pamos (Comment #39)
But if you good enough in the EC and you attend Selborne, Dale, Grey High etc you will never be overlooked, you’ll definitely get signed by a big union
@KatzRugga (Comment #30)
Yes you are right, I should clarify myself. There have been issues in the past where Selborne have struggled, especially at the primary school, where they have had their talent taken by schools in kzn, there was an incident where a Selborne primary coach who transfered to Hilton College and took a few Selborne primary boys with him. For the coed high schools it’s even worse, the likes of Hudson, Grens and even Port Rex face issues of our kids being recruited on a yearly basis. A few years back we (Port Rex) lost 2 boys to Maritzburg College. Most of my evidence per say is what I have experienced at Port Rex as well as information from word of mouth from the surrounding coed schools and Selborne
@Pamos (Comment #39)
Yea mate that is a problem that needs a whole other discussion….
FREE SCHOOLING @BEET
You regrettably are spot on here. It has gone crazy in the aim to keep up and become sports academies. Although some KZN schools are already pulling back a little and offering a combination of bursaries academies/sport & financial assist. We are back the truth where a Headmasters job is both easier and safer if their rugby team is winning & when parents decide on schooling they get caught up in all this. Possibly overlook how some boys theres onmy at a school for sport can become a ‘educational burden’ Some schools might even have a decent pass rate & smaller classes as a added bonus- sad irony intended!
@RuggaFreak (Comment #33)
And then move to Glenwood which has now given him the exposure to be playing at Racing in France
@Smallies (Comment #18)
I agree with you on one part. The rugby culture in the Eastern Cape is massive, that is why KZN schools raid the Eastern Cape for talented players, but why would players stay in the Eastern Cape if Border and EP Kings are not going to give those players the exposure they deserve.
@beet (Comment #12)
I agree with you with regards to Selbourne, they are lucky enough though to be the only boys school in East London. They had a really good under 13A team this year and have kept the top two players in that team. Time will tell when Grey play Selborne as that has always been a very competitive fixture all round. Grey High do rarely give bursaries to Grey Junior kids as most parents are Old boys and would not dare send their kids anywhere else.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #33)
Zuki might have been in NW grade 8 with Lii Bester, who moved to Maritzburg College. Effectively they lost two SA u18 representatives – both game-breakers with ball-in-hand.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #33)
I don’t have any inside info on that, not sure. The NW u14A team he was part of were very good and he was a very sizable lad at that level. They had a great season. Sure many spotted him. I assume he was from the EC originally so maybe an easy sell to get him to move back home? I could be wrong.
@beet (Comment #31)
I didn’t want to mention race but a friend of mines son was offered a partial bursary at Glenwood for being ‘white’, the school has changed demographics that much. He reckons the school is now representative of the countries population. As someone said traditionally the Indian kids play cricket and hockey. Basketball has obviously exploded too as did soccer/football. Glenwood a once powerhouse in swimming is last in every gala and waterpolo is poor. I also think Xhosa boys are more into rugby, hence ‘raiding’ the EC and Border regions. It just goes along the lines of the demographics of the province. Traditionally coloureds love their rugby hence the WP ‘culture’ for the game as mentioned here too. Unfortunately in SA things do sometimes go down the race lines, it’s part of the culture….
@Palma (Comment #16)
A bit silly though from Selborne Primary touring with an unbeaten team to KZN.Lost so many boys to diffrent KZN schools
@Skywalker (Comment #28)
How did Zuki Tom move from NW to Grey High? Asking out of curiosity
LOL! No ways KZN that poaches EC talent has a deeper rugby culture and tradition than the EC! No ways, EC loses talent and still holds their own with no major rugby franchise.
@KatzRugga (Comment #30)
A message I received from an educator in KZN a few days back:
“… entitlement amongst parents has drastically increased over the last 2-3 years.
In KZN if your is a half decent sportsman in Grade 7 there is an expectation that he will get free schooling in high school.”
So the KZN market related starting point for a sportsman is 100% free! If Selborne cannot or do not want to match that, they have an increasingly hard battle to win. In a lot of these instances, even when parents can afford the fees at the good local high school, the status attached to an material financial offer from an interested cross the provincial boundary lines school seems to brainwash them.
#16PALMA
I’ve noted Your comment a few times over about KZN schools ‘raiding the EC/Border’ and as a result Selborne is struggling. I do admire Your clear passion for Selborne and frustration with recent years results. But why not give us some stats to back Your ongoing allegations or go find out what it is that KZN schools has on offer that Selborne doesn’t? Look for the Why? Same reason a person from Natal could moan that all our schoolboys goes to university elsewhere ask KZN, as it stands, doesn’t have much to offer after High school in regards to the combination of good education and rugby. So fingers crossed for a successful Varsity team in Years to come. Further and maybe a more straightforward answer. Farming communities are getting smaller as farms get bought up by neighbours and become more ‘industrial’ this hurts smaller communities not just in EC but globally and also, as a KZN example, near Vryheid, Newcastle etc where Pioneer used to be a decent rugby schools. This is no longer the case as numbers of families simply has become a lot less outside urbanised areas. Rather ask at the annual Selborne AGM what they, or You, can do to attract boys and their families to their fantastic facilities that beams with history and tradition- because others schools successful do so! In good spirit.
@Skywalker (Comment #27)
I think this is the crux of the matter….
In terms of university, the reality is thousands of KZN matriculats now study in the Cape after school. Stellies,UCT and Tuks in Pretoria are now almost automatic choices for many. This impacts the likes of UKZN. Many who stay in Durban will go to Varsity College due to location and avoidance of riots and nonsense at UKZN. Thankfully they have now cracked it into Varsity Shield and have won their first 2 games well. So I think this will be a massive boost for KZN rugby boys to stay and study in Durban rather then leave.
NW alone has about 8 Old Boys starting in Varsity Cup teams. 3 scored tries on Monday night alone. Some are former Craven Week players and contracted to WP or Lions. If those boys all stayed and played for UKZN it would make a big difference.
Something to note about KZN is we have the largest Indian population outside of India. Traditionally they do not play rugby, so that’s a large portion of each school who simply don’t play the game. Hence often needing rugby boys from elsewhere. Also hockey has grown from a sideline sport to a very professional and high profile game and boys choose between the two. KZN regularly have some of the best teams in SA each year across all age groups, so again they need to go find the rugby boys often from elsewhere.
@Grasshopper (Comment #25)not doubting the history of rugby in KZN just saying the Eastern cape has a deeper rugby culture and history across all population groups and schools that KZN do not and proparbly never will have…only the Western cape beats the Eastern Cape in this regard
@Smallies (Comment #23)
No chance!! Maritzburg College played vs Hermannsburg on the 8th of October 1870. Michaelhouse, DHS and Hilton started in the late 1800’s. Glenwood joined the group in 1910 and have been playing since. Glenwood have played College over 150 times since. The rugby history is far superior to the Vaal and close to EC. College, DHS and Glenwood have always put out around 20 to 30 teams a year and have very unique warcries and traditions. In fact, the tradition of playing at 3pm in the afternoon is a KZN thing. I found it weird in the Cape, this whole 1st team at midday thing, less build up.A Hilton vs Michaelhouse, DHS vs College, Glenwood vs College or DHS can get up to 8,000 spectators and are very special events.
@beet (Comment #22)
All good mate 👍 👌
@ForeverHorseFly (Comment #21)
You’re using to many big words….just say mate you’re talking shit…anyway I get your point…You’ll have to do better unfortunately to change my mind ,I will always ramain of the opinion that the Eastern Cape schools have a much richer and deeper rugby history than those of KZN
@Smallies (Comment #20)
Sorry my bad
@Smallies (Comment #20)
Your comments are based purely off recency bias…schools like Maritzburg College and DHS have been playing rugby for well over 100 years and have had many a great team’s which competed with the top schools of those times so to say KZN schools don’t have a deep and rich rugby history is disingenuous based purely of what is happening more recently with player movements.
@beet (Comment #19)
Now before I comment please remember that my English was allready used up at 06h00 this morning and that Im currently heavy into my overdraft English….
Ok by tradition I mean as in a strong rugby playing tradition nit tradition as what we get in most older schools ,some of the oldest interschools games are in fact in the Eatern Cape Dale vs Queens …Queens vs Selborne and so on.
I just dont think that KZN schools have quite the deep running rugby roots schools in the Eastern Cape has….thats why KZN schools tend to raid the Border schools in particular,I hope this makes sense to you
@Smallies (Comment #18)
I could agree on the rugby culture. The Eastern Cape is blessed that a large percentage of its three main races groups have rugby as a first love. In KZN only one of the three main race groups has a similar high percentage. Within that one KZN group maybe more of a passion for watching the sport than playing it after school. Also pre S&C science etc, the Natal coastal folks were generally physically smaller than plattelanders which probably played a part in their decision to pursue the sport after school. I know a top rugby agent who once told me he never ever liked to have KZN private school kids on his books because they always choice study over rugby after school and as you might know, half of the KZN top league consists of private schools now.
I wanted to say something about the traditional English-speaking university vs the Afrikaans ones in term of the time frame of transformation but then Wits from Jozi who are doing reasonably well in the VC so far, may have undergone the same changes at the same rate as KZN’s tertiary campuses and they still have decent rugby (would be good to hear someone’s view on the difference between Wits and UKZN).
WRT schools in KZN and traditions, I respectfully disagree. Traditions are evident in just about every school in KZN and are particularly strong and numerous in the boarding schools, often directly proportional the size of the boarding establishment in relation to the whole school.
@Palma (Comment #16)my honest opinion is that KZN just dont have the rugby culture that the Eastern Cape and Border has,they don’t have the traditions of Queens Selborne Muir and so on….it reflects in their lack of quality varsity teams also
@Roger (Comment #15)
A friend in teaching said the old Model C schools only get enough money from the gov to pay 20 teachers and these schools need 60. Fees sort of just cover that. OBs must be funding the professional coaches etc…..that is hard to maintain as the cost of living increases for all….
@beet (Comment #14)
Selbornes rugby has struggled because of our primary school being raided by kzn schools. Boggles my mind how schools with 500 more boys than Selborne are struggling to find there own local talent.
yes, area or location is a factor, but if I were to draw a parallel with KES, Jeppe and St Johns in JHB, the same factors apply. St Johns is private and there is a lot more money in JHB – however, KES and Jeppe have massive old boy support – without it, both schools would be battling.
@Rainier (Comment #13)
Thanks Rainier. Your details confirm that Grey has put a plan in place to counter the weak u13A of 2023 by going outside their feeder area. They will probably be able to return to their junior school as the source of quality players in future.
The KZN high schools are taking a great interest in the quality players out of Selborne’s main feeder school. What do they do if they are not prepped to respond like Grey has?
@beet (Comment #12)
Verkenner will not be a feeder school for Grey High each year – they had an excellent /13 side last year which attracted attention. Verkenner is much closer to Framesby than to Grey. I believe Grey manage to retain most of the Grey primary boys, who together with Sunridge are the two strongest primary schools in PE. Many of the Sunridge boys go to Framesby and Pearson has Summerwood as a feeder school.
@Pamos (Comment #9)
I’m interested in Grey HS and Selborne.
From what I understand Grey u13A didn’t have the best of seasons in 2023 and so Grey recruited well from Verkenner to improve their u14A for 2024. So it comes across as being proactive but I understand that junior school relationships are a little more delicate in the EC than in some other parts of SA.
I’m told that Selborne steers clear of sports bursaries, which in the face of the KZN threat to their feeder school, is risky. Part of the reason why I believe the KZN schools are in this rugby arms race is to make sure they don’t get left behind altogether (finances then academics, sport, cultural offering). The fear is that if they do, they may never recover. So in that sense Selborne is running a risk if they do not try to be proactive like Grey HS.
@Pamos (Comment #6)
I hope you are right. Glenwood have just appointed Springbok Heinke Van der Merwe as head of recruitment so maybe he can attract better sports kids. I do think the new head is trying his best with limited funds. Another reason is many old boys have left SA, including myself. We had a 25th Reunion where out of 220 boys in my year (1996), over 50 are in Australia, 30 in the UK, 20 in NZ, 10 in Canada & about another 20 spread around. OBs send their sons there although some more wealthier ones go private. The matric paper isn’t worth what it’s written on anymore. So it’s a bit of a perfect storm really. Get OBs engaged, fly the head to meet us & we will help. I would be willing to put £50 a month into a pot, not a lot but it would all add up…
@KatzRugga (Comment #8)
I have lived in Durban and have been to all these games between the schools and primary schools. One very different thing is that the top High Schools do not have a primary school. So if your local is maybe a radius of 10km lets say. We can start at Glenwood as a point, in that 10km radius you have Westville boys, DHS,Northwood, Clifton all can hold their own on the rugby field. How do you target your ‘local’ boys?
@Wyvern (Comment #7)
The primary schools around PE and surroundings are probably the best in the Eastern Cape. Grey used to and still does get them to come to Grey, because of the history and of course the hostel. Now with Pearson building a strong rugby program and a hostel, Framesby retaining the kids from Sunridge/Charlo/Verkenner and talks of a hostel(but that has been the talk for the past 10 years). I think in a few years Pearson is going to have regular fixtures against Grey which could draw boys to Pearson. Haldane Pienaar is the right person to drive sports as Pearson, they are already a well-established academic school. You can throw Kingswood into the mix but a lot of the parents in PE can’t afford to send their kids there from grade 7, I know Kingswood does not give out scholarships until grade 10 maybe, I might be wrong but it seems like that has they always bolster their team after under 16.
@7GREYHIGH & GLENWOOD
Glenwood. I think they missed a trick when they were at their best. A KZN school, as an example, should always, in my opinion, strive to be exactly that. A school for local boys mostly. With a long term view in mind this is what give any set up their core of local based Old Boys and people who return Saturday after Saturday.
A couple of schools in KZN needs to learn from this as it will do them well for the future. A Old Boys from far away recruited into grade 11 is unlikely to become a driver for local events going forward.
Maybe with the above in mind more schools would see what’s right in from of them I hope. I means local tier 2 schools and primary schools. Although it’s always needed to bolster a few positions from outside as schoolboy rugby has hit a near professional era- regrettably
@Pamos (Comment #6)
That’s an interesting view re Grey PE. Where would these boys be going in the future if not Grey? Difference maybe to the Glenwood case is that there are other alternatives in Durban, less so the case in PE.
@Grasshopper (Comment #5)
I understand your statement and agree with you that Glenwood is not in the right area anymore, like a lot of schools they rise and they fall. One could say the same at Grey High School in Port Elizabeth. There is so much talk and predictions that they will not be No 1 in the Eastern Cape. 5 years ago that would never be the case, all the other schools would have been fighting for second place.
I think the Glenwood coaching structure and rugby program is overlooked by many from the “outside” as you said Glenwood is not in the best area at all but they are still competing with all top schools. I think Covid hit their recruitment, but I remember that last years under 14A side was really good and only lost a couple of games. So maybe we see a rise in the lower age groups that bid well for the future of Glenwood.
@RuggaFreak (Comment #4)
The surrounding area decline and migration of people up the North Coast and to Hillcrest. Families that used to live in the area have moved to safer estates in Ballito, North Coast and Hillcrest/Highway areas so no longer sending their kids there. The demographics/social-grade of the school have changed drastically in the past 25 years. Also, funds are tight so limited offering of bursaries and scholarships to attract the best kids. In the past Glenwood offered up to 50 of these BUT I’m guessing this has reduced drastically. Also, the school have not won over Old Boys yet to help fund this where other schools have engaged this group better. Hopefully the school can turn this around in the coming 5 years. I would say generally Glenwood was stronger than usual from 2000 when it got very professional in set-up and when poaching etc and age checks where more prevalent. Now, it’s a free for all, so other schools are getting those top kids. Say in 2010 Glenwood would get 50 great athletes from the best primary schools in the country to now just a handful. Other schools have caught up and I think schools with bigger Boarding Establishments are getting those kids and building depth in their sports….
@Grasshopper (Comment #3)
Good day sir, as an eastern caper nothing shocks me more than the “demise” of a well respected powerhouse like Glenwood, what has lead to it?
Eish, doesn’t bode well for the year ahead. Thank goodness Grey Bloem and Affies are no longer annual fixtures. Thank goodness we have more Tier 2 type of schools like Rustenburg, Noordheuwel etc. Scared of the Drostdy fixture at WildeKlawer. Hoping Glenwood gees keeps the scores respectable across the year. We really should have Chris Cloete on our side plus Teddy who’s at DHS. How the mighty have fallen :-(
@Pamos (Comment #1)
A difference might be that last year it felt like Glenwood were underachieving based on the players they had and this year anything they get out of the season may contribute towards an opinion of overachievement.
I think it’s massive for two schools of this caliber to play each other this early as preseason to see where they stand with their goals. With the results that Westville had last year and the new recruits that have joined them, I expect them to be top 2 in KZN behind Hilton. Glenwood loves the underdog badge so maybe this year they will surprise some people and some teams. We can put our mind back to the last game of the season last year where they beat Martizberg College.